Buckshot vs Slug: The final debate.

[misterjoper]

Um.

Stun + massive up front damage + bayonet follow up, and then a possible second shotgun blast.

If you have a BC attached, the damage is enough to one shot, or come close enough that the bayonet follow up will put your target into crit unless it's a durable T3 or ancient T2. Even without the BC, you can do enough damage to reliably kill any T1 and most T2s.

You WILL not Kill a Robust XENO hunter and Spitter(mature sentinel and higher) with Shotgun.He will either pounce you and slash you,and as you get up you will not be able to fire you buckshot before another pounce unless you got Gyroscopic stabilizer.Buckshot is not enough to KILL a YOUNG Hunter THIS VIDEO proves IT.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=daxKyfA ... utu.be.THE robust Hunter Just run away after he got buckshotted,and the Retarded one Let himself killed by me,that's the only reason i got him.

[XenocidalEnragement]

You WILL not Kill a Robust XENO hunter and Spitter(mature sentinel and higher) with Shotgun.He will either pounce you and slash you,and as you get up you will not be able to fire you buckshot before another pounce unless you got Gyroscopic stabilizer.Buckshot is not enough to KILL a YOUNG Hunter THIS VIDEO proves IT.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=daxKyfA ... utu.be.THE robust Hunter Just run away after he got buckshotted,and the Retarded one Let himself killed by me,that's the only reason i got him.

Could just be RNG. I've one-shotted and instagibbed a fair share of my Young and Mature Hunters with a gyroscopic shotgun loaded with buckshot. Dodging their pounces is easy enough on my end, although I have shot and critted a few mid-charge. I also two-shotted a completely okay Elite Ravager into critical, so.. go figure, I guess.

Ironically, I often got critted or outright killed by the acidic blood shower that came afterwards more than the actual xenos succeeding in salsafying me.

[Surrealistik]

You WILL not Kill a Robust XENO hunter and Spitter(mature sentinel and higher) with Shotgun.He will either pounce you and slash you,and as you get up you will not be able to fire you buckshot before another pounce unless you got Gyroscopic stabilizer.Buckshot is not enough to KILL a YOUNG Hunter THIS VIDEO proves IT.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=daxKyfA ... utu.be.THE robust Hunter Just run away after he got buckshotted,and the Retarded one Let himself killed by me,that's the only reason i got him.

#1: That's not an M37. Different shotguns have different damage profiles.

#2: Damage variance allows you to get one shots (at least hard crits) with point blanks vs Young/Matures with the M37.

#3: Yes, if he lands the pounce in a 1 v 1, you're probably not going to be in a good way unless you have Gyro (you should if at all possible). If he misses, you're golden; point blank + bayonet follow up (which you could not do) will crit a young hunter almost certainly. At range 2, yes, he has a chance to pounce away if you have no BC.

[MrJJJ]

You WILL not Kill a Robust XENO hunter and Spitter(mature sentinel and higher) with Shotgun.He will either pounce you and slash you,and as you get up you will not be able to fire you buckshot before another pounce unless you got Gyroscopic stabilizer.Buckshot is not enough to KILL a YOUNG Hunter THIS VIDEO proves IT.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=daxKyfA ... utu.be.THE robust Hunter Just run away after he got buckshotted,and the Retarded one Let himself killed by me,that's the only reason i got him.

Do your facts before linking "proof", check the video.

He fires point-blank the buckshot, notice how there is no additional buckshot? yeah thats the reason the hunter doesn't die, because a good marine doesn't POINTBLANK it, he just fires it one tile behind them since for some reason, pointblank with buckshot breaks it and it doesn't spawn additional buckshot, about 3 additional buckshots usually hit at that point at max, which will crit the young/mature hunters, hell it will even instant kill sentinels and runners without them going into crit.

You really should learn about the game more than argue with veterans who played this game for years and know it like the back of their hand.

[Crab_Spider]

Do your facts before linking "proof", check the video.

He fires point-blank the buckshot, notice how there is no additional buckshot? yeah thats the reason the hunter doesn't die, because a good marine doesn't POINTBLANK it, he just fires it one tile behind them since for some reason, pointblank with buckshot breaks it and it doesn't spawn additional buckshot, about 3 additional buckshots usually hit at that point at max, which will crit the young/mature hunters, hell it will even instant kill sentinels and runners without them going into crit.

You really should learn about the game more than argue with veterans who played this game for years and know it like the back of their hand.

I don't think you know what you're talking about here.

[MrJJJ]

I don't think you know what you're talking about here.

Says the man who can't be bothered to take his time to explain anything he says just to get some more posts

[Crab_Spider]

Says the man who can't be bothered to take his time to explain anything he says just to get some more posts

Hm. Using ad hominem to try and take an edge because he can't address the half assed statement. Like I said, you don't seem to understand what shotgun pointblank does, I'll leave it at that.

[MrJJJ]

Hm. Using ad hominem to try and take an edge because he can't address the half assed statement. Like I said, you don't seem to understand what shotgun pointblank does, I'll leave it at that.

Trying to sound smart when you are not. I love that, such a favorite attitude of mine, a requirement for working staff IRL (Not CM/SS13) sometimes in difficult situations, you would make a good Trump really.

[Crab_Spider]

Trying to sound smart when you are not. I love that, such a favorite attitude of mine, a requirement for staff sometimes in difficult situations, you would make a good Trump really.

I'm sorry?

[solidfury7]

I advise everyone stop arguing and personal attacks.


Stay on topic and stay civil.

[MrJJJ]

I advise everyone stop arguing and personal attacks.


Stay on topic and stay civil.

Done, he is on my foes list now.

Anyway!

Been starting to use slugs more frequently, with a certain combo of shotgun stock and forward grip (along with my free attachment of rail light and bayonet), so far its been kinda decent i suppose, i been managing to land hits most of the time but its been preety hard killing anything, even if i remove the shotgun stock i still had not much success, i been underestimating their damage for a while now, although it does make alot of xenos retreat, can't say much else really, i still think i would prefer a Pulse Rifle over them.

[Kesserline]

Too affraid to use both, because of the possibilities to FF the shit out a poor marine.

But, from what I have seen, understood and the little I tried :
- Buckshot = shortrange. Good against Xenos, as nearly all castes of Xenos want to CQC. Good burstdamage, and burstdamage is needed to kill Xenos, otherwise they can run.
- Slug = mediumrange. Good if you can't CQC, but recquire attachments to enhance accuracy. Better at targeting humans as they would not CQC naturally. Moreover, a single slug doesn't have enough burst damage to truly kill a Xeno on your own.

Any weapon I use, I enhance them so as to prefer burstdamage over anything (against Xenos), against a human : I'll prefer accuracy. The dilemna would be the same with the Buckshot/Slug situation.

[Surrealistik]

Yeah, I just want to clarify what I mean by point blank shots: not as in the literal mechanic of point blanking by clicking an adjacent xenu (which is bugged since it only shoots one buckshot, even though it has enhanced damage), but clicking the tile beyond.

[Voldirs]

I think, slugs are viable for Mk221 and custom shotgun, but for old good m37 buckshots have much more sense.

[Salty Ghost]

I think, slugs are viable for Mk221 and custom shotgun, but for old good m37 buckshots have much more sense.

Not even... you'd have to land most of the shots to kill anything (good luck with that without high accuracy attachments) and by that time you would already be long dead.
Just don't use slugs unless it's your last resort on zombies anything else is asking to be killed.

[Surrealistik]

Just going to put this here: https://gitlab.com/cmdevs/ColonialMarines/issues/1446

[Surrealistik]

https://gitlab.com/cmdevs/ColonialMarines/issues/1531

[Crab_Spider]

https://gitlab.com/cmdevs/ColonialMarines/issues/1531

...No. Just, stop while you're ahead.

[Marcus Jackson]

...No. Just, stop while you're ahead.

Why should he stop? Sure 7 tiles is a bit much, but at the very least he can make the suggestion, otherwise we've got people complaining: "Why are the slugs even in the vendor if they only cause broken bones, and xeno's don't get properly stunned?" Then those people will be putting in suggestions of their own, but those would be about removing slugs altogether to make way for more AP mags.

Its a shifting issue of balance, and suggestions like this help even it out.

[Surrealistik]

...No. Just, stop while you're ahead.

Or you can explain to me how you're wrong; I'm down to debate.

I think the stun duration could probably use a falloff scaling with distance, but yes, it should stun out to 7 tiles.

[OatzAndHoes]

Been playing a lot more hunter lately and it's given me a better perspective on shotgun use. The general strategy for a hunter dealing with a shotgunner is to either completely surprise him with an ambush while in stalking mode, or to bait the shotgunner into shooting early by faking a run at him. The only real counter to the first against a robust hunter is to stay in eyesight of other marines unless you are constantly switched on and eyeing possible ambush locations. Against the second tactic you just have to be better at waiting for a pounce to shoot if you've got cuckshot loaded, because if you fall for the bait and fire early a good hunter will pounce immediately. An alternative counter to the second tactic that I don't see as often is catching the hunter off-guard with a slug. 90% of hunters under elite will retreat immediately after getting hit with a slug unless they have another xeno or two as backup, which in that case you're probably fucked anyways if you're alone/in a group of 2. Personally I'm more afraid of slugs than cuckshot as a hunter.

tl;dr slugs are surprisingly effective at getting ambushing hunters to fuck off/stop running off alone

[misterjoper]

Barrel charger+Buckshot+point Blank=Insta Pain critted Ancient Sentinel(without warding).

[Solarmare]

If an ancient sentinel is letting a marine actually stand up for more than half a second the issue would be on them.

[misterjoper]

If an ancient sentinel is letting a marine actually stand up for more than half a second the issue would be on them.

Actually i was hiding in disposals,spamming my hailer,so he went to close disposals and started melting it,that's where i got him.Not Really that much of his fault.He did not expect that to happen,hell even i would have got my ass blasted if i was him.

[Heckenshutze]

Actually i was hiding in disposals,spamming my hailer,so he went to close disposals and started melting it,that's where i got him.Not Really that much of his fault.He did not expect that to happen,hell even i would have got my ass blasted if i was him.

That's survival.

And survival is winning.