Talking about Specialists

[TicTac]

Specialists are probably the most contested role, but they unfortunately have the issue of only 2 of the specs being "Meta" right now. It's a mad rush to get to your vendor so you can beat out the other specs.

-Personally I feel like Grenadier could be improved by just simply letting them fire over people and window frames, right now, pretty much every Grenadier round ends when another marine walks in front of you as you fire.

-Sniper seems fine, though the starting ammo is annoying, it's almost always necessary to ask req for more ammo, a problem none of the other specs have as much. (Grenadier kinda has this issue.)

-Pyro is really strong, but really fun and rewarding, I'd say it's probably in the best spot.

-Scout seems just outshine sniper in every way, more ammo, better cloak ability, more killing power. I don't think it's too powerful, I just think it's too much better than others.

-Demo is rarely picked, it often misses, and has little killing power, it's just annoying to maneuver around your own marines, and not rewarding enough for having to do so.

What do you guys think?

[TastyCrabLegs]

This is an opinion that is gonna get some salt but here we go lads.

*Inhales*

The smart gunner role is far over powered and should not be its own thing separate from the specialist.
The smart gun is a crutch and TBH people often push / FF / treat the SG like he is some sort of shitcicle because there are atleast 2 to 4 of them every round.

The smart gun needs a major buff to damage and another debuff to movement speed.
Smart gunners need to be none shove-able by marines when in disarm or above because I'm sorry but Mass vs Mass.

SG needs to become the bane of Xenos again instead of some dipshit you can tank after mature.

*Squints at fellow ravs and even carriers*

TBH if I have a huge fucking gun with "Smart" bullets then I would assume these bullets would be like little tank rounds not some sort of shitty uncle to the SMG that hits harder but is still ultimately the catalyst to your demise.


TL:DR

SG needs to remerge with Spec class.
I'm a dick.
Raining on yall's parade

[HKO20006]

GL: nade spam don't refresh stun time, so you cant chain stun (anymore).

Sniper: a bit weak, consider the damage output.

RPG: a bit weak, consider the damage output. RPG used to counter Queen and Rav, now Queen can't be stun and Rav high stun resistance. Still work ok/well on T1/T2 though. Does nothing to Crusher, even AP.

Pyro: need to learn when not to fire so they don't hinder marine advance/counter attack.

[Sulaboy]

This is an opinion that is gonna get some salt but here we go lads.

*Inhales*

The smart gunner role is far over powered and should not be its own thing separate from the specialist.
The smart gun is a crutch and TBH people often push / FF / treat the SG like he is some sort of shitcicle because there are atleast 2 to 4 of them every round.

The smart gun needs a major buff to damage and another debuff to movement speed.
Smart gunners need to be none shove-able by marines when in disarm or above because I'm sorry but Mass vs Mass.

SG needs to become the bane of Xenos again instead of some dipshit you can tank after mature.

*Squints at fellow ravs and even carriers*

TBH if I have a huge fucking gun with "Smart" bullets then I would assume these bullets would be like little tank rounds not some sort of shitty uncle to the SMG that hits harder but is still ultimately the catalyst to your demise.


TL:DR

SG needs to remerge with Spec class.
I'm a dick.
Raining on yall's parade

In lore the gun is smart not the bullets. The gun used the same rounds as a pulse rifle, and the IFF capability just mean the gun will not fire if the target is wearing friendly identification. The only change I could see for smartguns is buffing their firing rate. I'd give my input on specialists, but I've never gotten the role due to its popularity.

[KaiserBlackwood]

Specialists are probably the most contested role, but they unfortunately have the issue of only 2 of the specs being "Meta" right now. It's a mad rush to get to your vendor so you can beat out the other specs.

-Personally I feel like Grenadier could be improved by just simply letting them fire over people and window frames, right now, pretty much every Grenadier round ends when another marine walks in front of you as you fire.

-Sniper seems fine, though the starting ammo is annoying, it's almost always necessary to ask req for more ammo, a problem none of the other specs have as much. (Grenadier kinda has this issue.)

-Pyro is really strong, but really fun and rewarding, I'd say it's probably in the best spot.

-Scout seems just outshine sniper in every way, more ammo, better cloak ability, more killing power. I don't think it's too powerful, I just think it's too much better than others.

-Demo is rarely picked, it often misses, and has little killing power, it's just annoying to maneuver around your own marines, and not rewarding enough for having to do so.

What do you guys think?

They have to buff Demo, really, he has a RPG but he can't kill any beno with it -- it has slow firing rate(it doesn't shoot from 1st click), it's power is really low coz HE rockets deal 0 damage with direct hit to T3s, and AP is just... Hitting something with RPG AP is like being a sniper. WP rockets are actual shit, really, one napalm tile? They could make it like Molotov at least. And RPG has no sights, they could add some to improve it. So this all makes RPG almost useless against beno... That's my opinion.

[Renomaki]

If you ask me, the biggest issue with specialist is how everyone and their mother are constantly fighting for the role, even if they have NO IDEA WHAT THEY ARE DOING WITH IT!

Way too often I come across people in the role that don't understand their importance to the squad, let alone their responsibilities. For instance, when your SL/NCO dies, the spec is expected to take charge of the squad, being the second highest rank of the squad, yet the majority of people who play this role either don't realize this, or they just refuse to take on the mantle of leader because otherwise they aren't going to get as many kills.

Which brings me to another issue: Getting kills. That is the number 1 issue with this class, in that the majority of people seeking it only want it so they can get lots of kills and stroke their E-weenies. They tend to forget that it is more than a heavier PFC, and often are in a rush to get ANY kills they can with it. And if a squad happens to get guard duty, you can expect these guys to bitch and moan about it (even if the role they choose might do well in a defensive position, like snipers). Hell, sometimes they just outright refuse to obey orders and charge the closest known battlezone in an attempt to get some action, no doubt going horribly wrong at some point. Yes, I know that the main point of a spec is to dish out a lot of pain to xenos, but there isn't any rush to do it. When the time comes, unleash the hurt, but otherwise you should listen to your commanding officer and not go roaming around like an untrained grunt.

And lastly, there is the whole issue with maturity. Specialist are said to be heavily trained, and thus are expected to behave themselves and display a great deal of maturity and intelligence. But again, oftentimes you get a lot of specs that are as rowdy as your average PFC, childish or even outright uncooperative. These are guys with ELITE training, and they act like freshly enlisted conscripts who know they are going to die, so they don't give a shit about anything. The fact that they are meant to be the second in command of a squad makes this fact even more awkward when they complain the moment they are forced into a position of leadership due to their NCO deciding to charge headfirst into a ramming crusher. Hell, a lot of issues could be mainly due to maturity in general!

While a whitelist wouldn't really work with such a role, sometimes I wish there was a system in place that restricted people from playing it until they had more experience in other fields, what with it being such a high ranking role in a squad and thus one that demands more than your average grunt.

[JennerH]

I'd argue that specialist needs to be a CPL and they need to add a dedicated fireteam leader as a second in command instead. It's a terrible idea making the guy with the big gun also have to micromanage a squad anytime the SL gets hurt or killed because most people can't or aren't willing to do so

[TicTac]

I'd argue that specialist needs to be a CPL and they need to add a dedicated fireteam leader as a second in command instead. It's a terrible idea making the guy with the big gun also have to micromanage a squad anytime the SL gets hurt or killed because most people can't or aren't willing to do so

Ehhh, I see what you mean. I think Specialist needs to either get stronger guns and effects, and make it more about the damage it can do with it's weapons. Or bring all of the weapons to a useful, but not game-changing state, Sniper is probably the best example of this, a good sniper can stop boilers from gassing. Giving specialists the ability to counter alien abilities could be really cool.

[Skimmy2]

I'd argue that specialist needs to be a CPL and they need to add a dedicated fireteam leader as a second in command instead. It's a terrible idea making the guy with the big gun also have to micromanage a squad anytime the SL gets hurt or killed because most people can't or aren't willing to do so

While I fully agree with you, thats actually how the CoC is for irl Fireteams, if the FTL dies then the man with the Machine Gun takes command, despite the fact that you cant really lead and fire a extremely loud gun at the same time.

[JennerH]

While I fully agree with you, thats actually how the CoC is for irl Fireteams, if the FTL dies then the man with the Machine Gun takes command, despite the fact that you cant really lead and fire a extremely loud gun at the same time.

That's actually what I was kind of getting at, because if the SL dies the official aSL would be the next highest ranking (so the STG) which would be the fireteam leader. Now whether or not he was leading any fireteams, from a gameplay perspective the person who opted in as FTL would be implying that he's willing to be aSL, which would hopefully fix the chain of command issues with specialists

[Sambalu]

The main problem I see with not just specialists, but also medics and engineers not wanting to take command is the fact that most of the time they simply don't have any space on their loadout to carry beacons/binocs. The SADAR spec is a good example of this, as without a webbing, they are usually going to be too euncumbered to carry any more gear, especially if they have a sidearm.

[Renomaki]

The main problem I see with not just specialists, but also medics and engineers not wanting to take command is the fact that most of the time they simply don't have any space on their loadout to carry beacons/binocs. The SADAR spec is a good example of this, as without a webbing, they are usually going to be too euncumbered to carry any more gear, especially if they have a sidearm.

There is also the fact that medics are often too busy trying to prevent people from dying, and engineers are busy building and repairing stuff.

Having the role of leadership tossed onto an already busy role is going to cause some players a fair bit of stress, moreso if they are just a PFC that wanted a simple game of shooty shooty bang bang, and suddenly they are thrust into a position of great importance.

Alas, a lot of players will have to accept that at some point in the round, they could find themselves with new responsibilities right outta the blue, and will have to learn to adapt on the fly. Otherwise squads will crumble.

[Mann handle]

Well for specs I feel;

Sniper: The damage output is okay if you are using the only round that actually has any use and is the only round ordered, (Incendiary rounds for those who don't know). Otherwise his loadout is rather lacking seeing as a sniper gets little ammo and the flak mags are pretty bad.

Demo: If you live past the first 10 minutes of combat, you'll be begging for ammo constantly. Maneuvering to get a shot is suffering with marines getting in the way from both front and back. Due to that it's a thankless task when you're forced to fire and you have to harm your own or at least risk it. The damage is shockingly bad, the HE coughs up smoke and does little to bigger xenos (when the xeno doesn't decide to bounce HE off their armour). The AP has little killing potential and often misses (I've also seen this bounce). The WP is useful in very few situations which often require the planets to align. Not to mention the ammo capacity and the fact that with the launcher alone you fill a bag up and suit slot with the equipment alone.

Scout: The best spec by far, with a get away option that can also be used in offensive pushes. The ammo stings like a bitch and you get a zoom on your weapon.

Pyro: The potential to FF and husk marines balances the shear combat damage you can do with the fire you spit. It's rather balanced for the most part.

Heavy gren: Well this role is rather useless with the nade changes but it can fill those little spots where a few well placed nades work wonders. Thing is, the best thing for this role to do is to go the Aoi Bell route and toss away the grenade launcher order a HPR and act as a heavy line breaker. Even without the HPR you can do better work with a rifle than the launcher at the moment which is a shame really, but it is balanced for the most part.

If you ask me, the biggest issue with specialist is how everyone and their mother are constantly fighting for the role, even if they have NO IDEA WHAT THEY ARE DOING WITH IT!

One of the biggest issues with specs is that because they get the shiny toys they will be the most sought after role, even if most people have no idea what they are doing with it.

To the average player they are the killing blow who has a special loadout dedicated to killing things. They often forget niches and the side things a spec is expected to do, like lead squads when the leader is downed, relay information from what they can see etc etc.
You're right as well about some spec simply just walking off and fighting on the front even if the squad is expected to sit at the FOB or prep for a push elsewhere. They just waltz off and rambo on whim and die alone.

I'd argue that specialist needs to be a CPL and they need to add a dedicated fireteam leader as a second in command instead. It's a terrible idea making the guy with the big gun also have to micromanage a squad anytime the SL gets hurt or killed because most people can't or aren't willing to do so

Thing is that most roles in a squad are too busy anyway. Medics are waaay too busy. In defenses the engineers are extremely busy, assaults not so much. PFCs are a mixed bunch so unless you find a name you know (eg. kesserline, you, noah, uriel, etc etc.) it would end rather badly, not to mention that sometimes these names just want to be a PFC and don't feel like leading that round / day. The spec by this virtue is the only one who's free for the most part to lead and as Sambalu pointed out, have to in some cases sacrifice equipment to get the SL's stuff. The only other role that actually has the free time to lead and can have space is the smartgunner, who often is someone learning the game due to role recommendation, dead due to an over aggressive play much like a rambo spec, not focusing due to shooting shit much like a spec.

To summarize on the spec. It sucks when you get a bad spec who doesn't know his role or sub roles but there really is no solution to it other than dealing with it for a round. The equipment however needs a look at, Demo has little function and the heavy gren is now re-purposed to heavy rifleman at this point.

[yogurtshrimp69]

The mad rush to the vendor so you don't get the bad specs is abysmal. Your round can honestly be determined as a spec because you spawned at the top of the cryo room and need to make your way to Delta prep, for example. You'll be stuck with legitimately bad options compared to the valuable choices like spec, pyro, and sniper and be forced to choose legitimately bad options aside from B18 armor. I think the fact that people literally don't use the primary weapon of demo and grenadier loadouts, and rather would mainly use a rifle or beg for an HPR shows the state of those two in particular. The changes to grenades and explosives and left those two in the dust.

[Avalanchee]

I'd argue that specialist needs to be a CPL and they need to add a dedicated fireteam leader as a second in command instead. It's a terrible idea making the guy with the big gun also have to micromanage a squad anytime the SL gets hurt or killed because most people can't or aren't willing to do so

I agree with that.

[Troika]

It is flat out ridiculous that the sadar is useless against the very things you would logically want to use it on the most.

[Tony Lotrick]

Logic is not wellcome on CM battlegrounds. Just use what is works currently.

[Gnorse]

Yeah, The spec rush should not be a thing.
Your 3 Hour round should not depend on praying to the lord almighty to place you in a good area in cryo so you can get your kit before the others.

[spookydonut]

This is an opinion that is gonna get some salt but here we go lads.

*Inhales*

The smart gunner role is far over powered and should not be its own thing separate from the specialist.
The smart gun is a crutch and TBH people often push / FF / treat the SG like he is some sort of shitcicle because there are atleast 2 to 4 of them every round.

The smart gun needs a major buff to damage and another debuff to movement speed.
Smart gunners need to be none shove-able by marines when in disarm or above because I'm sorry but Mass vs Mass.

SG needs to become the bane of Xenos again instead of some dipshit you can tank after mature.

*Squints at fellow ravs and even carriers*

TBH if I have a huge fucking gun with "Smart" bullets then I would assume these bullets would be like little tank rounds not some sort of shitty uncle to the SMG that hits harder but is still ultimately the catalyst to your demise.


TL:DR

SG needs to remerge with Spec class.
I'm a dick.
Raining on yall's parade

lol, smartgunner got split from specialist.

[Renomaki]

lol, smartgunner got split from specialist.

Hell, I remember how a lot of people would view the smartgun as a "meh" spec choice that was only decent in the early game, but became worthless in the late game. Combined with several people suggesting that the smartgunner be split into its own role instead of being a spec choice, the squad smartgunner class was born, unchanged from its spec roots.

It isn't that powerful a role honestly (hence why it became a part of every squad's composition unlike the average specialist), but in the right hands, it can be pretty deadly.

Most tend to forget it is a support role, however, and end up ramboing to their deaths due to misinformation.

[Slywater]

Meta-rushing the vendors doesn't seem to be a problem with merely the specs, the first 5 mins of the round is a bit of a race for attachments/equipment/materials for other classes too.

[Gnorse]

yeah, but unlike attachments/equipment that come in varying quantities, specialist kits only have one each, so if you get a bad spawn/get pushed down, other specialists decide your kit for you.

[ColdSuit]

Buff the hell out of SADAR please. Explosives in general need a buff because its the only reliable way to keep the fuckers down. AP rockets in particular as a crusher SHOULD NOT be able to tank a round designed to obliterate a tank.

[kooarbiter]

I agree with what was said earlier, make spec Corp or Corp first class and make sg second in command, maybe change the power pack to fit on the belt so they can carry sl gear in a pack to round out their already well defined support role, maybe give them a large mag and general pouch so they can carry spare mags for sl or something