Alien Colonial Diplomats, Enjoyment Vs Enforcement of the Rules.

[misterjoper]

To begin with, I am not looking for a fight here, I don't want this to go personal. IF i did, I would have made a staff report, i am here just to deliver the Message: "Guys It's wrong to ruin people's fun like this, we would rather you stopped doing that."
Secondly, I think we all would agree that Enjoyment of server is What matters the most . This is server focused on Enjoyment of players. As a staff member you ought to know that.
Thirdly, all the rules were made to make sure the game will be enjoyable. Seriosly come to think about it, Rules make sure someone does not ruin the Enjoyment of the round for other players, do they not?
And last thing, While I am kinda Infamous here on forums, I was clearly NOT ONLY about me having fun, and I speak on behalf of every person that was having fun during this event. Unless you lock this thread ( I beleive you are better than that) , people will comment on how they were enjoying this round up untill that point.
The player made diplomacy event took place on 11.11.2017. I even started recording it because I knew people would be having fun and this is not something you see everyday.
I would consider this event a high RP just because of how many people were involved and how much effect that RP had on the round. But whenever it was high RP or not it can be argued. But the fact that players were having a blast can be denied in any way.
So what if it was silly? So what if it looked stupid? 25+ people were enjoying it, including the important roles like b18 spec, surivor, colonist, lot's of PVT , majority of aliens, including the Queen. And if you think that aliens were acting friednly you are wrong, because it was diplomacy they Acted Polite and Diplomatic.

Anyway here is the Footage i've uploaded on You Tube , so you may have a better understanding of what it was like and why I decided to make a general discussion.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f99RUKAF-PU Part 1
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HAlXRUCMnlo Part 2

P.S. Remain Professional, no matter what happens
- Constantly stay cool. Regardless of what a player says to you do not act unprofessional and get angry with them.

[taketheshot56]

So im confused? You were the queen and tried to be friends with the marines?

Edit


Yea literally, you broke xeno rule #1, literally the first rule, lucky you did not get a xeno ban for this shittery.

[misterjoper]

So im confused? You were the queen and tried to be friends with the marines?

Edit


Yea literally, you broke xeno rule #1, literally the first rule, lucky you did not get a xeno ban for this shittery.

First of all you did not watch the evidence video, you just decided to atack me before conducting any investigation.
I was not the Queen,in fact I was The Pretorian that was Protecting the Queen during that event.And I was Mostly observing the event.
Were WERE NOT being best friends or pets with marines, were were being polite and diplomatic, Queen pushed her own terms. It's like USA negotiating a non-agresion pact with Russia.
Secondly If I deserve the Jobban then EVERY XENO that Participated in this event deserve a job ban/warning depending on the note history, according to your logic.

[taketheshot56]

First of all you need to take a chill pill pal, you decided to come here and air your salt out not me. There is literally no basis for this discussion thread, All I see in the video is you captioning and mocking the events that staff are taking. You go on to caption about how staff ordering you to capture the marines leads to low RP, no it doesn't plain and simple. Xenomorphs are not diplomatic creatures, if a hive of hosts invades their homeworld, they will kill/capture them all.

[misterjoper]

First of all you need to take a chill pill pal, you decided to come here and air your salt out not me. There is literally no basis for this discussion thread, All I see in the video is you captioning and mocking the events that staff are taking. You go on to caption about how staff ordering you to capture the marines leads to low RP, no it doesn't plain and simple. Xenomorphs are not diplomatic creatures, if a hive of hosts invades their homeworld, they will kill/capture them all.

The video shows that A lot of people were enjoying this round. The basis of the Discussion is that This a server focused on enjoyment of players and the enjoyment of players was ruined by Staff intervention. And i will not repeat the same points that were made in initiall Post. And I makes me salty when people make assumptions without any kind of investigation.
Link That proves that this is server FOCUSED on enjoyment of players viewtopic.php?f=57&t=5647
Staff Code of Conduct:
Preserve the RP and enjoyment of the server
- If a player breaks a rule, but increases the enjoyment of the server in general, (through roleplay or other such things) it can be overlooked. If no one admin helps (ahelp) a complaint, or seems to be complaining or taking issue with it, it may be best to let it go.
- We’re a server focused on the enjoyment of the players. As long as the players are having a blast and not every single rule is being broken, it’s okay to let some things slide here and there.
- Do not try to heavily influence the game unless it is for very good reasoning such as for an event, a player purposefully holding up the game, dishing out punishment for rule breaking (Examples: a commander killed a marine unjustly, a squad of marines are killing other marines for no reason, a queen is slashing every host known to man, aliens have stacked too many huggers) or other such things.

[yung bruh]

can tell this isn't gonna go well lol

[Challenger]

Ed Trevor is the only one not misRPing in that video and everyone bitches at him in LOOC for doing it, shame.

Rules lawyering your way around this being a combat rp server with a set playstyle for xenomorphs isn't and shouldn't gonna work. Aliens are incapable of any mass organized cooperation. I could see the Queen pulling back frontal attacks to feint, or using psychic whisper to lure the marines into a false sense of complacency, etc, but 20 minutes of standing around talking is pretty dumb to me.

[misterjoper]

Ed Trevor is the only one not misRPing in that video and everyone bitches at him in LOOC for doing it, shame.

Rules lawyering your way around this being a combat rp server with a set playstyle for xenomorphs isn't and shouldn't gonna work. Aliens are incapable of any mass organized cooperation. I could see the Queen pulling back frontal attacks to feint, or using psychic whisper to lure the marines into a false sense of complacency, etc, but 20 minutes of standing around talking is pretty dumb to me.

On the contrary, aliens ARE capable of mass organized cooperation, that's why Queen is there. Queen gives orders and everyone does so. Queen organises the hive and guides them in any way she sees fit. Seems like a mass organization to me. What you considered dumb, others considered as diplomacy RP and were enjoying it.

[Katsukai]

If a rule shouldn't apply cause a group of players is having fun but shits the overall quality of the server, then this server wouldn't made it this far. I bet lot of marines have ahelped cause the whole ordeal put them off from the usual experience in colonial marines. You are seeing this in pink glasses and assume everyone was enjoying this player created event.

[misterjoper]

If a rule shouldn't apply cause a group of players is having fun but shits the overall quality of the server, then this server wouldn't made it this far. I bet lot of marines have ahelped cause the whole ordeal put them off from the usual experience in colonial marines. You are seeing this in pink glasses and assume everyone was enjoying this player created event.

Well it's because BOTH marines and Aliens were stating in LOOC how they were enjoying this, as it can be seen in part 2. IF Ahelps were Made i'd rather see them here as an evidence. I have shown my evidence. If Marines were not enjoying this event they would have just started killing everyone. As for the aliens, they had to listen to the Queen BUT whoever caressed marines and had help intent on was clearly enjoying it as well. And This server is focused on enjoyment of servers, That's a fact!

[Challenger]

That's not what I'm talking about, ofc the aliens cooperate with themselves they're the same mind. They can't cooperate with anyone else on a mass scale. If they were placed into prisoner's dilemma situations they would be the "always defecter", who only sees cooperative impulses in others as weakness.

I could see the Queen potentially entering mass negotiations in bad faith, like to distract the marines while a flanking group of aliens advances, to destroy them. But actually negotiating in good faith is terrible RP on their part. You and looc squad might have "enjoyed it" but rules, atmosphere, and rp guidelines exist for a reason and the aliens and some marines in this case clearly broke them.

[Katsukai]

Well it's because BOTH marines and Aliens were stating in LOOC how they were enjoying this, as it can be seen in part 2. IF Ahelps were Made i'd rather see them here as an evidence. I have shown my evidence. If Marines were not enjoying this event they would have just started killing everyone. As for the aliens, they had to listen to the Queen BUT whoever caressed marines and had help intent on was clearly enjoying it as well.

They couldn't cause Command was pushing this peace agenda and some did attack and die for it, cause rest marines were afraid to help since they received orders from SLs and Command on ceasefire. It would have required a mutiny or admin intervention to get the round going normally. Whoever was CO on that round acted more like some star trek captain than a commander in a military organization, not to mention he started diplomatic relations without consulting high command.

[misterjoper]

That's not what I'm talking about, ofc the aliens cooperate with themselves they're the same mind. They can't cooperate with anyone else on a mass scale. If they were placed into prisoner's dilemma situations they would be the "always defecter", who only sees cooperative impulses in others as weakness.

I could see the Queen potentially entering mass negotiations in bad faith, like to distract the marines while a flanking group of aliens advances, to destroy them. But actually negotiating in good faith is terrible RP on their part. You and looc squad might have "enjoyed it" but rules, atmosphere, and rp guidelines exist for a reason and the aliens and some marines in this case clearly broke them.

Just because they have not try cooperating with anyone on mass scale does not mean they can't. I guees the statement that "We’re a server focused on the enjoyment of the players. As long as the players are having a blast and not every single rule is being broken, it’s okay to let some things slide here and there." also exists for a reason." RULES are made to PRESERVE fun and enjoyment of server." Seriosly prove me wrong on that. If server was not enjoyable nobody would have played here. Same goes for law exept it's not the enjoyment that would be the right word. I mean LAW is made for Human, and it's not like HUMAN was made for a law.

[misterjoper]

They couldn't cause Command was pushing this peace agenda and some did attack and die for it, cause rest marines were afraid to help since they received orders from SLs and Command on ceasefire. It would have required a mutiny or admin intervention to get the round going normally. Whoever was CO on that round acted more like some star trek captain than a commander in a military organization, not to mention he started diplomatic relations without consulting high command.

Well if you meet a Alien lifeform for the first time, and they are willing to make contact , would you try exterminating them or would you try to negotiate with them first? Commander is man of honour, he knows that his actions and his decisions have consequenses and can start war and EVERY sane being, even if that being is soldier DOES NOT wish war. WAR is bad and you should know it.

[Challenger]

I'm going to just wait for staff to reply. But again rules lawyering this is really isn't gonna work. This server is medium RP towards a certain atmosphere. 20 minute good faith negotiations between humans and xenos are simply not permissible.

Also it's a "hidden" enforced rule that Marines are supposed to be shooting xenos on first contact, they're very, very obviously the reason the colony is dark and look like the killingest bad guys in the universe. The server is simply built around combat between xenos and marines, I really don't see another way to put it.

[Katsukai]

Just cause there is a statement that they focus on player enjoyment, doesn't mean they will ever make events or let players make events that breaks the rules they set. You wouldn't see a mass ERP event cause players are enjoying it or admins letting people EORG, cause they are having fun shooting each other. This event shouldn't be an exception either.

[Katsukai]

Well if you meet a Alien lifeform for the first time, and they are willing to make contact , would you try exterminating them or would you try to negotiate with them first? Commander is man of honour, he knows that his actions and his decisions have consequenses and can start war and EVERY sane being, even if that being is soldier DOES NOT wish war. WAR is bad and you should know it.

You're talking about the alien universe, it isn't public knowledge humans have ever met any sentient lifeforms. Humans have always been afraid of the unknown and what do you think their first reaction would be when seeing Giger's Aliens? Or humans receiving telepathing messages on their head for the very first time, they would think they are going insane and they are having a nightmare seeing such ungodly creatures infront of them. Think realistically cause this is what Colonial Marines is about and how they want the experience to be immersive as possible.

[Steelpoint]

There are some cases of individual Xenomorphs "cooperating" with non-Xenomorphs, usually Humans. However all these scenarios are usually when the Xenomorph is forced into the situation, and the Xenomorphs universally make every effort to conclude or escape these circumstances, an example being Aliens Resurrection or the AvP 2010 video game, in the former the Aliens were forced to stop attempting to escape but only under force of harm, in the latter the Xenomorphs complies with basic instructions but only due to it being captured and tortured, and in fact the Xenomorph continually attempts to escape its position even while following instructions.

The only, ONLY, situation I've ever seen in any extended media where a 'large' hive of Xenomorphs is actively cooperating, and obeying complex orders, from a non-Xenomorph group AND are making no attempt to escape is from a recent Aliens v Predator comic series where a 'faction' of Predators use a complicated set of pheromones to protect themselves AND to allow the Predators to issue orders to the Xenomorphs as if they were a Queen.

Otherwise, Xenomorphs have only one thing in mind. The preservation of their species at all costs. Cooperating with any other entity willing has never entered their minds outside of a feint.

[misterjoper]

Just cause there is a statement that they focus on player enjoyment, doesn't mean they will ever make events or let players make events that breaks the rules they set. You wouldn't see a mass ERP event cause players are enjoying it or admins letting people EORG, cause they are having fun shooting each other. This event shouldn't be an exception either.

Alright I can see what you mean and I almost wanted to completly agree with you but...the ERP rule Actually has zero Tolerance policy and if Staff allows it, they will get in trouble with LAW. As for EORG, Staff has little time to investigate, whenever the People are having fun or griefing. And Delaying the round just to investigate will DELAY the start of the Current round. You See your examples have negative severe consequences while mine example does not have them, at least they are not severe. So they should not be threated equally.

[misterjoper]

There are some cases of individual Xenomorphs "cooperating" with non-Xenomorphs, usually Humans. However all these scenarios are usually when the Xenomorph is forced into the situation, and the Xenomorphs universally make every effort to conclude or escape these circumstances, an example being Aliens Resurrection or the AvP 2010 video game, in the former the Aliens were forced to stop attempting to escape but only under force of harm, in the latter the Xenomorphs complies with basic instructions but only due to it being captured and tortured, and in fact the Xenomorph continually attempts to escape its position even while following instructions.

The only, ONLY, situation I've ever seen in any extended media where a 'large' hive of Xenomorphs is actively cooperating, and obeying complex orders, from a non-Xenomorph group AND are making no attempt to escape is from a recent Aliens v Predator comic series where a 'faction' of Predators use a complicated set of pheromones to protect themselves AND to allow the Predators to issue orders to the Xenomorphs as if they were a Queen.

Otherwise, Xenomorphs have only one thing in mind. The preservation of their species at all costs. Cooperating with any other entity willing has never entered their minds outside of a feint.

Here is my point. Just because something did not happen before does not mean it can't happen in the future. It's pure logic. Otherwise creativity would not existed. Second point.It's the QUEEN who negotiates with marines, and Queen is MUCH more smarter and able to learn quickly than a usual xeno(dropship,lifts). She can understand how dangerous marines are and since she wants to preserve their species at all cost, I don't see why negotiation is not an option. I see aliens as intellegent species.
-Marines have gunz.
-Guns kill aliens. If you make Marines angry they will kill aliens.
-Queen does not want her children to die and "signs" a peace threaty.

[Jay Burns]

Maybe doing this once is fine as a one-off thing, but constantly doing this will probably net you a xeno jban, since it breaks rule 1, Act like a Xenomorph - You are not a pet or best friends with the marines. Talk like one. It is fine to use words like "medbay" and "shuttle". You can also replace "shuttle" with "metal bird" if you wish. Hivemind is the English translation of a Xeno's thoughts. However, keep it formal and realistic, but spouting memes constantly or disrupting others with them is not allowed and you will be banned.

[Heckenshutze]

Feweh already told you not to be stupid, don't push him off his limits. Regardless if your actions were based solely on the purpose of player enjoyment and was accepted by most of the marines doesn't make it acceptable and under the rules.

If I were admin by that time I'd have spawned mobs to attack you both and end the tom foolery

[spookydonut]

Doing this on 11/11 is actually quite fitting, but otherwise this is dumb.

[misterjoper]

Maybe doing this once is fine as a one-off thing, but constantly doing this will probably net you a xeno jban, since it breaks rule 1, Act like a Xenomorph - You are not a pet or best friends with the marines. Talk like one. It is fine to use words like "medbay" and "shuttle". You can also replace "shuttle" with "metal bird" if you wish. Hivemind is the English translation of a Xeno's thoughts. However, keep it formal and realistic, but spouting memes constantly or disrupting others with them is not allowed and you will be banned.

Well it's one-off thing, and would you really issue a xeno ban to EVERY xeno that participated in this event? I myself was just protecting the Queen from assasination attemps and ensured she was safe during the negotiations; I myself did not went crazy and started caressing marines like other xenoes did. The Queen herself acted polite and diplomatic, She did not aim to be friends, The Queen pushed her own terms, that every marine that crosses the river will be dead,in fact it was more of a threat. I don't see how this attitude will make you friends with marines. Basicly Aliens and Marines were signing a non-aggression pact. But that does not make them friends, at best it would make them neutral. Still now I see that many aliens went low RP and started careressing the marines during negotiations. Well that thing was wrong. Queen herself did not do that as I recall. So "You are not a pet or best friends with the marines." can be applied to those who started caressing marines. (Yeah it went super low rp from there.) .

Honestly if you tell me that Negotiations were done wrong, because aliens did not maintain discipline and started caressing marines, breaking the rule "You are not a pet or best friends with the marines.", then I would understand why it was wrong. I don't see anything bad in Negotiation itself. Xenoes just needed to maintain their Pride, right?

[Renomaki]

having watched the footage, the first minute I witnessed the queen murder a marine for flaming her, while his friends just stood there and did nothing...

I dunno if this was good RP, I don't think marines would willingly stand by and watch as a towering alien ripped their friend apart. How is that conducting diplomacy?