A question about preds...

[apophis775]

So, I know a LOT of people like them, but just as many don't.

So, I pose this question:

What would you think about removing preds from normal game modes, and instead using them as events or antags?

I'm not looking to do any of this yet, but to gather sort of what people would think if we DID do that.

[Sadokist]

yeah i'm down with that. I really don't care for preds.

[Joe4444]

I wouldn't mind if you did that.Preds do add to the round sometimes but not so much that'd I'd be mad if you got rid of them from normal modes.I guess I depends what kind of Events you used them for.

[YungCuz]

So is it gonna end up like HG where its pretty much never around until tons of people start mentioning it

[Jdobbin49]

I would be against removing preds, I love role playing with predators on a regular bases.
All the preds we have are amazing role players and playing marine or alien when the preds are on just make the round so much more interesting.

[Biolock]

I don't think they need to be removed either, but the players that use them seriously need to remember their place in the round. They're not the bad guys, and they're not the good guys; too many people who play predator try to make themselves the main character of the round. That's not how it needs to work for the role to be effective as currently designed. The players using the predator need to understand they're a round enhancer, a secondary character, and if they're doing round changing things like blowing up the bridge or killing the queen of a losing hive... they're wrong.

[Kevinthezhang]

There's a couple problems I have with predators.

1. Players already meta what predators are capable of and immediately steer clear of them.
2. Predators don't really get to fight unless they bait someone into attacking them. This encourages them to pick fights.
3. Predators are really, really strong.
4. Oftentimes predators significantly change the round. (i.e. detonating on the Sulaco, especially the bridge)

I don't think they add much to the core gameplay and I think their removal would not impact the roleplay aspect of the server in a significant way.

[SecretStamos (Joshuu)]

I think they're a really cool role. I'd rather not see them get stuffed away where we never see them.

Most of the negativity towards them have subsided. I believe there's more we could do to make them better, but I think taking them away would be a waste.

[ParadoxSpace]

Improve rather than remove imo

[SecretStamos (Joshuu)]

2. Predators don't really get to fight unless they bait someone into attacking them. This encourages them to pick fights.
3. Predators are really, really strong.

These two are actually related. Predators get curbstomped pretty hard by multiple opponents. Hence why they often try and bait individual targets into duels.

A ravenger and a carrier can make very short work of a predator.

In general they perform better against marines than Xenomorphs

[Sadokist]

i'd make this into a poll

[coroneljones]

I would be against it for the same reason as Dobbin and Josh

[SecretStamos (Joshuu)]

I would be against it for the same reason as Dobbin and Josh

I feel like we'd be better off looking at ways to improve the role. I think it's come a long, long way since its humble beginnings and I think our players are pretty solid.

Cutting it out really spits in my face a bit, especially because I just released a cosmetic update for the role. A lot of hard work has gone into them.

[ParadoxSpace]

i'd make this into a poll

A poll invites 'im gonna vote but I won't explain why I feel that way' which isn't something we need.

[Whistle]

When the primary of RP between two characters is the death of one, there's going to be issues.

I suggest adding small teams of other factions that have good survivability, like a detachment of Synths on behalf of W-Y with set objectives, whom are not effective killers but emit a strong electrical current upon being struck.
Something that would add to the round but isnt trying to destroy anyone, just do stuff, like science.

I feel they should stay regardless, we have new preds and they could stand to be taught by some elders, to be examples etc.

[Polkjm]

I say keep them, but make them not breach the hull

[Kevinthezhang]

Or have a rule that they can't go on the Sulaco.

[Shyguychizzy]

Or have a rule that they can't go on the Sulaco.

I wouldn't have go that far perhaps there must be a reason going aboard. As a predator, marines tend to take our gear, on which we can't have that happen. Letting our tech get away with the marines or perhaps we intend to hunt let's say one of the marines decide to get aboard the pod and run back to the sully. We need to be allowed to do forth sometimes for the good or the bad . Even exploring for good reason may be worth for instance hunting the CO may bring great honour for it is their leader. I would think improve with preds, we have quite active pred community though some are inactive I have noticed. Anyhow the pred role isn't just anybody, they be players who have been approved and taken weeks or even more to be white listed. I say we keep em but improve em as others have stated above.

[Bigchilly]

Don't allow preds to come on the Saluco, and if their 'Technology' (weapon) is stolen, then simply make a rule like specialist gear. That marines are unallowed to use it.

[ZDashe]

I'm neutral about whether they should be removed from normal rounds or not. I personally enjoy the presence of preds, and have fought them as both Marine and Xeno, got blown up by them multiple times when they die (I don't meta run). At the same time, when a predator breaches the Sulaco it cripples the Marine team quite a bit. I'm fine with them boarding Sulaco because this gives Sulaco staff the opportunity to experience predators when they normally could not go to the planet.

I do have a suggestion though, to have assigned hunt targets just like antag roles, where Predators are compelled to hunt a specific Xeno/Marine player. At least then it's 'justified' why they were being hunted, and would probably gather less salt.

[Shyguychizzy]

Don't allow preds to come on the Saluco, and if their 'Technology' (weapon) is stolen, then simply make a rule like specialist gear. That marines are unallowed to use it.

Well the thing is most pred gear are melee related tech besiders the plasma rifle, I mean they could make it to explode like if they tried using the bracer or ship beacon. I presume it be difficult for the team to implement melee or rather pred tech, that would add more work for them.

[Sadokist]

A poll invites 'im gonna vote but I won't explain why I feel that way' which isn't something we need.

Don't give me shit boiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii

[Renomaki]

On the one hand, having preds be set aside as an event type only would make their presence all the more special and interesting.

On the other, a lot of players who signed up to be preds would be awfully upset knowing that the chance of spawning in as a pred is lowered considerably.

I am rather in the middle on this, since it both has upsides and downsides to the limiting of their use.

[northcote4]

I suppose I'll sit at neutral: I'd simply throw my vote in with what's best for the game as a whole, and at the moment I can't tell what that would be.

Predators as they are already are, at least in my experience, rather uncommon. Maybe 1/5 rounds. And even then, there's no guarantee there will be one playing, or that you'll encounter it. So on that note I don't think there's an overabundance of them in game.

I think Biolock said it incredibly well:

... the players that use them seriously need to remember their place in the round. They're not the bad guys, and they're not the good guys; too many people who play predator try to make themselves the main character of the round.

...

The players using the predator need to understand they're a round enhancer, a secondary character, and if they're doing round changing things like blowing up the bridge or killing the queen of a losing hive... they're wrong.

Though I imagine there are a number of different reasons why certain people dislike predators, one of the most common ones that I've seen is in terms of strength. Some people just don't like to be outdone: be that by a predator, a xenomorph or a claymore. And that doesn't seem unreasonable to me: In a straight up fight, a predator should be winning more often and not, due to the technological and biological advantages (hence the purpose for the honour code).

And so it comes back to what Biolock said. While some people may never like predators, for whichever reason they choose, I think if there's an overwhelming consensus to limit their use then the fault lies with the predator players themselves.


I suppose in a nutshell: I'd be saddened if predators were made less common in the average round, as I already see little of them; but if they're being misused and the community as a whole thinks poorly of them, then I'm all aboard for limiting them to special rounds.

[Fritigern]

I have been extremely critical of predators in the past, but even then I don't want them removed. That being said I don't think they'll ever likely be fixed, or be able to live up to the standards I'd want for them. My vision of their role, and the players filling that role, is that of RP promoters, to spice rounds up and build the world. Players who would rather let themselves die than risk breaking their code of honour and ruin the round for another player. Unfortunately, given their history and the power they wield, and who it would be given to in members of this community.. I don't think that is a reasonable expectation, even with white listing. Trying to teach people to play in this manner is incredibly difficult, especially with the kind of stock we have to select from.

Honestly, I just say cull their power (Being able to survive being shot 30+ times from 10mm rounds to the chest is ridiculous), and embrace them as wildcard factors in a round who are probably going to murderboner people. If they're more killable, then unrobust predators won't be a problem. If they are robust, then their ability to destroy huge swaths of people is limited. It's the best we can hope for in this kind of community and environment.