Player report: RobBrown4PM

[Dolth]

Your Byond Key:
Pette

Your Character Name:
Dolthgar 'Fire' Folk

Accused Byond Key(if known):
RobBrown4PM

Character Name:
Roberto 'Taco' Moreno

Approximate time and date of the incident (Central US Time for fastest results):
31/05/2018 - 12:45

What rule(s) were broken:
Battlefield execution rule.

Description of the incident:
While the LZ1 was being overran, I was the CAS PO, waiting for an order to take off. When suddenly one of the SO tell me to take off, which I did obviously on fly-by. Any marines on the LZ were wipped and they started to argue about the fact I didn't deploy when required, which is wrong. The commander requested me to come up the CIC, I came up there, explained the situation when the SO talked to me aggresively, I insulted her back. The commander told me to appologies, I refused, then he shot me down instantly.

Evidence (screenshots, logs, etc):

► Show Spoiler

► Show Spoiler

► Show Spoiler

How you would punish the accused:
Removed from the whitelist. Not even judging the tactics he used, this was neither necessary, nor following the rules. And no one wants a commander doing that.
There, you clearly see the BE was done because of PAST ACTIONS, as in, my character was NOT dangerous for ANYONE at this moment, which is MANDATORY for a proper BE.

[Brotemis]

Not sure if this counts as a character witness for pette, they're competent and follow orders when I play with them, which is what you want in a marine; But just recently another Commander almost had a full blown mutiny on his hands for the near exact same situation where he battlefield executed two pilots who did a CAS run as called for and fired at the designated lase. It apparently got marines killed but the pilots were just following a lawful order. The commander asked for them to draw their pistols and toss then to him and then he killed them with their own pistols. I would make a player report, but no 2nd party reports.

One would think the same thing would apply here, following a lawful order that ends up getting marines killed, but through no fault of their own.

Again, if this isn't allowed as a character witness, please delete.

[RobBrown4PM]

I was going to originally let you go with a scolding, however you went about making a threat towards the SO by stating:

[12:51:51]SAY: Dolthgar 'Fire' Folk/Pette : Watch your tongue while you still have it Powers.

You then made another comment, directed either towards my self or Powers stating:

[12:51:55]SAY: Dolthgar 'Fire' Folk/Pette : You're unable to command.

I then stated:

[12:52:09]SAY: Roberto 'Taco' Moreno/RobBrown4PM : Ensign
[12:52:12]SAY: Roberto 'Taco' Moreno/RobBrown4PM : You will apologize

You replied saying:

[12:52:18]SAY: Dolthgar 'Fire' Folk/Pette : What for?
[12:52:41]SAY: Dolthgar 'Fire' Folk/Pette : She deserve it.

I then made the decision to BE you based on the fact that you had began threatening a superior officer with harm, in a situation where in which we were in crisis mode. You were unable to hold yourself to the higher standard that is required of an officer in the Colonial Marine corp, in a time where in which that standard was necessary. You had become a liability to the mission by threatening a superior officer/rank, and being unable to hold your self up as an officer.

And before all of this I had made an announcements stating:

[12:42:15]SAY: RobBrown4PM/(Roberto 'Taco' Moreno) has made Command Announcement: Command Announcement - All forces are to tactically retreat to LZ1.

Ensure that the Tank makes it back there, we will need it seemingly.

PO's, prep Alamo for primary transport. Prep Normady for CASEVAC

On top of that you stated to me that Powers told you to fly in flyby mode. Powers can be quotes as saying:

[12:43:05]SAY: Sarah Powers/VitorThauma : ALAMO, LAUNCH.
[12:43:17]SAY: Sarah Powers/VitorThauma : NOT FUCKING CAS.
[12:43:19]SAY: Sarah Powers/VitorThauma : TRANSPORT
[12:45:55]SAY: Sarah Powers/VitorThauma : WHAT THE FUCK ARE YOU DOING ALAMO

You're quoted in this report as saying:

While the LZ1 was being overran, I was the CAS PO, waiting for an order to take off. When suddenly one of the SO tell me to take off, which I did obviously on fly-by

The announcement was made at 12:42:15hrs, Sarah told you to launch at 12:43:05, then began scolding you at 12:43:17hrs for launching in CAS and not transport.

Edit: Also, you told me IC that Powers told you to fly down in Fly-By mode. When did that happen.

[Dolth]

That's because Sarah didn't specify at first. You need to understand I had almost every radio tunned on, I saw Powers yelling "ALAMO, LAUNCH", and so did I.

Now that's not even the issue. The issue is the following, you did a battlefield execution on someone that was complying and could be brigged for anything. That's worst than poor RP to BE someone for 'insulting' a SO.
Once the marines were dead and I told you ICly that wasn't on purpose and there clearly was a misuderstanding which you understood, there was no fucking reason to BE. What's next? Killing a marine because he said 'Fuck the CO.'?

EDIT: Straight out of the facts, you killed an officer for insulting another officer. Killing, for insulting. How is that even a scratch of our medium RP server? Even more as a commander?

[RobBrown4PM]

That's because Sarah didn't specify at first. You need to understand I had almost every radio tunned on, I saw Powers yelling "ALAMO, LAUNCH", and so did I.

There's a very loud prompt that notified you every time a command announcement is made. This announcement stated that the Alamo was to switch over to Transport duties. This announcement was made prior to you flying the Alamo down.

Now that's not even the issue. The issue is the following, you did a battlefield execution on someone that was complying and could be brigged for anything. That's worst than poor RP to BE someone for 'insulting' a SO.
Once the marines were dead and I told you ICly that wasn't on purpose and there clearly was a misuderstanding which you understood, there was no fucking reason to BE. What's next? Killing a marine because he said 'Fuck the CO.'?

I performed a battlefield execution on a member of my crew that threatened a superior officer (Ensign's are subordinated to Lt's) with physical harm. I gave you the chance to apologize, instead, you threw it back in my face. We were in a time of crisis, the Marines were decimated, the operation was a disaster, and you go about threatening superiors with harm. In any military, in any part of the world that would be met with immediate arrest. In this universe, the Commander is given the right to BE members of his/her crew that they feel are a threat to the mission or ship. If one of my officers begins threatening a superior with harm, and is failing to uphold their commission in a time of crisis, then IMO they become an immediate threat to the mission, the ship, and his men.

EDIT: Straight out of the facts, you killed an officer for insulting another officer. Killing, for insulting. How is that even a scratch of our medium RP server? Even more as a commander?

You didn't insult, you threatened.

[Dolth]

You're bending the facts and the words right now. My character didn't see that announcement, through the general noises and screams from Powers. That was a general clusterfuck and you know it.
Now I did insult her by saying she was unable to command as you stated earlier, and you're telling me "[12:51:51]SAY: Dolthgar 'Fire' Folk/Pette : Watch your tongue while you still have it Powers." was the threat that deserved the BE?
Needless to lie here, we both know that was general angryness. The room was full of people, everyone had a gun, and I was far from her. My character even complied to come over the CIC and was telling you from the beginning his version. In no 'universe' this is an aggressive behavior and using the words contextually isn't going to convince anyone.

Either ways, if someone is really a threat to you, then you don't ask him to appologies. Otherwise he is not much of threat. And again, that's still a very low RP from a whitelisted commander and I doubt I will be the only one to confirm this.

[RobBrown4PM]

You're bending the facts and the words right now.

Did you threaten a superior officer with harm? Did you then not throw back my offer to apologize?

My character didn't see that announcement, through the general noises and screams from Powers. That was a general clusterfuck and you know it.

You not seeing an announcement is on you. Was it hectic? Sure, however that doesen't excuse you from not seeing and hearing a very audible message. That's on you

Now I did insult her by saying she was unable to command as you stated earlier, and you're telling me "[12:51:51]SAY: Dolthgar 'Fire' Folk/Pette : Watch your tongue while you still have it Powers." was the threat that deserved the BE?

Yes, yes it was. However, I gave you the chance to apologize, had you apologized I would have continued on with your scolding and left it at that. Instead, you opted to refuse my offer.

Needless to lie here, we both know that was general angryness.

You have previously stated (And go on to) that my actions were low RP. Where do you place your threat then? Is it high-tier RP to threaten a superior officer with harm, then state that person should not be in command, in a crisis situation where in which you're expected to have your head above water and screwed on straight? Commissioned men are held to much higher standards than the rank and file.

The room was full of people, everyone had a gun, and I was far from her. My character even complied to come over the CIC and was telling you from the beginning his version. In no 'universe' this is an aggressive behavior and using the words contextually isn't going to convince anyone.

You coming to the CiC does not excuse you from making a threat towards another commissioned man, who is of greater rank than you. No one told you to say those words. Through your own free will, you opted to mention those words and then refuse my offer.

Either ways, if someone is really a threat to you, then you don't ask him to appologies. Otherwise he is not much of threat. And again, that's still a very low RP from a whitelisted commander and I doubt I will be the only one to confirm this.

I asked you to apologize because I didn't want to perform my first ever BE, however, I was placed in a situation where in which I had an officer that was making threats to another commissioned man, who was of greater rank than he. On a military ship, in a crisis situation, this simply cannot happen.

[Dolth]

Well that's here we disagree then and I guess we won't take the debate any further by ourselves.

You cannot simply say giving an appology removes the 'pretended threat' I was, otherwise your character is beyond naive and I doubt a commander is. Also, That's really a poor threat of mine, not even one properly said. As in Powers even asked if that was a threat and I didn't answer because it obviously was not. I waved her off, and you know it.

Also you seem to mix a lot of things. Refusing to 'appology' is at most insubordination, which doesn't justify any BE, even in a time of crisis as your order is NOT VITAL AT ALL, again, how does a fucking verbal appology justify any threat or no-threat? This is not kindergarden.

To sum it up before we continue endlessly;
You're basicly saying I threatened someone and deserved to die because I didn't appology.
I say that wasn't much of a threat but rather a way of telling Powers to shut the hell up, then again, if giving an appology was enough to calm you, then I certainly wasn't much of a threat.

And regarding the RP stuff, I am not the whitelisted one, furthermore in 'time of crisis' people tend to override ranks but that's another mater.

[Cry of Wolves]

Alright, this is just going in circles. Do not make another post until Emerald and other admins give their piece.

[Emeraldblood]

Right, so we've gone under a lot of rule changes lately, leading to this being slowed down, an apology for that. The rules are that if the CO believes that you're a threat to the mission, in this case the life of the SO, he can shoot you as per the updated rules. Resolved - no punishment will be dealt for this report.