Formal Ruling on the Definition of Metarushing

[Aestel]

I think it is finally time for this. I would like a formal ruling on the definition of metarushing by either a host, or the collective head mods since it seems to currently be an unwritten rule that is enforced with threats of CO bans. I have talked with some of the managers who have said that the Podlocks going down means fair game, but I would like them to post to confirm that.

As it stands currently, let it be known that we have enforced at the developer level a 25 minute timer from the start of the round to PREVENT metarushing which they clearly deem to be adequate. There is also a series of podlocks/fog locking out large portions of the map to PREVENT MECHANICALLY metarushing. This has all been considered at the developer level, and yet a player is being threatened with bans BECAUSE they use strategies that have been deemed 'too effective' by certain members the admin staff who are known Xeno mains.

If that is indeed the case, and meta-rushing is indeed shot down, I would like a formal apology by Solarmare for being treated the way I have the last few days, and the removal of my two notes regarding the topic.

[Symbiosis]

I think that the general feeling that it's "Us vs. Them" is really bad for CM.

Seeing as the subjectiveness of "metarushing" can easily be resolved by increasing the dropship refueling timer (which was the whole point of it in the first place, addressing what the Heads/Devs saw as metarushing) if the Marines get more robust.

Threatening to ban players and moving the goalposts is not a good way to encourage a healthy community. I think we all need to relax and instead of going for the proverbial throat... figure out a way to keep the sanctity of the "round" without targeting players that try to be effective.

I saw Lisa "Hotshot" Taylor get dragged through the coals for using a shotgun with the scout spec. They used her as a "reason" for nerfing things... but I don't think they ever threatened to ban her. That's a line where we as a Community need to avoid.

Just my two cents.

[Clutch]

jokes aside i agree totally, either make a formal ruling on it or close the shutters like the fogwall on LV or just shut up about it.

[Bancrose]

Either increase the timer of the podlocks or give us a ruling on it would be nice.

[JennerH]

performing actions against a player based on personal opinions should never be the case. we need an official ruling on it

[xXen0zS1ay3rXx]

Yeah this whole 'metarushing' saga has shown a really bad light on a lot of the admins/heads/etc. Threating bans on people just because you disagree with them is pretty low-tier adminning.

But it would be good to get a formal ruling on this and some justice for Aestel.

[Sulaboy]

I feel that meta rushing isn't defined so the staff have some leeway with how they rule specific incidents of this. I thought that the 25 minute dropship launch lock was put in to stop people from rushing the preparation phase. It is a bit of certainty to the round, and stops COs from ordering marines to deploy at 12:10.

[ThePiachu]

I think if you'd redesign the map, you might have less meta-rushing - if xenos can be all over the place, there is nowhere to rush to...

[Lorem123]

Instead of getting mad about Aestel being good at playing aggressively in a game where the marines have almost every disadvantage, rework the game so that the xenos are not as weak early on but not as disgustingly overpowered later on.

[Reuben Owen]

there are admins who are xeno mains? well you learn something new everyday...

[Coat McMutton]

A formal ruling is needed. Not only is it not okay to have half the staff warning a player for something the other half deems acceptable, it's gotten to the point where COs are afraid to make aggressive moves at all, because they fear the bwoink. Yes, some ambiguity is needed in the rules to stop rule-lawyers from tipping right up to the line. But on this issue, a well-defined ruling is needed.

[CaptainYankee]

As it stands currently, let it be known that we have enforced at the developer level a 25 minute timer from the start of the round to PREVENT metarushing which they clearly deem to be adequate. There is also a series of podlocks/fog locking out large portions of the map to PREVENT MECHANICALLY metarushing. This has all been considered at the developer level, and yet a player is being threatened with bans BECAUSE they use strategies that have been deemed 'too effective' by certain members the admin staff who are known Xeno mains.

If the mechanics in the game aren't doing what they're supposed to be doing, change them. If we ignore staff being eager to punish metarushing (from marines), it's obvious that it's tough to enforce since anyone can say they saw a xeno or were lured to the hive by young runner 420. On that prison round Aestell, you checked the security cameras, and sent squads to where they were out. That's smart! Prisoners would of course cut the cameras if there was a riot, and it'd probably be the first thing an experienced team would check.

I think that the general feeling that it's "Us vs. Them" is really bad for CM.

Threatening to ban players and moving the goalposts is not a good way to encourage a healthy community. I think we all need to relax and instead of going for the proverbial throat... figure out a way to keep the sanctity of the "round" without targeting players that try to be effective.

I saw Lisa "Hotshot" Taylor get dragged through the coals for using a shotgun with the scout spec. They used her as a "reason" for nerfing things... but I don't think they ever threatened to ban her. That's a line where we as a Community need to avoid.

Do you remember when xenos got teleported to the void for going through holes with walls on the other side? To fix this, the devs made it so the xenos just pop out onto the walls and their only course of action was to crawl back through. Much easier than ahelping. Once, we found a sentinel who was devouring infected marines, crawling through a wall, and spitting them out on the other side. Obviously the marines can't do anything at all, so there's no chance of them escaping. Now, before I finish the outcome of this, compare this behaviour to Lisa's.

You have on one side, 4 specs in the entire corp, who are gone when they are lost, irreplaceable. They can sometimes kill a xeno without it having time to react because stun + shotgun. On the other side, you have a massive abuse of QoL mechanics used to put players permanently out of the round with 0 chance of rescue/survival. Their squad, even if the xenos were wiped out, would never be able to find them, and the xenos would still get new larva.

This ended with the xeno player getting a note and the marines being left to burst in the wall. No joke, that was the course of action taken by the staff at the time. The point of removing the shotgun usage for spec, is that getting instantly perma-removed isn't fun. We can all agree that when something completely unknown and out of your control ends your game it sucks. Xenos and Marines should be coming together to remove those instances as much as possible, but instead it's very much an us vs. them mentality and it unarguably exists among those enforcing rules.

[HBlokkum]

I agree, we totally need a ruling on metarushing, and just consistent application of the rules in general.

[Karmac]

If your on a map with timelocks nothing is metarushing and anyone who says otherwise is a fucking retard

For maps like big red or ice colony, metarushing is usually just a bad idea because more often than not you'll be fighting in environments more suited to xeno combat than marines. But all things considered the idea of metarushing is stupid and should be fixed with either more timelocks or bigger maps with many more places for xenos to hide. Blaming players for this issue is weaksauce.

[lmwevil]

On a map with timelocks metarushing doesn't seem like a possible concept to be totally frank, the very definition of the fog wall and timelocks is the position of giving a hardline time period before the teams can directly enter combat with the larger teir castes and even charge the hive. If you go through the timelocks when they open and go towards a place you have somehow defined their location past, this isn't rushing, this is advancing forward right? If we want metarushing to be enforced by admemes, remove podlocks and the fog on LV, because as it stands there can be no middle ground.

Just my two cents

[Torrentia]

I spoke with a moderator and they confirmed that it was okay for staff below heads to make rulings based on their own interpretation of the rules.

Torrentia - Last Tuesday at 1:11 PM
Uhh I guess "is it or is it not inappropriate for random staff to state their unofficial, personal opinion on the matter because it may be misinterpreted as a staff ruling. If you are still determining the ins and outs of metarushing in staffchat, simply say so. The plethora of different views from staff present anything but a united front."

X - Last Tuesday at 1:14 PM
No. Any common sense with the reading of the rules will tell you that Moderators have the sole job of enforcing the rules and interpreting them during said enforcement to obtain punishment if needed. An administrator can make official split-second decisions regarding the rules and violations of said rules, and I can by power of knowledge gather that the people who make the rules are probably high-staff and therefore if I disagree with a decision I should probably post a staff-report / ban-appeal or ask them clarification.

[Aestel]

If the mechanics in the game aren't doing what they're supposed to be doing, change them. If we ignore staff being eager to punish metarushing (from marines), it's obvious that it's tough to enforce since anyone can say they saw a xeno or were lured to the hive by young runner 420. On that prison round Aestell, you checked the security cameras, and sent squads to where they were out. That's smart! Prisoners would of course cut the cameras if there was a riot, and it'd probably be the first thing an experienced team would check.

I also did it from the prison's own consoles to be clear in medium security, because seeing them from the ship IS considered to be meta(something about networked cameras or something WHICH is something else that should be fixed). That was also the first note that I am referring too. The second one was given after the podlocks were down and half the T3s lured delta down the hallway along the south, so naturally I sent extra men to support it because falling back while engaged is actually impossible in CM.

I spoke with a moderator and they confirmed that it was okay for staff below heads to make rulings based on their own interpretation of the rules.

They are also to be held accountable for exercising that right as per rule 0. In this case, I think there is far too much ambiguity between what is acceptable and what isn't since it really depends on the admin.

[BillyBoBBizWorth]

make rulings based on their own interpretation of the rules.

That tells you everything.

[Nickvr628]

If there are timelocks on the metarushing becomes null. This seems like a case of xenos needing to learn to use their OPness and git gud, instead of limiting marines even further.

[Nantei]

The concept of metarushing even being possible on maps other than Big Red is pretty absurd to me. Those maps have locks in place to prevent that very thing, and the way it works the only way to go after those go down is to the hive. Big Red is different because you can meta rush the hive and just fuck up Xenos, but that's very blatant. Ice doesn't really matter because who the hell cares what marines do on Ice?

[Arbs]

I was once warned as XO for metarushing caves in LV (fog falls at 1250) because I mentioned them in briefing. They didn't notice the part where we were to set up T-Fort first. Then the mod disconnected before we got demolished by xenos at 1253-1258 server time. How's that for a meta rush?

[Kasius]

I honestly think the fact of the matter is that different mods/admins have different interpretations of what is meta-rushing and what is not.

I agree with Aestel in the call to get some sort of common ground ruling to better help XOs and aCOs know what their limits are in order to avoid misunderstandings.

[Blade2000Br]

*Boop

As for the "Every time the Marines win it's meta!" thing people toss around, the reason we tell people not to just steamroll into the hive is because we don't want 30-45 minute rounds every game. These kinds of rounds only novel because they specifically don't happen every round. There's a general time we aim for when it comes to round lengths, which literally every game in the world has a general length of time they aim for. We enforce this as an OOC thing because Dev's don't have the time to keep every issue of meta-rushing sealed off. We all give our time freely and Devs want to make new features for the game, not just limit our map design because some people want to b-line to the hive with the attempt to wipe it. We like to just trust players will try to do the best thing for the round but if it's felt the round was not of enjoyment (going for both Xeno and Marine victory), we will ask people not to do something like that again. It's either treated as an OOC problem or we'll just have to add IC limits on the game.

Since you asked for it, here's Emerald's ruling.
If you don't believe it's Emerald I am quoting, here's the thread:
http://cm-ss13.com/viewtop ... &start=100

There's your answer. Peace.

[Symbiosis]

*Boop


Since you asked for it, here's Emerald's ruling.
If you don't believe it's Emerald I am quoting, here's the thread:
http://cm-ss13.com/viewtop ... &start=100

There's your answer. Peace.

That’s not formal at all. That’s vague and ambiguous.

Did you not read what was requested? At all?

The Devs and Head Staff have added time locks, fog, etc, all to prevent what they viewed as rushing. Moving the goal posts and threatening to ban players is BAD. It’s disingenous to the player base and frankly insulting to suggest that it’s acceptable behavior to punish based on random feelings and then pretend like it’s the players fault.

We’re not damn mind readers. Players shouldn’t feel like they’re going to get banned for not reading some power abusers mind or doing things the way THEY would.

[Blade2000Br]

That’s not formal at all. That’s vague and ambiguous.

Did you not read what was requested? At all?

The Devs and Head Staff have added time locks, fog, etc, all to prevent what they viewed as rushing. Moving the goal posts and threatening to ban players is BAD. It’s disingenous to the player base and frankly insulting to suggest that it’s acceptable behavior to punish based on random feelings and then pretend like it’s the players fault.

We’re not damn mind readers. Players shouldn’t feel like they’re going to get banned for not reading some power abusers mind or doing things the way THEY would.

This is the ruling, reason and why we enforce the way we do.

It's no use making a entire announcements post to write basically what could be resumed like that. You asked for a ruling, you got it. If you disagree with it, then that's other problem.