Gameplay Discussion: Predators

[GreyouTT]

Holy fuck predators cant catch aliens with the new update so you cant even kill them.

It does make sense at least. They are hunters after all, wouldn't be much sport if they could easily catch up to them.

[TeknoKot]

Recently I've seen Predators just keep on siding with marines like almost entire rounds they're on and instead of picking a target even if their original is SSD, they calmly come to a marine and ask for a fight? The hell? You're predators, not even allied with either side, you're supposed to hunt.

[an confused rock]

Jesus, preds are nigh-impossible to kill, and incredibly unfair in every way. they can cloak immediately after being downed, and yet they themselves seem to have an infinite taser as well as an infinite ROCKET LAUNCHER, as well as a fucking wizard den with more stuff basically, as well as an exception allowing them to BREACH. not to mention they count as marines EVEN IN THEIR WIZARD DEN THEY CAN TELEPORT BACK TO. did I mention that they can cloak and escape immediately after being stunned, with no downsides even after being injured? and that it seems it is currently tolerated in the rules for them to smash windows and throw harpoons when cloaked, as long as they are not KILLING anyone, even when not provoked?
>be normal marine with a machete and a normal rifle with AP
>pred is being shit, smashing windows... while cloaked
>refuses to fight (and shakes its head, like that is something it would understand means no? and did I mention it was CLOAKED WHILE SHAKING ITS HEAD? visual gestures while invisible.)
>throws a harpoon while cloaked
>thats the fuck it
>tell it to go fuck itself
>throw the harpoon back at it and impale it, it decloaks, knock it down with my machete
>pred cloaks and runs away after I AP the shit out of it, only escaping because the cloak seems to negate stuns and it has some infinite taser rifle bullshit
>it managed to beat me up, but I survive without internal bleeding or fractures or anything\
>later
>pred is at atmos
>"didn't you hear me the first time? fuck you"
>knock it down with the machete again
>it takes out its knife before getting knocked down
>grab the stick with 2 knives on it thingy
>before I can do anything, it cloaks
>reappears nearby
>stuns the shit out of me with its meme taser
>survive because other marines cover me, still have a fractured skull and internal bleeding
>limp to the pod and close the shutters before it can get in
>competent BO sends it up
>med takes about 5 minutes to cure my cancer
>healing up the bloodloss (I was at 70%) with helmet burritos
>come back to the pod to go finish the pred
>"oh look, its the command pod from secure storage"
>a fucking pred ejects
>tries to tase me again
>we kick its ass because it is too unrobust
>still end up in paincrit on the floor though because its knife is too ridiculously damaging
>medic about to give me painkillers
>it explodes
>causes a breach, which it is allowed to.

>pictured: the dead co on the bottom
>not pictured: the fact that this co is having their first time and was very competent (and literally the nicest co I have ever seen), but feels guilty and decides not to try co again for a while
>also not pictured: the fact that those are stacks of bodies, not individual ones.
>also also not pictured: the pred being extremely salty, saying we are all shitty thiefs (says the pred stealing a mech)
>also also also not pictured: the breach was sent down with the pod, causing a breach on the planet as well.
>arguably pictured: this causing a xeno victory.
>important as fuck but not pictured: those were 2 different predators, but the second one still felt like it needed to hunt me down

[LordeKilly]

Predators:

1. Do not have infinite tasers or rocket launchers, it's part of their plasma pool. if they deplete it, they're basically fucked because they can't cloak, shoot, or heal.

2. Only breach when they die.

3. Get to choose 2-3 items that can be used in combat, there is a little promt where you choose your equipment, and it's very limited to what you can have at once. Usually one melee, one ranged weapon and one special weapon. This does not include the wrist bracers or the plasma caster.

4. Can't just instantly teleport back. It takes time and they're very vulnerable when they're doing it.

5. Also, if you're armed and can fight back, you're valid hunting. If you interfere with their target, however, you're fair game. They can do a light stun on you cloaked just to tell you to fuck off, or in that case throw the harpoon to slow you down.

[an confused rock]

1. unless for some reason its harder to regen that then going to the sulaco to recharge tasers or go to fucking cargo for missiles, my point still stands.
2. they are still the only ones allowed to breach.
3. that is enough for them, it seems.
4. and they CAN do it while cloaked, and can run away while cloaked as well.
5.smashing windows however is just a massive fuck you, especially when they refused to fight. I don't see how a harpoon just slows down, when it can embed in you, and the pred was still able to sprint away while cloaked with a harpoon stuck in it.
people don't even know how preds work when you have to get on a fucking whitelist.

the pred ruined a fucking round after it was KILLED. neither side gains anything from killing a pred which does nothing but fuck them over anyway, and, as seen here, IT IS EVEN BAD TO KILL THEM, LET ALONE HELPFUL, AS THERE ARE MULTIPLE, AND CAN FUCKING BREACH, WHICH IS AGAINST THE RULES FOR A REASON.

[LordeKilly]

1. unless for some reason its harder to regen that then going to the sulaco to recharge tasers or go to fucking cargo for missiles, my point still stands.
2. they are still the only ones allowed to breach.
3. that is enough for them, it seems.
4. and they CAN do it while cloaked, and can run away while cloaked as well.
5.smashing windows however is just a massive fuck you, especially when they refused to fight. I don't see how a harpoon just slows down, when it can embed in you, and the pred was still able to sprint away while cloaked with a harpoon stuck in it.
people don't even know how preds work when you have to get on a fucking whitelist.

the pred ruined a fucking round after it was KILLED. neither side gains anything from killing a pred which does nothing but fuck them over anyway, and, as seen here, IT IS EVEN BAD TO KILL THEM, LET ALONE HELPFUL, AS THERE ARE MULTIPLE, AND CAN FUCKING BREACH, WHICH IS AGAINST THE RULES FOR A REASON.

I don't think you understand. There is no rocket launcher, it's just a higher form of a plasma caster, and their plasma really does deplete fast. Predators aren't good at sustained combat unless it's against marines with low ammo or cocky ones with knives. Still, it doesn't matter if they can breach or not. I agree, it is shitty that they snuck on the sulaco just to be a cunt to people, but its still protected by the rules because reasons I guess. The reason why they're massively overpowered and stupidly strong is that they're a roleplay position. If you see some fucker like that just running around killing people and causing havoc for fun, you should ahelp it or ask people in deadchat if its legit. Salting on a group discussion doesn't do anything. Read up on the honor code, and when some fucker breaks it, you report that shit and get them removed. Easy as that.

[an confused rock]

its enough to shoot a ranged weapon that can knock down xenos more times than a marine could use a SADAR, and how do they regen the plasma? and why the fuck does a roleplay position need to be killed for xeno victory? did I mention the part where preds do nothing but disrupt the round, and cannot advantage either side from killing them?

[Feweh]

its enough to shoot a ranged weapon that can knock down xenos more times than a marine could use a SADAR, and how do they regen the plasma? and why the fuck does a roleplay position need to be killed for xeno victory? did I mention the part where preds do nothing but disrupt the round, and cannot advantage either side from killing them?

You need to relax.
Ive stopped taking you seriously as youre just being salty.

[Surrealistik]

Predators aren't a problem.

Have Sci/Med give you a spraybottle/chemsprayer loaded with Pred-B-Gone, and spray the offending pest: http://cm-ss13.com/viewtopic.php?f=94&t=2837

Syringe guns loaded with the same will also work.

[Steelpoint]

I should not need to rely on a makeshift pepper spray to deal with a Predator.

When my weapon of choice is between a spray bottle or a M41A Pulse Rifle, and I chose the spray bottle, then you've got a serious balance problem.

[Surrealistik]

I should not need to rely on a makeshift pepper spray to deal with a Predator.

When my weapon of choice is between a spray bottle or a M41A Pulse Rifle, and I chose the spray bottle, then you've got a serious balance problem.

I dunno man.

I mean we're talking a potent lethal sedative mixed with deadly superacid vs mere bullets here.

[coroneljones]

I dunno man.

I mean we're talking a potent lethal sedative mixed with deadly superacid vs mere bullets here.

Gotta agree with steel here
And preds arent affected by xeno acid,one of the most powerful acids,lorewise,human acids would be nothing compared to it probably
If i remember correctly,upon contact their blood or skin,cant remember the exact thing,neutralize the acid

[Surrealistik]

So they can overdose on the deadly sedative instead. Polyacid definitely affects them as far as I know though.

[Derpislav]

And preds arent affected by xeno acid,one of the most powerful acids,lorewise,human acids would be nothing compared to it probably

Xeno acid is many times more potent than the strongest acid we're able to manufacture, if we were to judge by the time it takes to melt metal, just sayin'.

[coroneljones]

Xeno acid is many times more potent than the strongest acid we're able to manufacture, if we were to judge by the time it takes to melt metal, just sayin'.

Exactly

[ShortTemperedLeprechaun]

So they can overdose on the deadly sedative instead. Polyacid definitely affects them as far as I know though.

With the xeno blood acid pointed out and them being immune, perhaps we should make an adjustment making them immune to poly...huh.

[Surrealistik]

Xeno acid is many times more potent than the strongest acid we're able to manufacture, if we were to judge by the time it takes to melt metal, just sayin'.

I don't think you're familiar with superacids, which I assume polyacid to be; a typical superacid is thousands of times more powerful than sulfuric acid and can easily replicate the feats of Xeno blood.

Fluoroantimonic acid as an example: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fluoroantimonic_acid

This is metal being rapidly dissolved by trifluoromethanesulfonic acid; thousands of times stronger than sulfuric acid: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4wcgabzPZnE

Fluoroantimonic acid meanwhile is 10,000,000,000,000,000 stronger (ten thousand trillion times stronger) than sulfuric acid: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Superacid

Xeno blood can eat its heart out.

[ShortTemperedLeprechaun]

I don't think you're familiar with superacids, which I assume polyacid to be; a typical superacid is thousands of times more powerful than sulfuric acid and can easily replicate the feats of Xeno blood.

Fluoroantimonic acid as an example: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fluoroantimonic_acid

This is metal being rapidly dissolved by trifluoromethanesulfonic acid; thousands of times stronger than sulfuric acid: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4wcgabzPZnE

Fluoroantimonic acid meanwhile is 10,000,000,000,000,000 stronger (ten thousand trillion times stronger) than sulfuric acid: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Superacid

Xeno blood can eat its heart out.

When your poly acid has the potential to melt through six layers of ship and keep on trucking, and melt the most reinforced shit,then we'll talk.

P.S. I main researcher on my old server, i'm aware that poly acid is bae.

[Surrealistik]

When your poly acid has the potential to melt through six layers of ship and keep on trucking, and melt the most reinforced shit,then we'll talk.

Yes, Flouroantimonic acid should have the capacity to do that.

Any super acid can; it's really a question of quantity.

[northcote4]

Rather than create a new thread regarding honour and the like, I figure I'd just ask here. Seems appropriate.

What are some opinions on the appropriate and honourable use of the yautja plasma caster? It's a ranged weapon with incredible potential, be that from simply stunning marines to obliterating entire sections of space-time between point A and point B.

While the predators I've spectated generally make minimal use of the plasma caster on their hunts -and appropriate use when they do- I still find myself thinking of all sorts of scenario where I find myself wondering if it would be appropriate to use it. Would anyone be willing to help educate me further in its use?

One such example that frequently jumps into my head would be this:
Let's say a ravager and a predator are engaging one another in single combat. If another alien intervenes, what level of response would be acceptable?
Should one erase them from the face of the planet with a few well-placed plasma bursts?
Should one cloak and re-engage at a latter time, or perhaps cloak and execute the meddling xeno? Be that by claw or plasma.
What if the interloper in question was a marine, who began firing indiscriminately?


Another question would be regarding their use in non-hunt situations. Lore-wise there have been cases of the plasma-caster being used quite liberally in particularly dangerous situations, such as when an area is overrun with xenos. Though lore-wise this may be acceptable, what would be the judgement in-game? Similarly, what use, if any, would be allowed in cases where a captured predator must be rescued (perhaps from a xeno nest or the Sulaco) for their subsequent honourable 'assisted suicide'.

(And yes, I'm aware that I may be slightly exaggerating the caster's ability to rend holes in the fabric of reality, and of the simple 'If in doubt don't use it' approach.)

[forwardslashN]

Never use the caster if you're fighting one on one or engaging in an honorable hunt. Adjust the power output based on the threat, though you may fire off warning shots regardless of level. You may use the caster liberally when aliens or marines threaten the lodge, but only if you truly need it, such as being outnumbered or wounded or cornered. Never finish off with the plasma caster unless you simply cannot avoid it, or it's an accident. Only use the maximum level once per foe if you can, unless they have time to recover. You may use it when someone intervenes in your duel, though you should not kill with it if possible. Disable or scare off.

[Feweh]

Side note.

Preds have a sniper like hunting gun that fires the same plasma projectile which oftens confuses people into thinking its the plasma caster.

[northcote4]

Side note.

Preds have a sniper like hunting gun that fires the same plasma projectile which oftens confuses people into thinking its the plasma caster.

Out of curiosity, does that hunting gun also have variable charge levels?

And thanks, both of you.

[Feweh]

Out of curiosity, does that hunting gun also have variable charge levels?

And thanks, both of you.

No

[Toroic]

I haven't been a fan of preds being introduced and I've yet to play in a game where I felt they made the game more fun than it would be without them.

They're inherently snowflakes, they have enormous power to fuck over either side, amd the RP is really hit or miss. Predmarines aren't uncommon.

I respect the dev work done, but I think introducing preds was inherently a bad idea.