DEV QA #1 Discussion

Generic, on-topic discussion about Colonial Marines.
Post Reply
User avatar
NethIafins
Registered user
Posts: 772
Joined: 20 Nov 2016, 20:32
Location: Ukraine
Byond: NethIafins
Steam: nethiafin
Contact:

DEV QA #1 Discussion

Post by NethIafins » 13 Dec 2018, 09:49

Link to dev QA: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1iwT ... iw6us/edit

Date of next QA start: 12/16/2018
End of question collection: 12/23/2018
Expected date for answers for dev QA #2: 12/30/2018

DO NOT POST NEW QUESTIONS HERE

Only discussion on the existing answers is allowed, please don't make me regret my decision to create this topic.
Image
Image
Brother!
Do you remember our home and mother?
I'll die, don't bother.
It's just like walking on water.
- Cold Rain, Swirekster 2017, Twisted Insurrection OST

User avatar
ThesoldierLLJK
Registered user
Posts: 1082
Joined: 29 May 2018, 15:08
Location: Florida
Byond: ThesoldierLLJK
Steam: thesoldier20

Re: DEV QA #1 Discussion

Post by ThesoldierLLJK » 13 Dec 2018, 09:56

I have a serious question.
When every developer talks about the whitelist roles, especially predators, Awan and you said it best.
Awan: I am not whitelisted for pred myself. This means I also do not get to play them. So it is not likely I am going to implement major changes to preds. So in general I have to listen to others for what they like to see in preds. Now, in general afaik there is nothing big planned for preds right now.

Neth: Ditto. It’s quite hard for devs to get whitelists, because we are often spectating or making events/tests
You guys are given ADMIN abilities to spawn things, and run events. How can we as a community expect our developers to make sure a role is proper/balanced if you can't play it. Granted Piachu is a predator, but even then he's a coder. Why can't you guys be given the whitelists as developers as you already do major stuff for the server. If people want to argue "BUT THEY DIDNT APPLY" I think needing a formal education in software/coding should negate that, plus the fact you guys already run events with admin abilities, and could potentially make a bad round with a mistake as much as an admin could.

That really needs to change in my opinion.

Forgot to ask my question.

Can you talk with Emerald Blood and give you guys the ability to play these roles?
Last edited by ThesoldierLLJK on 13 Dec 2018, 12:38, edited 2 times in total.

User avatar
FGRSentinel
Registered user
Posts: 349
Joined: 06 Jul 2018, 17:17
Byond: FGRSentinel

Re: DEV QA #1 Discussion

Post by FGRSentinel » 13 Dec 2018, 10:12

The QA results make it kinda confusing because of the differing response the devs give on similar topics either because they answered questions at different times or they just have different opinions. For instance, looking at CAS:

Q2, Neth indicates that it's something that's going to be worked on after Nightmare for Prison and Nightmare tools for admins are done, while Awan indicates it's not in the "Big Five" and therefore not actively being worked on.

Q57, Neth mentions it seemingly split between two different tasks out of six on their list.

Q73, Awan briefly mentions that CAS weapons are going to be reworked and that, like objectives (the last of the currently mentioned Big Five), it'll be worked on after the new map.

Personally, I like the idea of there being a QA, but as a PO this raises more questions for me than it provides answers for. Perhaps in future QAs if there's any clearly conflicting answers given for a question there should be an indicator of which response is more in line with the dev team's general opinion on the matter to make it less confusing?
Ensign Goddard Pearsall, the Pilot that always has Souto

User avatar
NethIafins
Registered user
Posts: 772
Joined: 20 Nov 2016, 20:32
Location: Ukraine
Byond: NethIafins
Steam: nethiafin
Contact:

Re: DEV QA #1 Discussion

Post by NethIafins » 13 Dec 2018, 10:20

FGRSentinel wrote:
13 Dec 2018, 10:12
-snip-
Answers like this should give you more insight and be more open in general

CAS not being on the "list of 5" means that it won't be done before one of big 5 ends... but I just ended nightmare for prison
Image
Image
Brother!
Do you remember our home and mother?
I'll die, don't bother.
It's just like walking on water.
- Cold Rain, Swirekster 2017, Twisted Insurrection OST

User avatar
FGRSentinel
Registered user
Posts: 349
Joined: 06 Jul 2018, 17:17
Byond: FGRSentinel

Re: DEV QA #1 Discussion

Post by FGRSentinel » 13 Dec 2018, 10:30

Something to look forward to, then. Still, I suppose for me personally it'd be nice that if two devs give answers that go against each other if there was an indicator to say where the dev team overall was on it, you know?
Ensign Goddard Pearsall, the Pilot that always has Souto

User avatar
NethIafins
Registered user
Posts: 772
Joined: 20 Nov 2016, 20:32
Location: Ukraine
Byond: NethIafins
Steam: nethiafin
Contact:

Re: DEV QA #1 Discussion

Post by NethIafins » 13 Dec 2018, 10:35

FGRSentinel wrote:
13 Dec 2018, 10:30
Something to look forward to, then. Still, I suppose for me personally it'd be nice that if two devs give answers that go against each other if there was an indicator to say where the dev team overall was on it, you know?
If there are two answers that apparently go against each other, have in mind that we reviewed each other's answers multiple times

Like from 3 answers you looked at, I can draw conclusion that: cas is lower on the list, cas will be worked by neth, cas will have new weapons and mechanics

All of that is true
Image
Image
Brother!
Do you remember our home and mother?
I'll die, don't bother.
It's just like walking on water.
- Cold Rain, Swirekster 2017, Twisted Insurrection OST

User avatar
spookydonut
Registered user
Posts: 457
Joined: 13 Oct 2017, 02:08
Byond: spookydonut

Re: DEV QA #1 Discussion

Post by spookydonut » 13 Dec 2018, 12:13

I think a lot of the issues about communications stem from staff assuming that all players are on discord and or the forums when this is not the case. See: players on the forums never seeing information only on discord or players on discord never reading the forums.

User avatar
kastion
Registered user
Posts: 485
Joined: 02 Sep 2016, 16:56
Byond: MasterShakeEz

Re: DEV QA #1 Discussion

Post by kastion » 13 Dec 2018, 12:30

spookydonut wrote:
13 Dec 2018, 12:13
I think a lot of the issues about communications stem from staff assuming that all players are on discord and or the forums when this is not the case. See: players on the forums never seeing information only on discord or players on discord never reading the forums.
thats true, im not on discord but im spamming the forums constantly.

User avatar
NethIafins
Registered user
Posts: 772
Joined: 20 Nov 2016, 20:32
Location: Ukraine
Byond: NethIafins
Steam: nethiafin
Contact:

Re: DEV QA #1 Discussion

Post by NethIafins » 13 Dec 2018, 14:06

spookydonut wrote:
13 Dec 2018, 12:13
I think a lot of the issues about communications stem from staff assuming that all players are on discord and or the forums when this is not the case. See: players on the forums never seeing information only on discord or players on discord never reading the forums.
I posted link to this multiple times in game

I always announce QA question collection in game
Image
Image
Brother!
Do you remember our home and mother?
I'll die, don't bother.
It's just like walking on water.
- Cold Rain, Swirekster 2017, Twisted Insurrection OST

User avatar
spartanbobby
Registered user
Posts: 274
Joined: 20 Jun 2015, 20:58
Location: Scotland
Byond: spartanbobby

Re: DEV QA #1 Discussion

Post by spartanbobby » 13 Dec 2018, 18:56

Why is my name on a question I didn't ask
!!! John 'Spartan' Murry Hulij thar'n !!! Pred Council Man

User avatar
TheMaskedMan2
Registered user
Posts: 821
Joined: 15 Feb 2017, 12:37
Location: United States, Georgia
Byond: TheMaskedMan2

Re: DEV QA #1 Discussion

Post by TheMaskedMan2 » 13 Dec 2018, 21:05

spartanbobby wrote:
13 Dec 2018, 18:56
Why is my name on a question I didn't ask
I bet someone asked a question and put their ckey as yours. Maybe.
Certified RP Professional™
Marine: Vera Webb
Synthetic: Sybil
Predator: Vaya'Nylk

User avatar
Avalanchee
Registered user
Posts: 965
Joined: 12 Feb 2018, 05:17
Location: Brig
Byond: Avalanchee
Steam: Avalanche

Re: DEV QA #1 Discussion

Post by Avalanchee » 14 Dec 2018, 00:24

spartanbobby wrote:
13 Dec 2018, 18:56
Why is my name on a question I didn't ask
Now that's a good question
Phillip 'Avalanche' Murray
They are actually very balanced. The difference is ya get marines who think they can rambo a xeno and when they die, they get all salty about it.Mizari 10/12/2018, Xeno mutators
Expert at friendly fire, girls and weapons.
Deltard from inside n' outside

User avatar
NethIafins
Registered user
Posts: 772
Joined: 20 Nov 2016, 20:32
Location: Ukraine
Byond: NethIafins
Steam: nethiafin
Contact:

Re: DEV QA #1 Discussion

Post by NethIafins » 14 Dec 2018, 02:15

TheMaskedMan2 wrote:
13 Dec 2018, 21:05
I bet someone asked a question and put their ckey as yours. Maybe.
Most likely. We had few questions like that, that were more obvious in mis-attribution that I deleted. We have no control over who leaves what ckey yet
Image
Image
Brother!
Do you remember our home and mother?
I'll die, don't bother.
It's just like walking on water.
- Cold Rain, Swirekster 2017, Twisted Insurrection OST

User avatar
awan
Registered user
Posts: 581
Joined: 11 Mar 2018, 18:11
Location: Houten, Utrecht, NL
Byond: Awan
Steam: Awan
Contact:

Re: DEV QA #1 Discussion

Post by awan » 14 Dec 2018, 04:20

ThesoldierLLJK wrote:
13 Dec 2018, 09:56
I have a serious question.
When every developer talks about the whitelist roles, especially predators, Awan and you said it best.



You guys are given ADMIN abilities to spawn things, and run events. How can we as a community expect our developers to make sure a role is proper/balanced if you can't play it. Granted Piachu is a predator, but even then he's a coder. Why can't you guys be given the whitelists as developers as you already do major stuff for the server. If people want to argue "BUT THEY DIDNT APPLY" I think needing a formal education in software/coding should negate that, plus the fact you guys already run events with admin abilities, and could potentially make a bad round with a mistake as much as an admin could.

That really needs to change in my opinion.

Forgot to ask my question.

Can you talk with Emerald Blood and give you guys the ability to play these roles?
We did but it got "this is why we can't have nice thingsed"
From what I understood the person who made the preds abused them a few times in game.
Heck even the head dev still got it and we ran into issues with that.
I also would not like to see people apply for coder/mapper/spriter because they would get all whitelists.

It is also very stressing to have to punish staff/dev's for in-game behavior.
That is just very shitty for both sides it is not a fun conversation to have.
And the question will get raised if something does go wrong why does this person have the whitelist without sending in an application.

We also have to develop for stuff we never play that is just part of the job.
Like I am 99% sure none of us play cargo on a regular basis.
This means that we just have to deal with it.

Last but not least I do think that if someone has admin they can already abuse in ways that cause bigger issues.
It is very very easy to deal with a ruined round because of a dev having the best intentions but ruining a round.
But with a slipup ingame that is a bit harder because people do not see pred players as there to give others fun.

In general it is the policy if you don't like it take it up with the heads but I am quite sure it was done with good reason.
Image

User avatar
awan
Registered user
Posts: 581
Joined: 11 Mar 2018, 18:11
Location: Houten, Utrecht, NL
Byond: Awan
Steam: Awan
Contact:

Re: DEV QA #1 Discussion

Post by awan » 14 Dec 2018, 04:29

FGRSentinel wrote:
13 Dec 2018, 10:12
The QA results make it kinda confusing because of the differing response the devs give on similar topics either because they answered questions at different times or they just have different opinions. For instance, looking at CAS:

Q2, Neth indicates that it's something that's going to be worked on after Nightmare for Prison and Nightmare tools for admins are done, while Awan indicates it's not in the "Big Five" and therefore not actively being worked on.

Q57, Neth mentions it seemingly split between two different tasks out of six on their list.

Q73, Awan briefly mentions that CAS weapons are going to be reworked and that, like objectives (the last of the currently mentioned Big Five), it'll be worked on after the new map.

Personally, I like the idea of there being a QA, but as a PO this raises more questions for me than it provides answers for. Perhaps in future QAs if there's any clearly conflicting answers given for a question there should be an indicator of which response is more in line with the dev team's general opinion on the matter to make it less confusing?
The dev QA took a bit longer than expected. I did miss the last dev meeting for good reason.
Q2 we were only at the time working on the big 5 until one of those get done we wont be moved on to the next item.
Cas has been discussed but code was not being written for it at the time. (That might change now but nightmare is not yet in.)
In general, since it is not actively being developed and has no deadline the way we implement it (all at once or in small stages) is bound to change over time.
At the time it was still the question what would be done first on the big 5. Honestly 3 of the 5 were "nearly" done. (Prison nightmare, Mutators and desert dam.)
That means that even if it's between 2 new items it would get in.

In the next meeting we will likely discuss what the next big 5 will be since 3 will likely be done this month.
Image

User avatar
FGRSentinel
Registered user
Posts: 349
Joined: 06 Jul 2018, 17:17
Byond: FGRSentinel

Re: DEV QA #1 Discussion

Post by FGRSentinel » 14 Dec 2018, 07:27

Well, I can't wait to see what happens then. Hopefully CAS sees a massive boost in usefulness in the right hands after the rework.
Ensign Goddard Pearsall, the Pilot that always has Souto

User avatar
KingKire
Registered user
Posts: 893
Joined: 30 May 2016, 11:53

Re: DEV QA #1 Discussion

Post by KingKire » 18 Dec 2018, 22:25

I read through the whole thing, and im happy that you guys replied. its always nice seeing the human face on the other side of the screen, and that you guys are players too.

thanks for replying to our questions.
Gaze upon me,
for I have wandered deep into the ancient tombs of knowledge to which lie madness and sorrow, cleansing a path for all those who walk behind me...


...

But seriously, does uh, anyone know the way out?!


~Furthermore, I consider that Floodlights should no longer be destroyed.~

User avatar
BillyBoBBizWorth
Registered user
Posts: 327
Joined: 13 Mar 2018, 18:07

Re: DEV QA #1 Discussion

Post by BillyBoBBizWorth » 19 Dec 2018, 06:45

Good turn out, considering you have 150+ players at some stages, high population times of the year.

Tells you everything.Your really attracting the players to have their say.Theres more of a turn out on "memeZ" posts than the official "have your say and get shit changed" posts....

Maybe your next one is more attractive/effective, because this kind of response in the way of quantity is pathetic.
Max Dallas has been hit in the chest by the M40 HEDP grenade.

I will murder you Brittany Breeze

"It was a fantastic round. If the CO hadn't cryo'ed before the end I'd have bothered him to give at least two more medals. To PFC Max Dallas, who kept doing the path between the frontlines to FOB (the only place with medical aid) with a roller bed, and saved a lot of marines who'd have husked otherwise. And to Dr. Haley Altman, who after all medics were gone was fixing us time and again for hours straight. At the end there were over 10 patients around her either dead or in crit, and she just kept going."

User avatar
NethIafins
Registered user
Posts: 772
Joined: 20 Nov 2016, 20:32
Location: Ukraine
Byond: NethIafins
Steam: nethiafin
Contact:

Re: DEV QA #1 Discussion

Post by NethIafins » 21 Dec 2018, 02:51

BillyBoBBizWorth wrote:
19 Dec 2018, 06:45
Good turn out, considering you have 150+ players at some stages, high population times of the year.

Tells you everything.Your really attracting the players to have their say.Theres more of a turn out on "memeZ" posts than the official "have your say and get shit changed" posts....

Maybe your next one is more attractive/effective, because this kind of response in the way of quantity is pathetic.
Yeah I feel stupid now since I was only posting this in ooc, announces, etc when I was online. Also asking others to do my job was silly.

Lesson learned, and since I have access to MOTD file, next questioner will be there and proudly visible to everyone.

I don't want to @here everyone in discord because this is annoying as fuck.

Also next QA will probably grab your ckey from the game and just ask if you want to share the key
Image
Image
Brother!
Do you remember our home and mother?
I'll die, don't bother.
It's just like walking on water.
- Cold Rain, Swirekster 2017, Twisted Insurrection OST

Post Reply