Job Slot Scaling Feedback thread

[DefinitelyAlone0309]

As a doctor, I feel like the slot is too subjective. On one hand, I sure as hell don't want to stand around doing nothing because I don't have enough patients through medbay. On the other hand, having some spare doctors at all times mean that you have people on patient transport, scanning, triage, cryo cell, recovery.

[WinterClould]

Doctors are weird.
There are a lot of things they could do doing but just dont. They could organize the dead or wounded.
They could be making chems 24/7.
They could be running the cryotubes.
They could operate the auto doc and do surgeries at the same time.

But most of the time the idiots go SSD instead of cryoing themselves in the beds that are RIGHT THERE. It's weird and I blame the docs being idiots.. probably... bored idiots.

[CSolaris]

What I notice is that people don't change their job preferences and end up getting stuck as one and end up going SSD anyway. Other times it feels like people choose doctor because it 'sounds' like fun and you get to play with the chemistry machine but they end up getting bored and decide to do fuck all / be bald /go SSD in a bed somewhere obscure.

[Arbs]

I think reducing the numbers of shipside roles isnt something we need.

Expanding the numbers during larger populations is.

Pretty much this. It's a fix to a problem that doesn't really exist.

[trustscience44]

I dislike the reduced number of slots/roles and from my experience this makes it harder for department heads. I have late joined many rounds on high pop and have seen but a single CT with zero CT spots open, also see 0 RO and 1CT at high pop with zero CT slots open, but of course 1 RO spot open, also 1 MT slot open with only 1 MT occupied. Sometimes, we are going to have people that are new or people that want a role which comes with less responsibility, this will make it near impossible to train these new people and imo feel off-putting for new players who have no one else in their department to speak with or get advice from. Roles with less responsibility should have increased slots not the opposite. I'm grabbing examples from my experience of the changes more than hypothetical what-if scenarios. Basically, I agree with the others sentiment about increasing the amount of slots available during high pop for less important roles.

[yogurtshrimp69]

I think reducing the numbers of shipside roles isnt something we need.

Expanding the numbers during larger populations is.

This puts it nicely, aside from issues caused by something like too many POs bickering over the dropships, I don't see much reason to limit shipside roles, especially critical ones like doctor and SO.

[spookydonut]

In low pop a lot of ship side roles get very bored, id rather the extra slots open up as the population increases

[Rohesie]

As a doctor in lowpop I tend to get swarmed lately, specially when my fellow doctors are not on point. I've never really had much boredom issues because when you have free time you can cook chems, supply the dropships, teach newbies, or just RP and interact with the fellow noncombat roles.

And even if I did get super bored I could just cryo or do something else. I don't see how limiting the slots, specially for latejoiners who'd be fully aware through the crew manifest of what they are getting into, helps doctors.

The feedback in this thread has been very largely against the lowered limits in general, with some exceptions. Hope that does not go unnoticed.

[CaptainYankee]

Doctors can be pretty hit or miss in terms of efficiency. I'm surr most of us can remember times when large amounts of doctors got burnt out after peri/QC changes and medbay became deadchat lite. Doctor slots seemed pretty solid and there's definitely no need to scale down their slots.

CTs on the other hand, are really overworked it seems. Since the testing with slot scaling started ive noticed many rounds with 0 CTs. On highpop rounds ive noticed slightly better lines at requisitions. Although I have also seen a fee dedicated individuals playing the role repeatedly. What about playing around with the req line and getting an emergency third window for non-attachments? Or maybe for only attachments? Something to reduce the pressure at hithpop without taking up the same space as the normal lines. Then we could scale CTs up in slots on high pop and there'd still be plenty to do.

[Mann handle]

I'm not sure what one would achieve by scaling down the amount of shipside roles in a lowpop game, if people want to play something then let them. After all the more people you have on the shipside roles the better normally. Doctors have 4 operating tables an autodoc and the endless levels of triage to do. Cargo will always need a couple of techs due to the queues and the RO now getting orders from tankers and possibly command at round start. The bridge has 4 overwatches and the command box to fill, sure the XO and CO can take an overwatch each with two SO, but who runs the operation when there is no one looking and planning for the big picture? Engineering has an engine to run, OBs to load rarely, general maintenance, tank maintenance, drop ship maintenance to do, FOB maintenance. Saying that, MTs are a role where you COULD cull one person from it but when people are needed ground side for FOB work and tank fixing you find yourself very shorthanded if all the other parts are also working at full swing.

This also has to account that some people are good at their role and most others are in the stages of completely out of their depth to competent. It also doesn't help when someone decides to SSD and runs off to a secluded part of the ship only getting picked up when someone from cyro has stumbled into them. We could be a doctor down for 30 minutes if someone didn't decide to check some area out for the 20 minutes the doctor disconnected for whatever reason, then you have the cyro cycle time and possible wait for someone to join the role afterwards.

In short, one shouldn't really limit the amount of roles for lowpop. It's not really fixing a problem, if there was one to start with and I'm not sure as to what the intention is behind it. Plus I'd feel extremely sorry for Medbay players getting even more work heaped on them while marines wait.

CTs on the other hand, are really overworked it seems. Since the testing with slot scaling started I've noticed many rounds with 0 CTs. On highpop rounds I've noticed slightly better lines at requisitions. Although I have also seen a few dedicated individuals playing the role repeatedly. What about playing around with the req line and getting an emergency third window for non-attachments? Or maybe for only attachments? Something to reduce the pressure at highpop without taking up the same space as the normal lines. Then we could scale CTs up in slots on high pop and there'd still be plenty to do.

Tbh, Cargo is perfect the way it currently is, I say that mostly because it would require a layout change if you wanted to add more to cargo. Cargo is a tricky mistress sometimes in that it is HIGHLY dependent on who is in that role, some people are far better at outfitting people than others. Same could be said for the attentive span of people playing RO, watching orders go missed only to have a CT prod the RO repeatedly for the next 5 minutes is a very good example of this.

As for the amount of people playing the role, it's not a role for everyone, in fact it's a role few people enjoy that much (comparable to MTs even). Most of the time you're chained to the department and can't really role play outside of it. This was alleviated a little when there used to be 4 cargo techs in a high pop game, most of the time you could actually fuck around and do things for fun. But in the end it was deemed that cargo had too little to actually do with 4 CTs and a RO.

[WinterClould]

I'll say. While I gave my numbers for the minimal required crew of the ship, I don't believe that's what we should aim for really. Who cares if we have 3 more doctors then we need, they probably weren't gonna play PFC anyway. They'll cryo when they feel and that's that. Same with every other role. Maybe they'll cryo and roll xeno? You devs like that don't you? Teasing. I know you love that. But really people will see a Job available and if they want to play it they'll play it. If they dont see the role they want they might just never join the round. I don't see the harm in making all the maxes the same across the whole pop. Doctors will SSD in their breakroom marines don't have access to on any round and clod up slots. Same with every role. Limiting the slots just stops new people from replacing those ssd.

[spookydonut]

The purpose of this is to provide a more consistently balanced game regardless of player count.

From the feedback so far it seems that some roles need their minimum slots increased slightly but overall it's working well.

I have toyed with the idea of opening extra slots for longer rounds based on the number of pfcs that late join, eg another doctor slot opens every 20 late joining pfcs in addition to the existing scaling.

[TheDonkified]

What are the lower limits for the jobs now after receiving feedback? Personally, I think you need a minimum of 4 SOs per round so that the XO (if you even get one) can fill in the pseudo CO role. If a CO pops up, the XO is there to coordinate the efforts while CO devises plans and such.

Otherwise, I'm fine with the other lower limits. All the other crew roles get pretty boring after a while, so you usually end up not even filling the old crew slot numbers because people don't join/cryo/go AFK/mess around instead of doing their jobs.

However, that idea of adding slots as pop meets specific thresholds does sound good, especially in rounds that transition from low pop to average/high pop.

[solidfury7]

The purpose of this is to provide a more consistently balanced game regardless of player count.

From the feedback so far it seems that some roles need their minimum slots increased slightly but overall it's working well.

I have toyed with the idea of opening extra slots for longer rounds based on the number of pfcs that late join, eg another doctor slot opens every 20 late joining pfcs in addition to the existing scaling.

That's an excellent idea.

Seriously.

Itll solve quite a few annoying issues like Doctors who decide to go SSD roundstart in a really obscure spot .

+1

[TheMaskedMan2]

Definitely a good idea. I would also argue that more Synth slots for high pop would be nice, but i’m a sucker for Synth on Synth roleplay. Perhaps consider it?

Otherwise things seem to be working out relatively well.

[Sambalu]

I've seen only two PO/MT slots availible in rounds with up to 105 players on the USCM side, which feels like it's not enough slots. Three SOs also don't feel as though they are enough either. Overall, I'm not a fan of reducing the number of slots availible anyways. If I want to play MT, I won't play PFC just because it isn't availible. I haven't seen any problems before and this change basically restricts a large amount of job slots accross my timezone when there had been no issues previously.

[Jakkkk]

Definitely a good idea. I would also argue that more Synth slots for high pop would be nice, but i’m a sucker for Synth on Synth roleplay. Perhaps consider it?

Otherwise things seem to be working out relatively well.

this

[Nantei]

CT's lowest should be 2, SO's 4, and Doctor 4. The others I have no issue with, but playing with 2 SO's and an XO is god damn maddening. And there have been many times where there just were not enough doctors or MT's. Having less than 4 SO's is just going to make everyone's round more frustrating, and until this gets changed back I will not be touching any command staff roles.

We all know that XO's CAN overwatch, but if there is no CO they absolutely should not be. XO's manning consoles should really be one of the last things they do, and yet it has to be the first now. We commonly have the CE overwatch now too, which while he is trained, is still pretty patently silly.

EDIT:
Looks like some of the scaling got changed back. Hooray!

[Omicega]

I really dislike some roles scaling down as low as they do. I don't see a need for having only one researcher at most pops, and even locking off too many of the fun/more laid back roles like MT to as low as 2 slots at some pops is something I can't agree with.

[Royal Griffon]

definitely a 4 minimum in SOs in a NEED for high pops!

[Davidchan]

SOs need 4. Without 4, someone is pulling double duty, the CO/XO or Synth is doing something when there is other tasks that are a better use of their time, or a squad is just fumbling around without direction. Really no reason for SO to be a variable count job, if 4 people are willing to play the role, let them.

CTs need 2. Minimum. Not every round has an RO and if one of the Req lines isn't manned it leads to further complications and angry marines in the briefing or worse. Req realistically needs 3 people to operate properly, 2 at the windows and a third to run around pushing crates and orders around. RO really can't do his job if he's shackled to a window. I'd urge bumping the number up to 2-4 so orders can be run about or CTs can occasionally run to the fob to gather crates and bring them back.

Doctors shouldn't start with less than 4, imo. Having more is generally a good thing and being able to put a Doctor on the CASvac or in the FOB is a boon for everyone involved. But if an OR is unmanned it's a huge hit to the primary function of doctors.

POs are fine as is, imo. Having 2 is enough, a 3rd or 4th PO can be useful but generally not necessary so long as the Medivac or MG nest doesn't require special access to use. And if the POs can't get along or decide who gets to fly the ship or run the equipment, having extra POs just makes them less effective.

MTs seem fine as is, you rarely notice them during normal game play and so long as one can monitor the engine and the other the tank, any extra MT is stuck finding their own busy work though I did have a fun round focusing on rearming CAS and swapping missiles in and out as needed.

Research and MPs are meh. I can't really think of a need for a second researcher aside from RP chatter and a chance for a veteran player to show a rookie some tricks or the ins and outs of the job. Having too many MPs just emboldens them to behave in dickish behavior and attempt mass arrests for non-issue offenses. (A PFC told the XO to get his head out of his ass and fire the OBs! INSUB! ARREST ARREST ARREST!)

Squad Med/Eng - More is always better IMO. Particularly when squads can reach sizes of 50 or more marines, these are always something that pays to have more of. I'd urge even higher caps, say an extra Eng/Med for every 10 marines in a squad above 20.

For other roles I think we could use more of, Synth would certainly be a strong candidate for allowing extra slots to open up during high pop rounds, given their noncombat nature and catch all skill sets it would be fun to see new and old model synths competing in their own ways to prove which was more worthy.

Smartgunners too, I think could be added as extra slots for ever 20-25 marines in a squad. Always seemed odd to me that squads would always have more CPLs than LCPLs, especially in an infantry unit.