Human vs human and the Geneva Convention

[Heckenshutze]

Think: Would they give you mercy?...







... Then why should I give them some?

[ThePiachu]

I mean, Hague Invasion Act is a thing - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_ ... ection_Act

[Youbar]

Think: Would they give you mercy?...
... Then why should I give them some?

Life isn't a race to the bottom.

[Martzin]

There should definitely be some rules in place for how war is conducted whether we're in space or not. Just because the Geneva Convention is old doesn't mean the countries will resort back to lawless fighting, they'd cook up another list of rules to keep things in place. Even still if we're patrolling on a fringe colony infiltrated by insurrectionists there should be basic rules of engagement, especially if the fight is between two national armies like the UPP and USCMC. There is no reason to not have these basic laws in place. It'll spice up rounds with people talking a bit more too, the focal point of CM because the devs don't give a damn about making gameplay balanced.

[Nantei]

Life isn't a race to the bottom.

In the video that was linked I saw a decapitated doctor, and Gaius working on a UPP guy, and said, "Just because they're Monsters doesn't mean we have to be."

[ColonelCorazon]

I'll never trust the UPP again after I tried to throw friendship pizza at them and they threw back a grenade. I just wanted peace in our time. Peace of pizza.

[Bulaven]

Hey, when we're having human vs human rounds, could we remind both sides about the Geneva Convention and at least apply it to the medical staff? As in - doctors should treat combatants from both sides, and neither of the sides should be killing medical staff (at least provided they are not armed and comply)? The round we just had had some pretty good UPP in that regard, or at least I managed to weasel my way out of getting shot. But I had someone threaten to kill my Researcher mid-surgery, and I remember another round a few weeks ago where the UPP just stormed through medbay and killed everyone.

So, could we at least make that the one rule for UPP to follow, since it's already a rule in the Marine Law?

I feel that, while Earth-bound conventions seem a bit impossible to enforce, Command -Could- take steps to encourage certain good conduct.

For example: The CO can, from the get-go, attempt to enforce a strict policy of detainment, rather than outright killing those who surrender, or are otherwise unable to defend themselves.

If you can get the MPs, SOs, and SLs to obey such orders, that's about as good as it gets.

On this note, I would applaud such a Commander.

[WinterClould]

We could use a space Geneva convention, but we should not make it in anyway related to server rules. Marine law/UPP "law" at best.

[Azfrief]

It LITERALLY exists to be broken. So don't expect anyone smart to be following it. Doctor's should be prioritized targets.

[ThePiachu]

See, doctors should be priority captures, making them fix your guys as well as care to the other wounded you bring in. "Hey, you swore to help people, our people are wounded, fix them".

[Azfrief]

See, doctors should be priority captures, making them fix your guys as well as care to the other wounded you bring in. "Hey, you swore to help people, our people are wounded, fix them".

Only if necessary, kill them otherwise and kill them after you no longer need them after they've been captured. Not worth letting the enemy have anyone competent.

[Martzin]

Only if necessary, kill them otherwise and kill them after you no longer need them after they've been captured. Not worth letting the enemy have anyone competent.

Alternatively you could just keep them for yourself or let them be on their way, assuming you haven't been killed by the enemy. Should they be in any position for you to execute them all you've likely already killed the original unit. Murdering doctors is pointless then.

[RavingManiac]

There really isn't any reason to murder captured or surrendering combatants other than sheer spite. The stuff that sometimes goes down in HvH rounds would get the commander, MPs, staff officers and marines all put on trial for war-crimes.

[Steelpoint]

To be fair I think the uncivilized nature of acts taken during HvH events is due to the fact its a makeshift event, life is extremely cheap when the Opfor gets infinite reinforcements (typically) not to mention how aggravating it can be for the Marines to fight the Opfor since often they get access to the very powerful ERT gear en mass, and as such they take out their frustrations on dying or captured enemy combatants.

I would hope if HvH events were molded into a proper gamemode, that the situation would be more relaxed and realistic.

[Nantei]

On that topic, I would really love to see HVH turned into a formalized game mode.

[ThePiachu]

Definitely!

It's honestly pretty refreshing as a doctor to play HvH. You get more patients, and you get more variety (shrapnel everywhere, not just broken bones!). MPs get more work with holding PoWs. Sometimes the engagements are also longer - I remember a large-scale conflict we had on Big Red I believe where the game lasted so long admins had to delete a lot of things to remove lag that has been slowly accumulating...

[Mister Jeether]

On the other hand, UPP, CLF And DS, ALL of them have the same objective: Kill EVERYONE thats not wearing their uniform, on the Almayer. Realistically, USCM would be the only ones to follow the Geneva convention, even in HvH rounds. CLF is a bunch of terrorists that wont listen to anyone, UPP is the perfect hybrid of USSR And North Korea, killing anything that breaks into their territory, marine or civillian. Though, marines really need some sort of 'Rules of engagement' to avoid mindless slaughter of PoWs.

[Youbar]

UPP is the perfect hybrid of USSR And North Korea

Who have both signed the Geneva Conventions

[Skimmy2]

A big influencer of wars is the International Community.

IS there an International Community that would look upon the UPP/United Americaswhateverourcoloniesaregovernedby and judge their actions ?

Having diplomatic tension can do a lot for a commander to not want to order inhumane things, especially if an Admiral gets involved who particularly enjoys his career.

[ThePiachu]

Well, if UPP is supposed to be based on cold war USSR, then let's get something straight. The USSR propaganda was not just focused on "the capitalists hate us, they are bad", but, interestingly enough, it was also focused on "the working class of US is just like us, but they don't have enough courage to revolt against the capitalists" - https://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/ ... r/c887xr2/ . "Workers of the world, unite!" and all that.

So, UPP vs UA - sure, the soldiers would be killed, the CL might either get the bullet or be made an example of ("look at this pig, he was trying to get your brothers addicted to Ultrazine!"). Civilians, however, that might be a different story. They might just be "liberated" and encouraged to join the UPP.

----

As for the war crimes, even if it is just UPP and UA, you could still have some pressure not to devolve into war crimes. If you have a reputation for killing everyone that you come across, or torture people, or the like, you're way less likely to receive sympathy from the other side, or from the civilians. It's much easier to convince a colony to lay down its arms if it knows that would be the end of it, rather than if systematic extermination would follow.