Player Report - trevoriousdafox "Ellie 'Coffee' Weaver"

[Novus Luna]

Your Byond Key: Novus Luna

Your Character Name:
Cyrus Ambrose

Accused Byond Key(if known):
trevoriousdafox

Character Name:
Ellie 'Coffee' Weaver

Approximate time and date of the incident (Central US Time for fastest results):
12:00 PM, 6/25/2018, though this occurred on multiple other dates.

What rule(s) were broken:
The violated rule was "Rule 18: Act your given role".

Description of the incident:
This is not a single incident, by any means. Across the course of effectively every round in which I have seen Weaver in the role of Staff Officer, they have been difficult at best to work with as a fellow staff officer, or as a subordinate Marine. In the case of the latter, as the less common instance for me to play, it was earlier in the day of the above listed time - one or two rounds before. They introduced themselves as the overwatch to my unit early in the round, at which point they seldom to never spoke to us again, including when I was directly informing them of issues of great importance happening on the field, such as insubordination of the aSL. Later in the round, likely due to their being absentee from usefulness in the position, overwatch was transferred from them. The main issue I have seen of Weaver when I also play Staff Officer is two-fold. The first issue relates to the aforementioned viewpoint, where Weaver is non-communicative, a core part of the role overall. Not only are they unwilling to communicate with their team in my experience, they are also rarely speaking in the Command chat, even when being directly questioned or addressed regarding themselves or the actions of their subordinate teams. This has often caused tension, miscommunciation, or failure within the operation, leading to, at best, several wounded and time wasted, and more often - at worst - an entire team being wiped out. The second issue comes with that they are overly eager to be sent planetside. In cases where five Staff Officers are present, this would be less of an issue, but I have seen them seeking to go planetside when there aren't even 4 SOs, including once instance where there were only 2, her and myself. If they desire to do this, they are better off playing a Squad Leader, as otherwise they are wasting the slot and making the distribution from the CIC more difficult. In the timestamp given above, they left to the planetside without even informing myself or the other Staff Officer that I saw, only asking the XO, who was cryoing immediately after. When inquired to their whereabouts by the CO not 10 minutes later, they perpetually refused to answer, and when the CO finally checked the suit sensors for their location and ordered them back, they threw nothing short of a temper tantrum.

Evidence (screenshots, logs, etc): I am unsure of what evidence can be provided in a situation where I speak of them not doing something. Their lack of presence in comms leaves no logs to be given about the matter, and their presence on planetside is something have been unable to screenshot due to myself playing a Staff Officer, with less eagerness to abandon my post.

How you would punish the accused: I would recommend they be either put on probation from, or totally banned from, the job of Staff Officer.

[Trevoriousdafox]

okay so do I even need to reply to this or is this like a joke. Okie so I am pretty sure this report has no purpose and is not valid at all. I can say for sure that most of this is flat out lies or just your own personal bias against me I guess. Just because you are salty at me for whatever reason does not mean you can make fake report. Edit added some sentences Reedit:Typos

[taketheshot56]

Ill give my take as a CO, Ive had Ellie as my Staff Officer and she has been fine. Everyone does things people doesnt like every once in a while but if we were to player report every SO who mightve gotten a squad or two killed. Well no one would be left to play SO.

[Trevoriousdafox]

I can also say I have only EVER SO'd with you TWICE Cyrus so I don't see how you can make these statements with only two rounds SO'ing with me.I ALSO USUALLY OVER WATCH TWO SQUADS BY MYSELF so yea I may not talk on command channel much by squad comm's are VERY different.

[coroneljones]

Mostly adding my two cents solely due to the fact I was present in the round referenced above as the CO.
Weaver immediately went to cryo after starting some drama on the command channel after being told not to deploy as an SO-Medic and instead report to the CIC.

Late-Edit:
Furthermore, I remember another incident in which the player reported cryoed, as a Staff Officer, after being ordered not to wear a civilian skirt, that they acquired somehow, where they then proceeded to call the Executive Officer and Chief Engineer, the two officers that spoke against the infracture, as being dicks for not allowing them to do the player wanted.

Not meaning to offend, but they seem to cryo when things dont go their way.

[Novus Luna]

I have no reason to lie, no resource of personal bias, and no salt regarding any such situation. This complaint was made due to ineffectiveness as a Staff Officer and your perceived desire to be a glorified Squad Leader by being a deployed Staff Officer. This is very much meant to be a serious post. It is not something I fabricated, as is evident by the discussion in your own complaint against someone else in which others confirmed your nature.

Also, in response to taketheshot56, there is a difference between 'every once in a while' and literally every time I myself have seen them playing. Am I saying there aren't rounds where they are actually displaying competency and focus to the job? No, I'm sure there are a few, but if there are stretches to such a degree that they can encompass one hundred percent of someones perspective, that's a problem.

Furthermore, you saying that you've only SO'd with me twice...it is certainly a higher number than that, I can think of closer to a half-dozen or more. Naturally, memory fog can happen - just as well, not paying attention could make one not notice their co-workers as well.

[Trevoriousdafox]

I will let this all play out how it does but I will add that I have never had ANYONE say anything bad about my SO'ing till now literally. Just pointing that out.

[Trevoriousdafox]

also you say I didn't do my job but that is honestly a flat out lie I was at both consoles till I asked to deploy but honestly how would you even know I was on CHARLIE AND DELTA and you we're on the other side of CIC on just bravo. I find it ironic I usually run two squads and yet I "neglect to do my duty" I'm sorry but this player report is a flat out lie. Edit:typos again

[Trevoriousdafox]

I honestly can only remember SO'ing with you twice and to be honest you seem quite bald both times. this is only making me think that is true tenfold.

[Trevoriousdafox]

Any who I'll let the staff figure this out? I don't see validity here at all but if I am needed for more questions just ask.

[Dauntasa]

I was present in CIC for that round. I can't comment as to how Weaver performed on Overwatch, as I was pretty busy with my own Overwatch and was not paying attention to how she was performing. However, I was paying attention to the specific drama surrounding her cryoing.
To the best of my knowledge, this is what occurred: Weaver is handling overwatch for Charlie and Delta. The XO, who is commanding because there is no CO, announces that she has to cryo and she's leaving SO Ambrose in charge, then leaves to go cryo. Around this time, Weaver leaves CIC. I don't know if she cleared deploying with the cryoing aCO or not, but either way she didn't inform the new aCO or myself and simply left to go get on the dropship. This leaves only 2 people in CIC. Before the dropship leaves, the CO joins the round , comes up to the CIC and demands a status report. Myself and the other SO give him one, and he asks why Charlie and Delta have no overwatch officer. Both myself and the other SO have no answer for him, as we were unaware that Weaver had left. Weaver refuses to answer the CO's repeated requests for her to report her location over the command channel. Eventually, the CO finds that she is deploying, and orders her to return to the CIC. She says that she cleared it with the departing XO, and the CO says that he is overriding that and ordering her back to the CIC. She responds by giving the CO an ultimatum that she will cryo if not allowed to deploy, and when the CO refuses it, she cryos. At the time, CIC was understaffed, and without her we were left with just 2 SOs and the CO(another one did eventually join, but this was a lowpop round and there was no guarantee that this was going to occur).

I won't put forward any opinion on whether or not she should be punished or what that hypothetical punishment should be, and I won't make any judgments on her performance outside of this specific round. But I will say that attempting to coerce a CO into letting you do something by threatening to cryo while playing a role that is important, understaffed, and not guaranteed to be replaced is something that, in my personal opinion, should be very much discouraged.

[driecg36]

Jesus christ please condense your posts into one, having a separate post for every single sentence makes it a pain in the ass to read.

[Trevoriousdafox]

now let me clear this up I did not say I would cryo if I couldn't deploy. I said thought the XO had cleared me to deploy. "because she had" and the CO got very hostile with me so I said I was gonna report to cryo instead. That is what I said check the logs. also seems like it was a misunderstanding on the old XO's part for not informing you two. Edit: added more to the sentence

[Dauntasa]

now let me clear this up I did not say I would cryo if I couldn't deploy.

I certainly got the implication that you did. If I remember correctly, once the CO had definitively overruled any permission you had to deploy, you responded with something close to "I will just go cryo then". This is not, in and of itself, an ultimatum. But what made it seem as though it was an ultimatum to me was that, rather than cryoing immediately after saying this, you repeated it a few times and continued to argue with the CO for a bit before finally cryoing. That fits with my understanding of an ultimatum.

[Trevoriousdafox]

honestly I would have cryo'd regardless even if he would have sent me down

[Nantei]

Having had Ellie as an SO, fellow SO, and ACO, I can attest to her good character. Ellie is, generally speaking, one of the better SO's, and I am usually quite happy to see her whenever a round starts. Even if she wasn't, however, none of the things you have listed are valid reasons to take any action. This sounds like in-character issues bleeding into out of character ones.

Truthfully I don't see the purpose of this report. Even if everything you said was true, it wouldn't warrant admin action.

[Trevoriousdafox]

I admit I said somethings I should not have. But my point still stands, I did my job fine. I did not get any squads killed. I was also running delta AND charlie by myself like usual. AND I had the okay by my aCO, the XO at the time to deploy. I do not know why she didn't inform anyone of my leaving but I also DID head straight back up when I was told. And ONLY decided to cryo because it didn't like the way I was being treated. I agree it could have been handled better but I do not see any rules broken here myself.

[lmwevil]

As someone who has played with Ellie numerous times I can say that she is generally good at her role as a SO. While I've seen her in the field countless times too, that's not all in all a bad thing, as command influence on a ground level can actually spark victory. That's my two cents.

[Novus Luna]

The way Trevor keeps staggering two sentences to a post, rather then keeping to one post, makes this a bit difficult to reply to, but let's go down the list:
"I will let this all play out how it does but I will add that I have never had ANYONE say anything bad about my SO'ing till now literally. Just pointing that out."
-People are not always forthcoming about their problems with someone until someone else is. I speak from very intimate personal experience with this fact.

"also you say I didn't do my job but that is honestly a flat out lie I was at both consoles till I asked to deploy but honestly how would you even know I was on CHARLIE AND DELTA and you we're on the other side of CIC on just bravo. I find it ironic I usually run two squads and yet I "neglect to do my duty" I'm sorry but this player report is a flat out lie."
-I can speak very well that you weren't doing your job when part of your job is communicating with command. The Staff Officers are supposed to coordinate with each other, not stay mute to each other the entire round. If this player report was a lie, also, there wouldn't be people agreeing with it.

"I honestly can only remember SO'ing with you twice and to be honest you seem quite bald both times. this is only making me think that is true tenfold."
-Actually, as a note to this, I myself have, save for a few points of contention such as an OB issue, not heard any issues about my being an SO. I realize that what I said above applies, but still. That said, if you are really calling someone worse because they filed a report about you, then that kind of goes hand in hand with the mentality you have been showing of 'you guys were mean to me and didn't let me have my way fuck you I'm cryoing'

"now let me clear this up I did not say I would cryo if I couldn't deploy. I said thought the XO had cleared me to deploy. "because she had" and the CO got very hostile with me so I said I was gonna report to cryo instead. That is what I said check the logs. also seems like it was a misunderstanding on the old XO's part for not informing you two."
-If it looks like chicken and tastes like chicken... As said above, the CO was only hostile because you were not being communicative, you did not state your position when asked maybe a half dozen times or more. That more than warrants hostility. In any case it seemed like, to the entire CIC and your teams, that you left for not getting your way.


To those saying that, even if my report is true, it doesn't matter as it's not a big deal and doesn't warrant punishment - they are, in my reported experiences, actively making the round more difficult for Command. They are in dereliction of duty, not playing their job as intended. That rule exists for a reason. While some of you have not witnessed this, sure, others have, and have attested to it.

[Trevoriousdafox]

Well I believe I have said enough to defend myself. I think it is up to the staff at this point, IF this post is even valid.

[Royal Griffon]

alright time for the rookie SO on the block to throw his towel in the ring,
Ellie is a fine SO, she likes to RP, and likes to be a sweet person and in all accounts is a good person, and they are good at leading and can lead multiple squads at a time, including Delta AND Charlie, which is hard as fuck due to those being the two major squads for things that don't get along, pretty much 6/10 times if not more.
now the aSL thing...that sounds like your fault and problem I mean, if you got someone who isn't a talkative aSL, pretty sure that means look for the next best option, whether it be a PFC, a medic, or an engineer. You control your squad overall, so if you got an issue with a marine, just either mark them for insub, or just make them NOT aSL.
Then you say SO's are supposed to be talkative. Let's just put this out there, ALL OF CIC IS SUPPOSED TO BE TALKATIVE. I've gone SO rounds without a SINGLE word from the XO besides them wanting to press the BIG RED OB BUTTON. I've gone rounds where the ENTIRE CIC STAFF besides ME, have just gone SSD, or just cyro'ed and didn't even TELL me, so I had to deal with the ENTIRE operation. CiC roles ARE supposed to be talkative and cooperative roles yeah, but 7/10 times, they ain't used that way, 7/10 times, they're just quiet little places until someone spits out a good idea or asks another SO for something basically.

[Novus Luna]

I'm aware of how difficult it can be to run 2 squads. I run Alpha-Bravo a lot. I've had to solo the fucking CIC before, because Weaver, as my only other SO, went planetside. I don't believe I ever said I had an aSL on my own team that wasn't talkative - I meant Weaver is. If I made that unclear, sorry, otherwise you msread something. You're saying that SOs should be talkative when they're addressed, aye? When asking another SO for something? She is never responsive. I've had myself, the XO, and CO pressing her to respond before, and she still doesn't.

[Trevoriousdafox]

look Luna I don't see the issue or the point at all. We've all had to run CIC alone before it's part of low pop sadly. Also in the round you speak of I ALSO had the go ahead to deploy. So you are literally making this report out of a salt towards me. Sorry to upset you but you are a rookie SO and I do not think you are competent enough to understand the role of SO if you think I have done something wrong as one. I am getting tired of debating this with you over and over you wont listen to me I will not keep humoring this. Edit:fixed typos added a few sentences

[taketheshot56]

Luna ill be honest your arguments here seem to be born of salt and not of real concern. Ellie hasnt broken any rules by not being the best SO. Its not against the rules to be quiet, its an IC issue if the CO wants to deal with it.

[Novus Luna]

Yes, I am aware you don't see the point. You have made that rather clear. I'm not complaining that I've had to run CIC alone, that isn't the point. I'm not complaining that you have had a couple wipes, that isn't the point. I'm not salty at you at all (though you're starting to push me there sheerly be repeating that over and over as an assumption), that isn't the point. The point is that you don't communicate. The point is that you actively seek going down to the planet to be a glorified PMC or Squad Medic with a higher rank. I know that sometimes communication isn't omnipresent in the Command chat, but if you're directly addressed, especially by your rank or higher, you should respond. I know that sometimes you're going to be sent to a planet, but it shouldn't be something you actively seek in every single circumstance like a dog waiting for their chance at a walk.

I know that I'm new, but that doesn't mean I don't understand how this job works, as I've caught on rather quickly. Some people rather easily prove, just as well, that experience doesn't always equate to skill. You can ride a bike 1000 times, but if you rode it wrong each of those 1000 times, you're still riding it wrong.

If this was an argument I was making out of salt, I would be the one saying using petty insults and deflecting the actual point of the conversation. I'm not the one doing that.

Edit: The rules expect you to do your job, to play your role. There are quite a few instances where being quiet can be, in fact, a violation of such.

Secondary Edit: Also, taketheshot56 - respectfully - aren't the only people to comment on a post those providing direct commentary to it? Not 'you're just being salty', I imagine.

Tertiary Edit: Also, something I've forgotten to note: it's generally considered bad form (as I've talked to a moderator about, before you try to tell me I'm wrong) to go friend-fishing to get people to try to help you against a report, which trevoriousdafox did in fact try, though at the end of that conversation they also admitted to going to the ground too much, so perhaps they are starting to see the point of this.