Alien Nest Fix

[Mycroft Macarthur]

Suggestion Title: Alien Nest Fix

Summary (a quick, 2-3 sentence summary): alien nests would be modified in a way to resolve an issue where they are being used in a manner that i do not feel was intended

Benefits (How this will benefit the server and game as a whole): this will eliminate abuse of what i feel is a code issue

Details (Description of how you think this would work, the benefits, etc): so i was playing CM earlier today and we were attacking xenobio, the usual stuff, aliens had put nests along the walls for some reason, weird place to put them but whatever i guess, i cant tell the aliens how to design their hives if im not a queen, drone or hivelord.

then i realised why the nests are along the walls, as we were attacking the alien forces they were able to instant drop us while we were standing on top of them as a way of instantly taking marines down.

are you serious?

at least walls and doors we can quickly take down but you know how marines get in crowded areas, you will get knocked down or stab people by accident while trying to clear them and you cant use guns on them AT ALL, but my problem is that you expect me to believe you can just take the time to put someone in the nest while they are literally opening fire on you or stabbing the shit out of you? you could be in the midst of an epic duel with an alien only for him to go "LOL! NESTED YOU!" and instant win the fight (because no chance in hell you get up before they rip off half your shit and hug you, NO chance whatsoever)

i do not feel this is how nests were intended to be utilized, aliens should at LEAST have to knock you down first if not having a timer delay on the nesting process or requiring you be hugged first, alien nests are NOT land mines or bear traps that immediately take you down

Implementation (Optional, if you have an idea how to implement it): i have no idea how this would need to be coded

[TopHatPenguin]

I agree with this completely it is a really cheap tactic that I think you could fix by having it , so the marine has to be tackled down so you can plop them in a nest instead of from standing having a marine go instantly into a nest.

[MrJJJ]

"Sigh" this is mostly becomes annoying, aliens are seriously trying to cheat a lot to win, nest-eggs, tackle spam, re-nesting, runner or warrior guards and many other things, they do it all to win easily, while marines do cheat sometimes too, it's easy to see or counter usually.

But yea...

[Mycroft Macarthur]

dont get me wrong, i wont say marines NEVER metagame, few weeks ago i used to get SCREAMED AT nonstop for wearing a weld mask as an engineer by the other players, and if you wore sec hardsuit even as survivor i would get raged at by admins, but now bio hoods are suddenly cool? weld masks only stop like 5 huggers but i've never once seen a bio hood get ripped off save for guys who got nested so theoretically they could have infinite capacity.

where are they even getting these damn things? there cant be THAT many bio lockers onboard and rad suits are a completely different item.

i've seen this kind of shit in second life before too, where one group begins metagaming or powergaming, so the other responds by metagaming and cheating even MORE, so the FIRST group has to step up their GAME and turn metagaming into a second job....it leads to an amusing moment here and there and it can lead to a kind of pseudo-balance where even though its not balanced at ALL, it IS balanced due to all the things which come together but even in the times where that DOES happen (very, very rare) it NEVER lasts for long because they keep stepping it up and balance gets thrown out again.

to be completely fair alot of the time aliens keep putting the eggs in corners where we cant shoot at them so just to push you have to get your helmet ripped off (and there is never only one egg) so you cant move two feet without instant losing a guy, its kind of bullshit that we can SEE the threat visibly but we arent actually capable of doing anything about it so sometimes this is their ONLY answer, to have one guy with a weld mask or bio hood lead the charge, you can take down the walls but thats only an option SOME of the time (not all walls can be destroyed or it might cause a breach if you do), i feel that if marines are going down it should be because the aliens are actively hunting or fighting them and not that the eggs basically fill the need for them to have players, fixing it so eggs cant be on the same space as a door, wall or nest has made it abit easier but only abit.

[Redfield5]

On the subject of hoods, welding masks, and the like, they are hella vulnerable and limited in their usage. If you're throwing yourself into the brunt of combat - especially when you're clearing out easily defensible areas such as Virology - you can take at least 3-10 facehuggers before they actually manage to rip the hood off.

On the subject of nest traps, I totally agree on the grounds of aesthetic value. It's much cooler and dynamic when a Marine gets dragged off, because it challenges both parties, the Marine and the Alien. When they nest an entire room as a preliminary action to an assault, a portion of the fun is sacrificed. It takes away the satisfaction of capturing and dragging away your prey.

[LordeKilly]

I know about the hoods cause I once got my helmet ripped off, SL got nabbed into Virology, I nabbed a hood and dashed in to find every tile filled with aliens. I killed a drone and then cleared a pass to SL, but he was dead, so i went back, took 5 huggers then got slashed to death.

[Davidchan]

Nests are annoying to deal with, no question. Lately, I've seen Xenos doing every cheap trick they can to take out marines. Corner Disarms, Runners doing Hugger flybys, dragging tanks or solid objects as cover, premature stripping and slashing APCs for no reason (this compounds our atmos problems, btw). It's amazing how Marines get screamed at for even toeing the line yet so long as the aliens don't breach or full strip they can pretty much do what ever they want.

Mechanics wise, nest should require you be knocked down to be put in one, and I'd also like to see nests break if a host is removed or struggles free, as this would discourage non-drone/queen/HLs from ever removing someone from a nest since they can't remake them.

[Void00]

Nests are annoying to deal with, no question. Lately, I've seen Xenos doing every cheap trick they can to take out marines. Corner Disarms, Runners doing Hugger flybys, dragging tanks or solid objects as cover, premature stripping and slashing APCs for no reason (this compounds our atmos problems, btw). It's amazing how Marines get screamed at for even toeing the line yet so long as the aliens don't breach or full strip they can pretty much do what ever they want.

Mechanics wise, nest should require you be knocked down to be put in one, and I'd also like to see nests break if a host is removed or struggles free, as this would discourage non-drone/queen/HLs from ever removing someone from a nest since they can't remake them.

I Remember BANNINGat least 3 aliens for using plasma tanks as cover , so please , dont say we do nothing.
The fact is , that while seeing a guy use hardsuits , or engineering mask's whitout reason , is fairly easy , seeing a alien slashing an APC whitout reason, or doing a corner disarm , is fairly difficult , if no one tells us.

Also , hugger flybys ?
you mean runners running by and launching huggers on your face ?
thats what they are meant for , duh.

[slayerplayer99]

We might be able to handle the insta-nesting problem. I'll see what I can do when I can

[Davidchan]

I Remember BANNINGat least 3 aliens for using plasma tanks as cover , so please , dont say we do nothing.

Inferius, Minimike and Coroneljones where all quite happy to tell me today that Aliens were allowed to strip bags and belts from ALL marines upon being dragged in after being infected. These weren't marines who escaped nests, these were marines still KO'd from being hugged. Despite the rules reading something very different. And this culminates with OliverCarswell making a server announcement about how it's OKAY now for aliens to blanket strip bags and belts after an unspecificed number of marines pull weapons.

And the very next round, a marine was gibbed in the logistics line for tripping and cutting in line to get his assignment faster. I'm sorry, but if this is considered fair and equal, I'm obviously not seeing something.

I'm fine with the rules being changed, but at the very least they should be enforced equally and as written until the change goes through, not some floating hearsay rules that every player doesn't have access to find and can only be sourced if Admins/Mods in the loop are active and on the server to support it.

[MrJJJ]

Inferius, Minimike and Coroneljones where all quite happy to tell me today that Aliens were allowed to strip bags and belts from ALL marines upon being dragged in after being infected. These weren't marines who escaped nests, these were marines still KO'd from being hugged. Despite the rules reading something very different. And this culminates with OliverCarswell making a server announcement about how it's OKAY now for aliens to blanket strip bags and belts after an unspecificed number of marines pull weapons.

And the very next round, a marine was gibbed in the logistics line for tripping and cutting in line to get his assignment faster. I'm sorry, but if this is considered fair and equal, I'm obviously not seeing something.

I'm fine with the rules being changed, but at the very least they should be enforced equally and as written until the change goes through, not some floating hearsay rules that every player doesn't have access to find and can only be sourced if Admins/Mods in the loop are active and on the server to support it.

Last time, you could only pull off bags and belts off a marine that pulled out a gun from them, but not others for some reason…thats what razed told me anyway

And ouch, getting gibber for tripping and cutting…seems a bit too much

[Void00]

Last time, you could only pull off bags and belts off a marine that pulled out a gun from them, but not others for some reason…thats what razed told me anyway

And ouch, getting gibber for tripping and cutting…seems a bit too much

Gibbed ?
Thats a bit exagerated , while i can understand the use of the kill verb on people who push\punch around the line 4noraisins, is still a OOC and exagerated action...

By rule You can only remove bags , belts , and gun's , if you know what they do , and if youve seen them being used.
I dont understand where Oliver got that update on the rules , but alas , is not my place to discuss it , as he's a head (not specifically my head , as i enter in the Dev's\Admins group , but still a head).

[Mitchs98]

In a semi-related to this thread inquiry, last I checked corner disarms aren't against the rules. Nor is egg traps, nor nest traps. The ONLY reason ANYONE wants ANY of this miniscule stuff nerfed, mind you the stuff that aliens need to stand a chance against LE ANGRY INFANTREH etc. is because "MUHREENS MASTER RACE! NERF ALIENS TO SHIT!" So, I really don't see your point here. Just outlaw it partially, to where they have to be infected to be nested while standing or something. Don't remove something entirely, nor make resin nests destroy upon escaping.

[MrJJJ]

In a semi-related to this thread inquiry, last I checked corner disarms aren't against the rules. Nor is egg traps, nor nest traps.

Oh really?

*sigh*
I just...

RULE ZERO MATE

but seriously, rule zero, read it, oh wait, let me quote it for you

0. DON'T BE A DICK.
Just because something isn't in the rules, doesn't mean you should do it. If it's some that might ruin someones round, or cause complaints, you will probably get in trouble for it. We can never have rules to cover 100% of the possibilities, so if there is something your going to do that breaks the RP, ruins someones round, or is general fuckery, DON'T DO IT.

So basically, egg traps (inside the nests especially) is general fuckery, might cause complaints and ruin someone round, corner disarms…meh, they not much of anything.

Seriously, just because something in the rules, does not mean you should just say "last time i checked, there was nothing saying about it"

and egg traps (INSIDE NESTS ESPECIALLY) has ruined some people rounds (mine and couple of victims) caused complaints (i started a thread about it and complained) and it was just being a dick to HIT and Marines(HIT Could Barely Even Survive, 4 out of 6 Lost they Helmets And 3 Died From Bursting)

[Dabbster]

I Remember BANNINGat least 3 aliens for using plasma tanks as cover , so please , dont say we do nothing.
The fact is , that while seeing a guy use hardsuits , or engineering mask's whitout reason , is fairly easy , seeing a alien slashing an APC whitout reason, or doing a corner disarm , is fairly difficult , if no one tells us.

Also , hugger flybys ?
you mean runners running by and launching huggers on your face ?
thats what they are meant for , duh.

Wait. I'm gonna need some clarification on 'slash an APC without reason'

[apophis775]

Fixed this. Now, someone must be TACKLED TO THE GROUND to be nested.