The Gang goes to Couples Counsling

[Cpkeyes]

I had no idea what to title this. But it is hopefully a good meme.

Now, I've been debating posting this for a while. I was worried that it would come across as whining or 'salty' behavior etc etc. But, I've decided to go 'fuck it' and post it. Note that the opinions expressed here are just that, opinions, this is not an attempt to bait anyone or cause someone to get banned. It's making a comment.

Anywho, one thing I have noticed is that the staff, at least certain members, are.....passive aggressive. Now I want to be clear, I am not trying to point fingers, attempt to make a rule were everyone has to be nice so the community can be a happy funland or anything. I have never been warned, noted or even threatened with a warning. I feel the need to say this because of the above mentioned passive aggressiveness so that no one tries to claim I am just some salty player made over a warning or ban he hasn't gotten.

Going on I feel like the biggest issue facing the community right now is the fact that the relationship between staff and playerbase isn't healthy and I feel a large blame on it goes to the staff. I have noticed that every time that someone has an opinion that the staff doesn't like/agree with (Which is often, mostly when an update comes around since it seems every update something happens that the players don't like) they are passive aggressive at best and with clear contempt for the players option, with an underlining tone of "Stop salty" or "You're a powergamer". In fact,One of them even made a thread calling people who disagree powergamers and salty. Ifa player was to make a thread like that, they be banned or warned at least.. Yet that never seems to happen with the staff. It just doesn't seem that there is much internal policing of behavior among the staff.

To be honest, it's part of why I don't really play CM anymore. I also want to make it clear I do hate the staff or anything, it's just something I noticed.

[Enceri]

we want boonie hats and we'll stop hating the staff

[BadApple]

I also want to make it clear I do hate the staff or anything,

Wow harsh /s

[Cpkeyes]

we want boonie hats and we'll stop hating the staff

What if they make boonie hats an MP only item.

[x31stOverlord]

Well, I mean, mostly with updates etc. most of the staff don't actually have much prior knowledge or input on them. Complaining vocally in deadchat and OOC before/after rounds won't solve the issue of things that you don't like. If you have suggestions and or concerns about an update you really need to either A) Make a post on the forums with your suggestions and ideas or B) Make a gitlab suggestion.

"Going on I feel like the biggest issue facing the community right now is the fact that the relationship between staff and playerbase isn't healthy and I feel a large blame on it goes to the staff. I have noticed that every time that someone has an opinion that the staff doesn't like/agree with (Which is often, mostly when an update comes around since it seems every update something happens that the players don't like) they are passive aggressive at best and with clear contempt for the players option, with an underlining tone of "Stop salty" or "You're a powergamer". In fact,One of them even made a thread calling people who disagree powergamers and salty. Ifa player was to make a thread like that, they be banned or warned at least.. Yet that never seems to happen with the staff. It just doesn't seem that there is much internal policing of behavior among the staff."

I feel as though this is incorrect, most of the staff get on well with the playerbase as a whole, I certainly try to ensure that I am professional and at least try to be as friendly as possible even when dealing with issues in game and I am quite active on discord should anyone want to chat with me. I do not think anyone on the staff team would ban or warn a player for making a suggestions thread on the forums, as long as it is civil and reasonable in its contents providing actual and valid concerns and complaints about an update. If it is full of comments such as "FUCKING DEVS FUCKING SUCK BAHFDFNJF" then yes, the ideas and opinions within will be ignored or disregarded by the staff team. All of the staff are volunteers and do not have to do anything that they don't want to involve themselves with. The Dev team often work on updates with a further goal in mind, just because the amount of time it takes for them to get sections of an update ready doesn't mean that what they deliver on an introduction update does not mean that it will remain static forever, they constantly work on new content and updates to ensure a new feeling and new experience with each passing update. A lot of people are annoyed right now with the balance that the new xeno castes brought, and this is valid, but the Devs were in no way going to leave it as it currently stands and are currently monitoring and taking feedback that is constructive and not pure salt and will be making changes in smaller updates to bring that balance back down. The Devs don't have infinite amount of time and they cannot just leave the game as is until they have sorted all their content and tested it, sometimes it requires an actual test by the players to see what their feedback and concerns are about certain things, so they release the update and then make changes on it.

And as always, if you believe that any staff are abusing their power and position, make a staff report where it will be investigated fully by the head team. We have a good staff team on this server and the heads take it very seriously when someone is reported for abusing their position of trust and power.

[Cpkeyes]

Well, I mean, mostly with updates etc. most of the staff don't actually have much prior knowledge or input on them. Complaining vocally in deadchat and OOC before/after rounds won't solve the issue of things that you don't like. If you have suggestions and or concerns about an update you really need to either A) Make a post on the forums with your suggestions and ideas or B) Make a gitlab suggestion.

"Going on I feel like the biggest issue facing the community right now is the fact that the relationship between staff and playerbase isn't healthy and I feel a large blame on it goes to the staff. I have noticed that every time that someone has an opinion that the staff doesn't like/agree with (Which is often, mostly when an update comes around since it seems every update something happens that the players don't like) they are passive aggressive at best and with clear contempt for the players option, with an underlining tone of "Stop salty" or "You're a powergamer". In fact,One of them even made a thread calling people who disagree powergamers and salty. Ifa player was to make a thread like that, they be banned or warned at least.. Yet that never seems to happen with the staff. It just doesn't seem that there is much internal policing of behavior among the staff."

I feel as though this is incorrect, most of the staff get on well with the playerbase as a whole, I certainly try to ensure that I am professional and at least try to be as friendly as possible even when dealing with issues in game and I am quite active on discord should anyone want to chat with me. I do not think anyone on the staff team would ban or warn a player for making a suggestions thread on the forums, as long as it is civil and reasonable in its contents providing actual and valid concerns and complaints about an update. If it is full of comments such as "FUCKING DEVS FUCKING SUCK BAHFDFNJF" then yes, the ideas and opinions within will be ignored or disregarded by the staff team. All of the staff are volunteers and do not have to do anything that they don't want to involve themselves with. The Dev team often work on updates with a further goal in mind, just because the amount of time it takes for them to get sections of an update ready doesn't mean that what they deliver on an introduction update does not mean that it will remain static forever, they constantly work on new content and updates to ensure a new feeling and new experience with each passing update. A lot of people are annoyed right now with the balance that the new xeno castes brought, and this is valid, but the Devs were in no way going to leave it as it currently stands and are currently monitoring and taking feedback that is constructive and not pure salt and will be making changes in smaller updates to bring that balance back down. The Devs don't have infinite amount of time and they cannot just leave the game as is until they have sorted all their content and tested it, sometimes it requires an actual test by the players to see what their feedback and concerns are about certain things, so they release the update and then make changes on it.

And as always, if you believe that any staff are abusing their power and position, make a staff report where it will be investigated fully by the head team. We have a good staff team on this server and the heads take it very seriously when someone is reported for abusing their position of trust and power.

I have, twice in fact, and it feels like every time it was either considered a personal problem or nothing came of from it. The only time I can think of a staff member being actually punished for it was Feweh, even through there was constant reports on his behavior and nothing seemed to be actually done before that boondoggle. He is the only staff member to be punished the year I have here in this community, and honestly I feel like there plenty of other punishment worthy actions, but nothing seemed to be done with them.

And this isn’t a constant thing that happens it’s just something I notice and troubles me. I also never rally noticed the devs implementing or noting a players opinion on things. Hell, I remember when the staff made a ‘joke’ by making a fake update, mocked the players that thought it was serious, and then went “It was just a joke, calm down”. It causes a shitstorm and yet....no one seems to be punished for it. It was literally to stir up the player base, Apop even changing the wallpaper to a crying marine. The response from the head of staff was even “it was a funny joke”

Yet it was the players fault for getting mad at a really poorly done and in poor taste joke.

I forget the exacts of the fake update but it was something absurd. But the fact players thought it was something that was legit real should say a lot.

On a side note, I also feel the whole “Don’t ping devs” rule is dumb and just separates the community more from the staff. It seems most of the time devs are pinged is not about anything game wise so I don’t even see the reason for it besides to give a mundane and unimportant thing to warn players about.

[Snypehunter007]

On a side note, I also feel the whole “Don’t ping devs” rule is dumb and just separates the community more from the staff. It seems most of the time devs are pinged is not about anything game wise so I don’t even see the reason for it besides to give a mundane and unimportant thing to warn players about.

The don't ping devs rule exists partially due to people pinging them about their suggestions, otherwise it exists so that players can't . . . "salt" about an update. I don't normally use the word salt and I know that there are many players who do bring up issues with an update that could be considered to be legitimate, but it is one of those rules that is an "all-purpose safety rules", that are there to keep devs from receiving a million messages.

I know that when I was a mapper, I did play with the rule loosely. I typically let community members ping me on the discord as long as they weren't be excessive with it, which, thankfully, nobody was and I consider that a blessing.

[NethIafins]

I have, twice in fact, and it feels like every time it was either considered a personal problem or nothing came of from it. The only time I can think of a staff member being actually punished for it was Feweh, even through there was constant reports on his behavior and nothing seemed to be actually done before that boondoggle. He is the only staff member to be punished the year I have here in this community, and honestly I feel like there plenty of other punishment worthy actions, but nothing seemed to be done with them.

You won't believe how this changed lately, after Feweh left. You definitely did not look into every player report/staff report

[Casany]

The staff team has always been like this. Not because the people on it are bad but because of the rules in the team. Apop doesn’t really want people on the staff team tk have different opinions, or if they do not to spread them outside of the slack. There are staff members who were removed for sharing their different opinions outside of slack. And honestly that’s probably the best way about it. Any time a staff team shows that they aren’t all put together or agreed on a subject other people such as the playerbase could take it as a sign of instability.

Sorry for rambling a bit but that’s just what I’ve experienced over my few years of being here

[awan]

The do not ping dev rule is also to make everyone go through the proper channels. Everyone should get a say, not just the people who pm a dev. Hence the gitlab is public anyone not following the guidelines for suggestions is going to get theirs denied though. And a lot of people do not seem to get the general vision cm has.

For me it feels that some staff is just very out of touch with the community. And the community out of touch with the higher staff. This makes it quite harder for stuff to happen and people to feel heard. I myself am very direct and not polite. But I do have the best for the community in mind. And so do all most staff members except for apop he just wants to issue permabans to everyone on the server.

[Karmac]

i'll give it to you fucking straight my mans if you being a powergaming fuck ill let you know

you breaking the rules ill tell you to get a life for a day and ban you for 24 hours so you can't appeal it

yeah some of our staff members are literal retards who dont understand the concept of "dont ping at everyone and you won't get literally killed by the idiots you just pinged", yeah they don't understand the concept of "people actually take you seriously so when you make a joke about marines being nerfed they'll probably take it seriously", yeah some of them are quick to just give you a warning instead of hitting you with a 3 hour "dont do it again or it'll be a day you dingus", but at the end of the day it's our job to deal with you guys on the daily, some people just have their own way of handling you guys, that's how it is.

we get a lot of shit from players over the simplest things and oftentimes you'll find that this attitude we frequently get really depreciates our opinions of the general serverbase, that's entirely the fault of the players, if you're gonna be idiots all the time we'll just treat you like them, and I swear to shit if you ping a dev on the CM forum for no good reason I'll make sure you never see the light of day again it's a simple goddamn rule jesus christ.

[Rohesie]

i'll give it to you fucking straight my mans if you being a powergaming fuck ill let you know

you breaking the rules ill tell you to get a life for a day and ban you for 24 hours so you can't appeal it

Do I really have to quote this?
Remain Professional, no matter what happens
- Constantly stay cool. Regardless of what a player says to you do not act unprofessional and get angry with them.
- This also applies to the forums. Retain some level of professionalism when posting in player reports or ban appeals.

I suspect this is where the OP's dissatisfaction stems from.

we get a lot of shit from players over the simplest things and oftentimes you'll find that this attitude we frequently get really depreciates our opinions of the general serverbase, that's entirely the fault of the players, if you're gonna be idiots all the time we'll just treat you like them, and I swear to shit if you ping a dev on the CM forum for no good reason I'll make sure you never see the light of day again it's a simple goddamn rule jesus christ.

I can totally sympathize with you here. Being a staff member is getting a lot of shit all the time, and forcing yourself to remain calm and maintain a smile on your face. Many jobs are like that. It's a tough one. But it's counter-productive to answer to it with anything but the most calm and professional attitude you can muster. Else you'll just escalate things, or worse, target the people who'd be respectful to you but are now instead feeling attacked.

If you feel things are too shitty for you to calmly address them, the healthy approach is to consider taking a small break. Consider this an attempt of friendly advise, not an attack, of course.

[OatzAndHoes]

[I_Solve_Practical_Problems]

I can totally sympathize with you here. Being a staff member is getting a lot of shit all the time, and forcing yourself to remain calm and maintain a smile on your face. Many jobs are like that. It's a tough one. But it's counter-productive to answer to it with anything but the most calm and professional attitude you can muster. Else you'll just escalate things, or worse, target the people who'd be respectful to you but are now instead feeling attacked.

If you feel things are too shitty for you to calmly address them, the healthy approach is to consider taking a small break. Consider this an attempt of friendly advise, not an attack, of course.

I agree with Lydia here. I understand that both marines and xenos are really toxic right now, anyone just need to spend 10 minutes in dead chat/OOC or even the Discord to figure that out. Not only is school starting to get out, but balancing is a bit wonky right now which is conducive to misdirected rage and anger towards the admins. Heck, I'll be the first to say it, a thread titled "The Gang goes to Couples Counsling" was probably never going to produce fruitful and respectful levelheaded results, but when the good guys start racing the buffoons and ignoramuses to the bottom, no one wins. Dignity and courtesy will always carry the day and produce the best results for our community. I say this as someone who has immense respect for the volunteer staff who put their thankless hours into CM, and the hard work they do policing and stopping the griefers who try to ruin CM.

[Karmac]

[kroack]

The playerbase deserves all the contempt it receives.

[Royal Griffon]

I just am happy they're active, at least somebody is keeping the laws official besides MPs, I mean sometimes I feel a bit threatened and scared to come on sometimes due to reasons, but I still come on and most of them are really good and I'm always happy to see them, Lordington, Grimcad, Awan, just to name a few usually keep me coming back. Awan and Lordington also really are open to suggestions and while playing MP and questioning Awan as a CMP's orders of how to put someone in a cell, he linked me to a suggestions page to post my suggestion of how to deal with prisoners. Trust me, we still can't get a good enough procedure down for prisoners most of the time.
Also Imperator_Titan caught me drinking too much coffee and I told him that I was the one who found out you COULD indeed OD on coffee, however I'd need to drink about 20 more. He seemed disturbed but possibly a little laughy at that as well

[awan]

So, I am going to do something I should not really do because I have been instructed to not comment on game mechanics and or game development.
But the devs are actually working on balancing the game out.
I know it is hard to believe but all the issues you think we have with balance might actually be worked on. Just think how much fun the new content is anyways.

[Kasius]

It's just the Internet.

We can't hear eachothers' tone of voices, see the expression of eachothers' faces.

So it's easy. VERY EASY, to take things people say out of context when it comes to sensitive things.

We're all different and we have to keep in mind that we also have a lot of YOUNG players in our playerbase (I'm talking within the range of 12-15). Of which probably won't handle sarcasm or salt really well. It's BYOND and this community attracts kids. (Yes I said kids. I'm old. No! Not -THAT- old...)

Best thing to do is to try and step back a moment and try to read what other people say in a different light every now and then.

A lighthearted approach to every situation is king.

[Amitt0]

Roll with the punches, treat staff with respect and you will be respected.

Shitters are treated as such. Same as people who can't be mature. I've never had a negative experience with the staff.

They're volunteers. They aren't paid enough (not at all) to put up with trivial shit or abuse.

For instance, with Ahelps. Be concise and factual and not irate or angry. If you are pointing out a rule break they appreciate it or if you are the victim as I said, be factual and concise. Help them help you.

[Amitt0]

Love it.

[Karmac]

So, I am going to do something I should not really do because I have been instructed to not comment on game mechanics and or game development.
But the devs are actually working on balancing the game out.
I know it is hard to believe but all the issues you think we have with balance might actually be worked on. Just think how much fun the new content is anyways.

look out guise big spooler devs are being devs!!!11!