Renamed. [x2] Advises from experience players for humans.

Generic, on-topic discussion about Colonial Marines.
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Renamed. [x2] Advises from experience players for humans.

Post by Jeser » 08 Aug 2015, 04:25

Okay, well, I was so pissed yesterday from that ridiculous rule about shuttle, so I left game before end and forgot to say about my opinion on that round. So, I gonna splash out my irritation with Command staff and esspecially CO. Well.

If EVERYONE INCLUDING BOs AND XO don't follow your orders, then, maybe, not THEY are retarded, but "someone else" is? Yes, I'm looking at you, Lcass Semaphor. I don't know what the shit happened to you in that round. You was quite good in previous games. But your orders in that round... I started suspecting a disaster in brief already, when you ordered Alpha to set up FoB in engineering and all other squads to unite and explore colony. I hope I don't need to say, how stupid is it? Well, our SL went braindead (thank you, really. It would be much worse for everyone, if you tried to force us to follow stupid CO's orders). Well, we arrived, Alpha went to engineering, Delta and Charlie split up and... I don't even want to describe this behavior. Anyway, Bravo was standing in LZ, waiting for detailed and normal orders. Finally, we said "Fuck that", I started to fortify LZ and told/ordered others to occupy dome, I said, that we will make FoB in it. One engineer from Delta helped us to fortify main dome, thank you too. We started arguing with command, said "fuck you, CO" several times. Mutiny at it's finest. Guess, what squad didn't have casualties except Joseph, who was temporarily out of action, because he was facehugged and operated on Sulaco? And in which FoB remains of marines arrived?

Later nearly everyone mutined and, dunno how, but CO was killed with grenade launcher. That is bad way to command.

I'm so pissed off that even my laziness ran away.

So, I wrote a little "guide" for human-players. (Actually, it's kinda list of advises.)

All marines.
  1. You SHOULD follow orders. That is VERY inportant. But don't forget to switch your brains ON. If there were 5 of you, 3 of you got hugged and you didn't manage to kill any aliens, retreat. You will save them only if aliens are very stupid or unrobust. And better not to think in such way. It is important to know, when you should retreat.
  2. If SL, acting SL or OO asks for a role call, FUCKING ANSWER THEM! I can bet, that you can find 4 seconds to type: "North, under attack!" or "Help, engineering!" even if you shooting aliens, you aren't doing that without breaks.
  3. As a any marine your best friend is pulling your squad mates back if they are incapacitated or the aliens are charging and they are injured, also another thing is that you should be shaking up marines who are in incapacitated from just having a hugger ripped off or they have been neuroed (If in a safe area otherwise drag them the fuck back to a safer area) by Mr. Penguin
  4. If you was ordered to fall back, you should fall back. That is that special order, that you have to follow in 99% of times, because if you and your friend didn't retreat and your whole squad did - you are fucked up.
Standards.
  1. Hold your positions if in FoB and stay in formation, when in move.
  2. Protect and cover your specialists. Even if they are went to westroom to piss. No kidding. You can never know, where enemy will fuck your squad's specialist. They are most vulnerable, because they have much shit to do and pretty often their weapon in their suit storage slot. Best strategy is to find your engineer or medic without cover and stick to him/her and always have him/her in sight.
Engineers.
  1. Scavenge metal from everything you can if you have the opportunity.
  2. Fake walls, fake walls are everywhere. But, if you make them, tell at least your squad their location.
  3. Do not risk yourself in combat, that's standard's job
    • While preparing defences, think not only about "how well it will stop them". It won't stop aliens for ever anyway. Think about "Will it allow us free movement and retrieval of the wounded".
    • Use elecrtified grills right: You should use them for is outlining your killzones and channels leading to your defences, preferably with glass on the side you're facing. That means xenos can't wildly strafe under your fire or they risk getting electrocuted. Postby Derpislav
Medics.
  1. Please, at least TRY to bring marine to safe area before starting doing serious healing.
  2. Check TWICE, that you took medical HUD, otherwise, get back and take it.
  3. Do not risk yourself in combat, that's standard's job.
    • Prioritize your injuries. Imagine there are two marines.
      Marine A: fractured limb requires splinting, limb is bleeding, has a minor head wound and 59 damage to the chest.
      Marine B: has a fractured limb, limb requires splinting, the limb is also bleeding, and has another unknown fracture.
    • Do NOT fully heal either player until both of their bleeding is stopped. It doesn't matter how pissed off the player is that he isn't at full health, or how much he yells at you to fix him. The other, less severe point I wanted to make was to not waste materials. by Biolock
    • Medical supplies are scattered all around the map.
    • Tramadol is the difference between slowly limping away from the threat and getting right back into the fight, but don't overdose it.
    • If you can't stay near someone to keep treating them, but they're already stable, inject them with tricord or give it to them in the inaprov+dylo pill form. by Derpislav
Squad Leaders
  1. Protect your squad from stupid orders and themselves.
  2. Try to watch over squadmates and always know, where are they and what are they doing.
  3. You have supply beacons. Don't forget about them.
  4. If you don't need/have space for grenades, give them to well-known and competent marines in your squad.
  5. Command only gives you only direction and destination, but YOU choose how your squad will execute order and is it at all possible. Remember, you don't see whole picture of battlefield, but you see detailed picture of your part of battlefield. (What I mean, better to follow general orders, since command staff have reports from all squds. However, you should first think of more specialised orders for your squad, instead of blindly executing them, because command staff can't know your squad's situation better than you do.
  6. Don't be afraid to argue Command, if you are really sure, that your squad can't execute order. ("Move to northern cave, set up beacon and try to retrieve captured marines." "Negative, we lost two squad sthere, nearly 15 people, I can't do that with only 6."
  7. Assigning an assistant squad lead (ASL), can be really handy in helping you enforce your orders, and just to have a backup clearly defined for if you have a surprise disconnect. The ASL should focus on keeping track of who is alive/missing/dead, make sure that an order is understood and being followed out, and being the extra pair of hands or eyes that the SL needs. (e.g. if the team is broken into two, the SL can check one group, while the ASL checks the other.) by Thrain
Spec Ops
  1. You have VERY expensive and rare eqipment, you are responsible for it. Don't risk yourself.
  2. B18 armor users don't count. Those crazy and badass fucks can do what they want. NO. FOLLOW ORDERS. NO REMBOS!
  3. If you need ammo, ask SL, DO NOT LEAVE YOUR WEAPON ON THE GROUND. (yes, I really saw one SPec left his scoped rifle, cause "no clips left".
CO/XO
  1. First of all, PLEASE, do not try be original and innovative. Do not order to make FoB NOT in main dome. Sadly, this map gives us only one good spot for FoB, it is main dome, right next to LZ. I never saw good successfull FoB outside main dome. Also, first thing, that should do deploying forces after arriving is fortify and make LZ safe. It's basic for most of operations, people. If you not follow these simple points, you will lead marines to disaster, Commander.
  2. You can make more additionalsmall event-like orders (bring some exact object or something) but don't change whole strategy. There is a normal procedure of investigating dead colonies: deploy, make a safezone/FoB, start exploring.
  3. Marines are useless important, competent (believe so) and deadly (for each other) forces. They are not meat for slaughter (yes, the... NO, THEY ARE NOT).
  4. Take care of your lovely pets and they will love you. You are taking responsibility for every marine lost of battlefield. You will write letters to their families (if you survive, of course). So, don't order stupid things, like: "We lost whole squad! Send another one to death rescue them". That's one is really stupid. If under your grate command whole squad went MIA, then you did something wrong and you should rethink your tactic. Say other squads to return to FoB. Don't hope for something, lean on actual intel from SLs and adjust strategy based on these reports. Good CO know, when it is time for retreat and regroup.
  5. Do not send squad down there without active SL. Do not count that SL will come later, very possible, he won't. Do not LET squad deploy without active SL, who understood his orders. Squad without SL will die or say "fuck you" and will be totaly right.
  6. If WHOLE SQUAD refuses to follow your order, then most likely there is an actual reason for that. Don't shout at them and find out that reason.
BO/OO
  1. If you don't know how to Overwatch go and read guide from Abbsynth.
  2. Need to DC? Warn Command staff about that through LOOC or "I feel very bad, I need to go take a nap."
MPs
  • One of you can be pilot of shuttle. It will help marines A LOT. by Steelpoint
RO/CT
  1. Order two-three webbing crate right after round start. Really.
  2. For example of RO politic. My rules as RO: two attachments per marine, three for SL. Flashlights doesn't count, cause they are printable. Holster on request, webbing and load bearment for everyone, Webbing VEST ONLY for engineers and medics. With such politic everyone will remain satisfied except one-two greedy or egoistic marines. Fuck them anyway. Non-combatant personnel, including MPs cannot receive any attachments, except flashlight, if they are not XO/SM going to FOB. In that case, they can come to me and I will give them three attachments.
    • As the RO, use the command headset you're issued to act proactive. If you hear "They took my rifle!" don't wait for the BO to ask you for a supply drop, start preparing one. If you hear Bravo being issued to FOB duty, prepare a crate of medical and engineering supplies for them.
    • Also a good idea is to prepare a crate of 5 rifles, 6 belts (pistol, knife, 6 mags), MRE box and flare box as soon as the attachment rush is over. by Derpislav
CE/MT
  1. PLEASE, DON'T FUCK UP WITH ENGINE. THAT'S ALL WHAT WE NEED FROM YOU.
  2. Well, actually, one more. Please, sometimes come to hangar with reinforced glass and rods to fix broken shuttle's windows. Marines will be appreciated.
SM/CMO
  • Please, don't go all of you SSD or marines are fucked.
CL
  1. Try to find someone to RP with, but try to not bother busy jobs.
  2. By the way, you also have access to shuttle console, so you can save few marines asking for shuttle, if command busy and doesn't hear them. Or you can not, if you want aliens to breed more. Your choice.
  3. Use your fax machine to make reports of what's going on planet and Sulaco. That's can be pretty ineteresting. by FatalEYES
Researcher
  • Well, dunno... Do something usefull. I don't know what researcher can do, so no advises.

There is a fine line between disobeying order, because there is a reason why you can't do it and mutiny without a reason. You need to train how to feel that line and don't cross it without very big reason.

If someone doesn't agree with something there, I'm open for discussion, this isn't an actual guide, just advises, some of them, maybe, debatable for some people. So, let's discuss human side of game.

Well, looks like this already not only MY advises to players. Guess, time to rename post again. I wonder if it can become a general help guide XD
Last edited by Jeser on 11 Aug 2015, 01:18, edited 15 times in total.
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Re: About CO, general strategy, stupidness and mutinies

Post by Sargeantmuffinman » 08 Aug 2015, 04:35

Best advice EVER-ish.....

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Re: Renamed. Let's discuss human side of game

Post by Jeser » 08 Aug 2015, 05:28

Also, many people here can say, that I don't follow orders often. And that's true. Especially too risky and pointless ones. I also usually argue with Command staff, but also often give them advises. (the most funny part, that they really follow them pretty often XD). What I want to say. I always try to not disobey without good reason for it. I almost always have explanation of my behaviour and I can prove that I'm right. That's that "fine line" between IC disobeying in OOC bitching and mutiny without a reason.
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Re: Renamed. Let's discuss human side of game

Post by FatalEYES » 08 Aug 2015, 05:40

Huh. Didn't know that CL had access to the shuttle console. Looks like I'll be using that in the future.
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Re: Renamed. Let's discuss human side of game

Post by Jeser » 08 Aug 2015, 05:40

FatalEYES wrote:Huh. Didn't know that CL had access to the shuttle console. Looks like I'll be using that in the future.

Oops, I didn't tell you anything.
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Re: Renamed. Let's discuss human side of game

Post by FatalEYES » 08 Aug 2015, 06:07

Also, for a note on the CL if you want to add it. Actually send reports through your fax machine, whether it's discussing what's going on down on the planet, or informing them that the Sulaco has been invaded. Anything. It's part of the liasons job and can provide some interesting RP for them.
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Re: Renamed. Let's discuss human side of game. Advises included

Post by Steelpoint » 08 Aug 2015, 06:09

One thing MP's can do aside from going insane from nothing going on is to have one MP act as a Dropship pilot, making it easier for Marines to get on and off the planet on a regular basis instead of waiting forever for someone to hit the switch.
This is war, survival is your responsibility.

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Re: Renamed. Let's discuss human side of game. Advises included

Post by Jeser » 08 Aug 2015, 06:30

Added both advises.
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Re: Renamed. Let's discuss human side of game. Advises included

Post by Biolock » 08 Aug 2015, 08:18

I'd like to add a few things for combat medics.

Prioritize your injuries. Imagine there are two marines.

Marine A: fractured limb requires splinting, limb is bleeding, has a minor head wound and 59 damage to the chest.

Marine B: has a fractured limb, limb requires splinting, the limb is also bleeding, and has another unknown fracture.

What is the correct operation for this situation? The answer is stop the bleeding of both patients BEFORE anything else. Do NOT fully heal either player until both of their bleeding is stopped. It doesn't matter how pissed off the player is that he isn't at full health, or how much he yells at you to fix him. Your job isn't to make a player happy, it's to keep them alive, and most of the time they don't know what's best. That bleeding that player two had could turn into severe oxy loss and death if not treated in time.

The other, less severe point I wanted to make was to not waste materials.

If a player has 20 oxy loss and 80% of their blood, don't waste a damn dex plus auto injector on them, their oxyloss will come right back. If you're about to head into a massive conflict with an entire batallion, don't use your advance trauma kits to patch up small injuries (anything less than 15 imho), you'll regret you did when a player is bleeding out and you don't have anything to treat him with. Here is my favorite one; when a player asks you to pump him full of tramadol, tell him you've only got lexorin and that they should go fuck themselves. Anything beyond a single pill is basically a waste. If you have a single unit of tramadol in your system, it will have the same effect as having 100, it just won't last as long (you OD at 70 btw, so don't do that). The standard administration of 10 units will last around 20 minutes, if they haven't recovered/ seeked futher help by then, they're probably already dead anyway.

I could go on and on about being careful with your resources, but I think that gets the point across.

I wrote this all on my phone so I apologize for any typos or spelling errors.
I'm stressing way too hard about what to put here, so I'm just gonna leave it blank.... or....

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Re: Renamed. Let's discuss human side of game. Advises included

Post by Jeser » 08 Aug 2015, 08:54

I added Biolock's advises to medics, but had to cut them a bit.
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Re: Renamed. Let's discuss human side of game. Advises included

Post by TopHatPenguin » 08 Aug 2015, 10:05

As a standard your best friend is pulling your squad mates back if they are incapacitated or the aliens are charging and they are injured, also another thing is that you should be shaking up marines who are in incapacitated from just having a hugger ripped off or they have been neuroed (If in a safe area otherwise drag them the fuck back to a safer area)
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Re: Renamed. Let's discuss human side of game. Advises included

Post by Jeser » 08 Aug 2015, 10:44

Mr. Penguin wrote:As a standard your best friend is pulling your squad mates back if they are incapacitated or the aliens are charging and they are injured, also another thing is that you should be shaking up marines who are in incapacitated from just having a hugger ripped off or they have been neuroed (If in a safe area otherwise drag them the fuck back to a safer area)
Added.
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Re: Renamed. Let's discuss human side of game. Advises included

Post by LordeKilly » 08 Aug 2015, 18:48

I'd like to add something! If it's encased and is fed from the underside of your rifle, it isn't a clip!
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Re: Renamed. Let's discuss human side of game. Advises included

Post by Derpislav » 08 Aug 2015, 19:33

Everyone knows. No one cares. Clip goes into a rifle, 5 letters. Magazine goes into a rifle, 9 letters. Everyone will know what do you mean by "clip" while understanding the difference. It's not okay to write about firearm construction and confuse these, it's perfectly okay to say "Ey, I'm running dry, grab me some spare clips" over the radio to your buddy.

People confusing these two rustle my jimmies only half as much as people that make their main goal in life to point it out.

Engineer:
While preparing defences, "how well it will stop them" is not the most important questions. Aliens will simply walk in a straight line slashing tables apart anyways. "Will it allow us free movement and retrieval of the wounded" is far more important. Zig-zagging mazes slow you thrice as much as a, for example, sides-middle-sides barricade, while doing nothing to the speed at which Xenos slash.
Electrified grilles are very cost-effective and serve a different purpose than you would think - you're not going to kill with them, aliens are players too, read - not stupid enough to walk into them. What you should use them for is outlining your killzones and channels leading to your defences, preferably with glass on the side you're facing. That means xenos can't wildly strafe under your fire or they risk getting electrocuted - and while they hesitate, you can get one more round in.

Medic: Medical supplies are scattered all around the map, and Sulaco has nanomeds EVERYWHERE. These save lives during emergencies. Learn the locations, for example burn kits and analyzers in main dome's dorms.
Tramadol is the difference between slowly limping away from the threat and getting right back into the fight, but don't overdose it. Two pills will already be toxic, and it doesn't get more effective with the amount.
If you can't stay near someone to keep treating them, but they're already stable, inject them with tricord or give it to them in the inaprov+dylo pill form. They will eventually get back up on their own, as long as they don't have organ damage.
Fractures start happening somewhere around 25 brute damage. To locate them, simply look for body parts over that threshold. Or ask the marine where it hurts, and hope he doesn't yell at you for being incompetent and not having an X-ray scanner in your eyes.
Burns cause a lot of pain, but it requires at least 3 spits to make them life-threatening. Tramadol them up, brute damage is a priority. Burns don't break bones.
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Re: Renamed. Let's discuss human side of game. Advises included

Post by LordeKilly » 08 Aug 2015, 21:28

Or you can say mag, it's a letter shorter :)
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Re: Renamed. [x2] Advises from experience players for humans.

Post by Jeser » 09 Aug 2015, 05:25

Updated. Added Derpi's advises in cut edition.
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Re: Renamed. [x2] Advises from experience players for humans.

Post by Dyne » 09 Aug 2015, 06:50

Derpi is very right on free movement. Sometimes marines box themselves in, with predictable results.
Preparing kill zones and lines of fire is much more important. If only two marines can shoot at the approaching menace you are not killing anyone.

Following orders is a...tricky question.
As a rule of thumb your character was trained to follow them as hard as possible.
CO/BO formulate a directive, SL/aSL interpretes it, rank and file follow.
Nothing more immersions killing then marine players disregarding discipline and playing democracy. If you got an order- you better follow it. (Especially if its a fallback order.)
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Re: Renamed. [x2] Advises from experience players for humans.

Post by Jeser » 09 Aug 2015, 07:11

Dyne wrote:Nothing more immersions killing then marine players disregarding discipline and playing democracy. If you got an order- you better follow it. (Especially if its a fallback order.)
Weird. From what I recall, when my squad has no SL and there are at least two familiar faces in squad, our squad with "democracy" have better survival chances then other. Thank you for reminder of fall back order, I should've mention that especcially.
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Re: Renamed. [x2] Advises from experience players for humans.

Post by Derpislav » 09 Aug 2015, 08:43

As the RO, use the command headset you're issued to act proactive. If you hear "They took my rifle!" don't wait for the BO to ask you for a supply drop, start preparing one. If you hear Bravo being issued to FOB duty, prepare a crate of medical and engineering supplies for them.
Also a good idea is to prepare a crate of 5 rifles, 6 belts (pistol, knife, 6 mags), MRE box and flare box as soon as the attachment rush is over.
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Re: Renamed. [x2] Advises from experience players for humans.

Post by Jeser » 09 Aug 2015, 09:08

Derpislav wrote:As the RO, use the command headset you're issued to act proactive. If you hear "They took my rifle!" don't wait for the BO to ask you for a supply drop, start preparing one. If you hear Bravo being issued to FOB duty, prepare a crate of medical and engineering supplies for them.
Also a good idea is to prepare a crate of 5 rifles, 6 belts (pistol, knife, 6 mags), MRE box and flare box as soon as the attachment rush is over.
Added.
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Re: Renamed. [x2] Advises from experience players for humans.

Post by Dyne » 09 Aug 2015, 10:42

Jeser wrote: Weird. From what I recall, when my squad has no SL and there are at least two familiar faces in squad, our squad with "democracy" have better survival chances then other. Thank you for reminder of fall back order, I should've mention that especcially.
Thats "cohesion"- when you wordlessly understand each other, cover corners, keep eyes on each other, and generally trust and support.
"Democracy" is when orders are questioned by the rank and file, constantly, with a direct superior present.
Bonus points for calling a direct superior "retard".
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Re: Renamed. [x2] Advises from experience players for humans.

Post by Jeser » 09 Aug 2015, 11:24

Dyne wrote:Bonus points for calling a direct superior "retard".
Damn, I do that every round.
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Re: Renamed. [x2] Advises from experience players for humans.

Post by Thrain » 10 Aug 2015, 20:48

A note for Squad Leaders: Assigning an assistant squad lead (ASL), can be really handy in helping you enforce your orders, and just to have a backup clearly defined for if you have a surprise disconnect. The ASL should focus on keeping track of who is alive/missing/dead, make sure that an order is understood and being followed out, and being the extra pair of hands or eyes that the SL needs. (e.g. if the team is broken into two, the SL can check one group, while the ASL checks the other.)

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Re: Renamed. [x2] Advises from experience players for humans.

Post by Nikov » 12 Aug 2015, 00:22

If there's a smartass in your squad harassing your squad leader, don't allow it. Shout the joker down and make it clear nobody likes his bullshit. Smartasses ruin squad cohesion and get your squad killed. Your squad leader needs to fight and have the confidence of those who don't know better. If you think you know better, squad lead next round, smartass.
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Re: Renamed. [x2] Advises from experience players for humans.

Post by Jeser » 12 Aug 2015, 01:26

Nikov wrote:If there's a smartass in your squad harassing your squad leader, don't allow it. Shout the joker down and make it clear nobody likes his bullshit. Smartasses ruin squad cohesion and get your squad killed. Your squad leader needs to fight and have the confidence of those who don't know better. If you think you know better, squad lead next round, smartass.
Ve-e-ery debatable. Depends on who arguing, who is SL and how he behave and so on.. I sometimes argue with Command staff and/or SL. And most of times happens that I'm right.

It's more "If you don't know how to SL, don't take this position before you read some guides and watched other good SLs."
Jeser "Fox" Aushwitz.
Jeser believes only in one thing - common sense.

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