Thoughts on the new Burrower?

[Saytkl77]

If it could fill its own traps, it could actually do quite well as an ambusher. It could burrow into their supply lines, plant traps, and then ambush groups of marines when they step on them.

Its T3 epic-moment equivalent of a crusher crashing through 5 marines sending them flying, or a prae spraying down 5 marines who then get slashed, or a ravager delimbing a squad of marines, would be 5 marines charging into a pile of mines, then it jumps out and slashes them.

[LittleBlast]

I think the proper balance would be boilers/praes to be able to "fill the burrower" so that the burrowers cant make infinite backline traps and still have to come back every so often for a refill

[Frans_Feiffer]

I think the proper balance would be boilers/praes to be able to "fill the burrower" so that the burrowers cant make infinite backline traps and still have to come back every so often for a refill

I think allowing it to fill it’s own traps would be cool, but limit it to where it can only have say 3 or so active at a time. Maybe with every evo give it more traps it can have down at any given time. That in my mind would keep it balanced, but then again that’s just my thought on the matter.

[Madventurer]

Now that tunnels and resin holes are part of a burrower's job, it really feels like you should have one. Not because a burrower is good, but because xenos are being forced to take one to get the support utility they need.

This is also a nerf to carriers and hivelords since they now lack a large portion of their utility on their own, and especially carrier requires a burrower to use at full potential.
Carriers also now have nothing to do but sit around if there's no burrower or the burrower is not making holes.

And I agree with what was said before: Burrower is T2 that takes a T3 slot. Not a T3 in any other way, the abilities do not justify the T3 requirement.

[GoliathTheDespoiler]

what if we like, made the hivelord a t3 instead of the burrower?

[Butterrobber202]

The Burrower kinda stole its powers from other aliens, therefore making them less useful, but not making the burrower useful enough on its own. Because the Carrier's hole power worked well with its kit. With the Burrower, it takes way more time and cooperation then if it was just one xeno.

[Saytkl77]

I think the proper balance would be boilers/praes to be able to "fill the burrower" so that the burrowers cant make infinite backline traps and still have to come back every so often for a refill

They can still make infinite traps though, just slower. You could achieve the same outcome by setting its plasma regen to a certain level, without screwing the burrower if no one has evolved to prae/boiler, which happens alot on the 50-80 player rounds.

[Drackarus]

I think allowing it to fill it’s own traps would be cool, but limit it to where it can only have say 3 or so active at a time. Maybe with every evo give it more traps it can have down at any given time. That in my mind would keep it balanced, but then again that’s just my thought on the matter.

Yeah, that would force burrower's players to be more tatical, because on the two ( or three, can't remember ) rounds I played on Ice Colony as xeno, the burrowers teamed up and filled the hallways with 300 gas mines! Buuuut they didn't even got used, because on those rounds, the marines didn't descent to the underground. With that said, I don't think that their bomb limitation should be that low, starting with with four at the young level, all the way up to then or ten or fifteen on ancient level.

[JacksonDee]

I've played a lot of rounds with burrowers as both marine and Xeno, and I think they need some more abilities or better stats to make them a viable T3. As a marine, their traps are esspecially easy to notice, and I've never died or been injured in the slightest by a Burrower. And as a Xeno they feel like a waste of a slot, where we could have another Praetorian giving pheromones, or a boiler covering chokes. Bottom line, give them some love, I like the concept!

[blingx3]

The old system for tunnels and traps was good, why change what's good ?
When the traps were removed from the carrier, it sucked the joy out of the cast.

[FGRSentinel]

Wait, the Carrier was hamstrung to make the Burrower? Is here some sort of logic behind that decision?

[Butterrobber202]

Wait, the Carrier was hamstrung to make the Burrower? Is here some sort of logic behind that decision?

ah you see, there wasn't any. Its generally not great game design to steal powers from an already well-designed and functional caste, since it kinda clotheslines them.

[spookydonut]

It was done when I consolidated traps into one type.

[kastion]

It was done when I consolidated traps into one type.

Are you going to buff the carrier in any way to make up for it being nerfed?

[GoliathTheDespoiler]

Are you going to buff the carrier in any way to make up for it being nerfed?

Last I heard something is being done. Might be something to do with throwing? Not sure.

[xXen0zS1ay3rXx]

Last I heard something is being done. Might be something to do with throwing? Not sure.

Where did you hear that? I haven't seen nor hear a peep about making the pile of shit that is the burrower any less of the pile that it currently is until after the elusive and very undefined 'gameplay overhaul'

[immaspaceninja]

[kastion]

I wish that was the burrower atleast it would be a good boy. burrower sucks

[GoliathTheDespoiler]

Where did you hear that? I haven't seen nor hear a peep about making the pile of shit that is the burrower any less of the pile that it currently is until after the elusive and very undefined 'gameplay overhaul'

Spookster was answering some questions I had for him on discord, I don't recall his exact answer, but he did confirm something was being done to fix the hole carrier has now that traps are gone. I... THINK Dean also said it, but I can't confirm.

[LittleBlast]

Burrowers should get the sight that lets you see all the terrain and shit, like the Snipers have.

[misto]

ive noticed burrower is problematic especially on lowpop. while on middle population or high population it can maybe work out, on low pop queens are hesitant to spare the slots for a burrower. this also makes it extremely unlikely that a carrier will get invested in on lowpop because its functionality is impoverished due to now relying on a separate class for one of its better abilities.

i know you want to encourage working together, but it is important that the classes have good value in themselves so they can do work at low player population times of day

[Mancakefacepan]

First experience with the burrower and "new" carrier last night.

NOthing that hasn't already been said really. Abilities stolen from the carrier and hivelord and stictched together to make this new caste, which overall makes the xenos weaker than they otherwise would have been if the carrier kept it's traps, as it was pretty much self sufficient.

Making traps during combat was a great way to hold a choke as carrier, as marines never seemed to see it coming. Very useful on prison station with the narrow corridors. Sadly this tactic is completely unviable now.

Carriers should regain their ability to make hugger only traps, and burrowers should retain the ability to make hugger/gas holes and perhaps get an ability to allow actual xenos (T1 and 2) to hide on sticky resin for ambushes, At least then their utility is usefull to the majority of xeno castes instead of just two which are generally pre-occupied with more important things than filling traps behind a frontline.

[LittleBlast]

I like burrowers having the hivelords tunnel ability, but I think that Carriers should be able to make their own traps. I also think Burrowers should have some ways of solo-kill potential on marines, perhaps with an AoE Stun/Knockdown after surfacing from a burrow/tunnel, but adding some visual cue to make it not oppressive.

[shepa17191]

I played for him, I think this is the most useless class
1. There is no sense of traps if there is no good relationship with the Carrier
2. Tunnels are such a thing, from Hivelord more useful in this business

[Simo94]

The meta should be getting a burrower, making some traps real quick, then devolving it back to drone, lol.