I need advice for Ice.

[caleeb101]

Ice colony. The dreaded map of frozen L's. The map that people scream and REEEEEEEE at you for voting (rightfully so). The map that xenos vote after a xeno loss.

Recently, there was a round on Ice colony where marines had totally wiped out xenos over-ground. Completely the xenos fault, marines out-tacticooled them and xenos got flanked. This left them with 5 xenos remaining . Of course the xenos didn't wanna give up though. Among the remaining were the Elite Empress, a hivelord, a warrior, a lurker and a drone. Now, obviously the drone and hivelord got to work, STICKY resining every corner, corridor and tile, especially in the maintenance tunnels which is where the xenos camped as a choke point for marines.

The marines desperately try to finish the round, but eventually everyone gets tired of the xenos cowardice and splits up to find the queen fast and end the round, the general consensus being that if you see her, call it out. Of course, people are in different squads so you can't notify everyone. So as you can guess, the plan FAILED MISERABLY. And 59 marines ended up losing to 5 xenos due to incompetence and xenos being pretty scummy but doing what they needed to do to win.

TLDR: We were winning one ice round, wiped xenos to 5 left, xenos camped maint tunnels till marines got bored enough to split up and find them, xenos picked people off till they won.

What the hell do you suggest marines do in this situation? If every marine sticks together for a big sweep by going into maint tunnels, there's mass FF and queen charge ruins half the force. If they stick together and don't go in maint tunnels, xenos will just hide in them and pick some people off. If marines stay in groups of 3-4 they can easily be overwhelmed by remaining xenos until their numbers have dwindled. SO WHAT DO WE DO? HOW DO WE WIN ICE WITHOUT THE QUEEN BEING BALD? It seems like even when we win, WE DON'T WIN.

[ThePiachu]

In your situation, probably Xenos would start hunkering down underground. That's where they have the most advantageous position. So you'd have to go to them.

First off, you'd probably want to regroup and establish an LZ2 FOB. Your beachhead straight into the underground. From there, you'd probably want to push out in groups, search the area, and weld anything you've already checked, along with the vents.

After that, beats me :P.

Winning on Ice in general? Probably get down into the underground fast. If you let xenos have the underground, you are pretty much screwed, sticky resin everywhere, traps by every entrance, etc.

[Dauntasa]

It's worth noting that this is the round where this: https://i.imgur.com/yO8yxFo.png happened. The marine incompetence in clearing the underground was STAGGERING.

[Nantei]

The only strategy that really works on Ice is 3.5 squad LZ2. Not even joking. You send all but HALF a squad to LZ2, the other half gets comms up. Then you ahve to aggressively push forward into the right chokepoints and just kind of pray.

Slow push would be the best way to counter xenos hunkering down, but you constantly have the issue of burrowed larva, and since scans have such a large amount of time between you have no idea if you actually have the time to go slow or not. This is why a lot of the time marines in the endgame start playing really recklessly. Xeno comebacks are so easy that it's very hard to tell when you actually have breathing room.
For the sake of clarity, whenever I say slow push here, or in-game, I am saying you clear weeds and all the shit on the ground, THEN go in. You don't move onto weeds unless it secures you a kill. That's slow pushing.

Of course, the best way to beat ice is to never play it. Ice is misery, Ice is pain.

[ThePiachu]

I saw a round where a Queen pre-emptively countered the LZ2 push. We set up close to LZ2, and then when 4 squads came rolling into LZ2, they couldn't get past the blastdoors. Eventually they all left, and we made LZ1 into basically Normandy. Hivelord walls in checkered patterns, a tunnel for the Boiler to gas them directly, etc. It was a slaughter...

[DefinitelyAlone0309]

I saw a round where a Queen pre-emptively countered the LZ2 push. We set up close to LZ2, and then when 4 squads came rolling into LZ2, they couldn't get past the blastdoors. Eventually they all left, and we made LZ1 into basically Normandy. Hivelord walls in checkered patterns, a tunnel for the Boiler to gas them directly, etc. It was a slaughter...

Wouldn't that be metagaming ? Since benos aren't supposed to know that the marines are coming ?

[ThePiachu]

To an extent, yes. Then again, the spot next to LZ2 isn't that bad for a hive, so you could justify it as "I picked a random spot". But yeah, it's threading on thin ice, same as people preparing for a xeno attack as soon as Alamo gets called down by itself...

[Nantei]

Don't be silly, Xeno's can't meta.

[Kesserline]

Abandon AO, or at least the underground.

The Queen wants to screen+charge it ways through every corridor ? And when you put her nearly into crit, she just charge+screech away.

You can't try to send fireteams to pincer her and corner her down.

Turtle up until the Xeno player playing queen abandons. The xeno player enjoys killing 50 marines by being nearly solo. Ruin his enjoyment (of ruining others enjoyment) by turtling and RPing on your side.

I would have definetely done that, but I was too busy dying with other Deltas robustos to lower the Xenos numbers to 5.

[Gnorse]

Exactly as kesserline said.
If you go underground, you're doing EXACTLY what the xenos want you to do.
They want you to get bored and come down to them. Marines should do the exact opposite. Hunker down at the FoB and wait for the xenos themselves to get bored.

[Arbs]

I was the XO that round. My general idea for ice is to destroy and thin xenos on the surface via CAS, Tank, OBs (and mortar if you can even afford one). Avoid losses by not over extending and working on hit and run tactics. Really anything that cuts down xeno numbers without risking marine lives. Manpower is important and captured marines are the worst thing that can happen to you.

It worked very well as you saw and it reduced their numbers to 5.

Then I’ll always deploy marines underground via LZ2. Never through ladders/elevators cause thats a disaster waiting to happen. Priorities are getting power and lights up.

Marines lost cohesion in the underground. Got scattered and started throwing themselves at the charging queen. Which resulted in deaths and EVEN WORSE captured marines, which in turn restocked xeno numbers.

I even located the queen through a helmet cam and found out that if the CO had not died that early like that and regrouped all remaining men in engineering and went down south through maintenance they could kill the Empress in her ovi with little resistance and torch the nest.

Buut yeah. Thats where the marines went wrong. The underground part. Where we started throwing ourselves at the queen instead of baiting the thing.

It was a good round nonetheless.

[Pseudomaniac]

The issue with waiting above ground for the xenoes is that if you wait for too long, you're going to be greeted with several ancient T2, elite T3, and a elite empress, which can be enough to overwhelm any FOB. And you're risking death by boredom on the marine side too, not all your ungas are going to stay on the upper ladder, which might let xenoes get a couple of captures.

[Arbs]

It depends on the xenos too and where they attack from.

Another strategy for ice is the one Axel Strife thought out for LZ2.

Basically send one squad to secure T-Comms first. Send another squad to make an outpost at research dome.

Once the two are ready, deploy two squads via LZ2. Once Xenos attack LZ2 deploy one squad via research elevator. The other squad has to cover for T-Comms (at least with a skeleton crew) or else you're done without it. It's very risky and hard to pull off though.

Another problem you'll actually face is that marines don't actually know the underground ice map that well which is why they often get lost there too.

[Gnorse]

The issue with waiting above ground for the xenoes is that if you wait for too long, you're going to be greeted with several ancient T2, elite T3, and a elite empress, which can be enough to overwhelm any FOB. And you're risking death by boredom on the marine side too, not all your ungas are going to stay on the upper ladder, which might let xenoes get a couple of captures.

In regular rounds, yes, that's a problem.
But on THAT round, there were five xenos. no matter their maturity level, they would have gotten at most one T3.

[solidfury7]

Send 3.5 squads underground.

Push and quickly secure killzones with quickly assembled barricades and M56Ds and make lightly manned checkpoints at these points to prevent flanking.

Claymores work wonders and sealing maintenance is also neat too.

Work smart, not hard.

Sentries are pretty good on Ice too, due to the memescreech being countered by sentries

[ThesoldierLLJK]

The best strategy for ice is to not vote for ice

[Heckenshutze]

The best strategy for ice is to not vote for ice

this.


But if you masochists still went for it, the best strategy is to go full offensive as soon you encounter hostiles. FOB camping will eventually end in evac and sending 1-2 squads underground is giving them a death sentence. All your force, attack into one single location. better yet if you manage to communicate with others SL's and flank from all the sides.

[Chaznoodles]

The best strategy for ice is to not vote for ice

[BillyBoBBizWorth]

Winning on Ice in general? Probably get down into the underground fast. If you let xenos have the underground, you are pretty much screwed, sticky resin everywhere, traps by every entrance, etc.

Wrong atleast in the majority of ice maps ive been in or witnessed.Most ice map wins for the marines are either on the aboveground of ice or back at the alamayer.Underground is best pushed with a known low amount of xenoes left, otherwise its a deathtrap like the SD and CIC hallways.If not, let them have below ground, it doesnt have comms located there anyhow.Even with low xenoes numbers, underground can still be dangerous as fuck with the right players as pointed out in the OP.The scenario described in the OP happens more often than you would think.

Also, most of the rounds ive been in or witnessed, whether the LZ2 push is doing well or not(usually not), aboveground gets wiped, comms is lost(sometimes by just one xeno) and/or the xenoes have relocated to aboveground because they have knowledge of most marines being underground, and comms is never restored again.Often leading to a total loss planetside or EVAC because the operation isnt sustainable anymore.

Dont kid youself, comms on ice is the most important of all, as its a two Z-level map which makes comms even more important as troops are more likely to be further apart.If you under-man it by sending 3 quarters or more of your marines elsewhere and it goes down, your in deep shit for alot of reasons and the time its going to take to get marines at comms to even attempt to restore it is just one of them.

Anyone else notice lately how often the xenoes are fighting for southwest of comms, excavation and that icey ally just behind it? Yeah, they are there for a reason.

Aboveground also has open areas and snow, which is a blessing and curse, if you only clear certain snow channels/routes for movement, your partially fucking the xenoes over as they get a reduction in movement speed in the snow too.

Or, you can go below ground, where theres not really snow, but your guaranteed plenty of sticky resin and weeds.Which is a speed bonus to xenoes, and a reduction to you, the marines.Which do you prefer?

The advice for if and when you do go underground, is that marines need to use chokepoints to their advantage more, and stop allowing the xenoes turning them into disadvantages.Although thats universal to all maps.

[kroack]

Regarding OP, if it's ~50+ marines vs 5 xenos and the xenos still win, that's on command and the SLs for not pulling their shit together. Ie, you deserve it.

[Kesserline]

Regarding OP, if it's ~50+ marines vs 5 xenos and the xenos still win, that's on command and the SLs for not pulling their shit together. Ie, you deserve it.

Good joke.

Queen got nearly put into crit several times that round.

She just charged away at the other side of Ice underground.

Then, when the marines split up to chase/search the queen, she would kill the small party.

Marines would regroup again ? Nearly put her to crit again ? Charge away and it continues. Over and over.

[adrenalinetooth]

I discussed this issue with BMC (the head developer) a few months ago. He told me what he had in mind is that a squad is sent down on LZ2 to be aggressive and draw xeno attention. Whilst this is happening, other squads are to deploy above ground and get into positions near ladders and elevators. The above ground marines deploy underground to pincer and surround the xenos that were attacking the initial underground marine force.

Another critical thing is to get the tank underground when the aliens hunker down. It can force any heavily fortified force to retreat given the tank crew is competent, engineers are competent enough to clear the way, and there is sufficient space.

[Dauntasa]

It turns out the pro strat for Ice is to fail to set up TCOMMs for 30 minutes, break the LZ2 APC so that you can't open the blast doors, rout fully and flee the surface by 13:15 and then have Alpha, Bravo and Delta all launch a gigantic mutiny against Command. Xenos didn't even know what hit em. The most effective tactic for marines against xenos is to just fire wildly around you because you've been blinded by pepperspray and flashbangs and accidentally shoot xenos while aiming for MPs.

[Royal Griffon]

Ice is Nice so pick it Twice
UwU

[Lorem123]

Best option for ice is what Daunt said, yeah. Just cause a mutiny and get a deathsquad called in to restore order, while also wiping out the xenos.