Xeno Disarm Times

[Butterrobber202]

Summary (a quick, 2-3 sentence summary): As most people who have played Alien recently, you have noticed that disarm times are now VERY Short. This is a HUGE nerf for aliens. YES I know the long disarm time was OP, I'm after something inbetween, not the old Disarm time, but Something longer than the CURRENT disarm time, as the one we have now doesnt even give us time to nest, (For a Sentinel you have about a Second to get them into a nest)

Benefits (How this will benefit the server and game as a whole):
*Not the Long Stun time (Old)
*Will atleast give the aliens a CHANCE to get the marines nested
Details (Description of how you think this would work, the benefits, etc):Make the stun time longer, as Xeno of current you cant even Nest. I was a Sentinel we fucked with TWO marines for almost 10 minutes because we could get them nested, I even had another sentinel helping me

Implementation (Optional, if you have an idea how to implement it): Make Stun time longer

Notes: And I know the Pure-breed Marines will instantly -1 this because it would give aliens a better chance, just stop being so bias. The Aliens ARE they to challenge the Marines, not Moving dummy targets.

[Davidchan]

The problem with disarm was not (entirely) the time. It was the high probability for success. Warriors and the Queen can reliably hit you down 80% of the time or better, and keep you down for 4-7 seconds. Made worse, is that because of the way Baycode works, you don't instantly kip up once the stun wears off, but you need half a second or so to actually stand back up. During this half second, you aren't considered down or stunned, so the aliens can freely slap you back down even before you stand up. This is what people mean by disarm spam because coders aren't accounting for this duration of standing up.

While I do agree that things like Drones need a better disarm, since it can have a duration of 0-2 seconds, Sentinels or better don't need much in the way of a buff, especially since Runners and Sentinels both have abilities that function superior to stuns and don't require them to be adjacent. If you can't nest a marine in the 2-4 second stun window that Sentinels currently have, I don't know what to tell you, especially since most aliens are quite capable of just spamming their disarm to keep you down the moment the stun wears off.

Xeno tackles only need to be slightly longer than what Marine tackles are, and only a slightly higher chance (Old baycode, tackle/push down was 20% rate if I recall, drones have 40%)

[Butterrobber202]

No. Its tackling then PULLING to the nest, as you are pulling, BOOP they stand up and run the other way. And Sentinel Spit DOESN'T last very long at all.

[MrJJJ]

If the run away and nothing stops them, you have bad alien team
If your fucking hosts, can just get up and run away from the nest in 10 seconds, you are seriously bad

This is why there is fucking resin doors and walls...

[Butterrobber202]

Again I was a sentinel, but I will say WE HAD SOME BAD DRONES, a nesting room with no wall isnt a nesting room. It's a xeno death room...

[MrJJJ]

This is why...i hate aliens...not even bothering to place walls or obstacles for those fucking escapes...

[TopHatPenguin]

Also before anyone says it yes i know i mainly play marine.. but from listening to alien players and observing rounds it's all really down to how you co-operate as a team also how you structure your hive as well.
Some of the stuff in this list has already been said but i'm just gonna put it up anyway for reference.

Gonna have to go out and say..
1) You can spam tackle as much as you like.. yes i know it doesn't always work but goddamn it most the time does.
2) You have neurotoxin for a reason use it
3) Build up some walls and doors so the escapee cannot get far
4)Warriors and runners both have a pounce ability
5)The infection on a marine is faster now so really you only have to knock them down a couple of times and the rest is done for you via blackouts.
6) If a marine manages to escape your defenses that shows your hive is weak and you should really fix it...

[apophis775]

THe disarm time, is LITERALLY one second shorter. There is no in-between.

[Evilkyle24]

+1

I'm gonna say its REALLY FUCKING ANNOYING to tackle someone now. They stand up so fast that unless you tackle them on the nest, the input delay for switching and grabbing them, then dragging them is longer than it takes for them to stand up and start running. The only way to reliable take someone down in under a minute when they start doing this is to have more than one alien, and have one alien drag while the other one spams tackle. I was the QUEEN and the fucker was standing up so fast that I barely moved him one tile before he got up again.

And by input delay, I mean that while I can input Disarm, grab, switch, disarm, move in under 2 seconds, the game won't let me put it in that fast without missing inputs.

The timer should at least be long enough to move someone two tiles into a nest.

[Evilkyle24]

Also before anyone says it yes i know i mainly play marine.. but from listening to alien players and observing rounds it's all really down to how you co-operate as a team also how you structure your hive as well.
Some of the stuff in this list has already been said but i'm just gonna put it up anyway for reference.

Gonna have to go out and say..
1) You can spam tackle as much as you like.. yes i know it doesn't always work but goddamn it most the time does.
2) You have neurotoxin for a reason use it
3) Build up some walls and doors so the escapee cannot get far
4)Warriors and runners both have a pounce ability
5)The infection on a marine is faster now so really you only have to knock them down a couple of times and the rest is done for you via blackouts.
6) If a marine manages to escape your defenses that shows your hive is weak and you should really fix it...

1) True, but you still have to move them and aliens cannot pull marines, last time I played we had to grab them with intent, which slows you down.

2) Not everyone has neurotoxin, precision targeting opens a shitty interface unless you want to risk hitting someone already nested.

3) Doesn't matter, we still have to wrestle the little shit back into the nest, and the near instant stand time makes this a real pain in the ass.

4) Pounce removes your ability to move for a duration. Its a hindrance when you can't hugger someone afterwards, and since hives are close quarters, pushing and shoving makes it hard to move the guy.

5) The blackout timer is over a minute long, I've escaped in less time.

6) This isn't about escaping, its about having to chase someone around a 3x2 room for a solid minute trying to get them to lie down on a nest because you can't immobilize them for longer than a second.

[Davidchan]

1) True, but you still have to move them and aliens cannot pull marines, last time I played we had to grab them with intent, which slows you down.

2) Not everyone has neurotoxin, precision targeting opens a shitty interface unless you want to risk hitting someone already nested.

3) Doesn't matter, we still have to wrestle the little shit back into the nest, and the near instant stand time makes this a real pain in the ass.

4) Pounce removes your ability to move for a duration. Its a hindrance when you can't hugger someone afterwards, and since hives are close quarters, pushing and shoving makes it hard to move the guy.

5) The blackout timer is over a minute long, I've escaped in less time.

6) This isn't about escaping, its about having to chase someone around a 3x2 room for a solid minute trying to get them to lie down on a nest because you can't immobilize them for longer than a second.

1) Runners are the only ones who can't pull marines without grabbing them. Warriors, Drones, Sentinels and Spitters are all notorious for disarm tackling marines, ctrl dragging them and running away spamming tackle. Warriors, who are ludicrously fast, can drag a marine from the bridge to Robotics before the first tackle even wears off.

2) You were both Sentinels, and both had spit. You can easily quick spit and recent updates added a Shift + Click spit interface so a Xeno doesn't even have to target a marine to spit, so they can hit people they can't even see.

3) If your hive was even half competently made, even a 3x3 room shouldn't be that hard to renest a marine. Especially since most Hive layouts have nesting rooms covered from wall to wall with nests, you really only need to disarm the marine once and quickly drag their sprite onto the giant purple nest they tripped in front of and you've nested them. Drones are the only ones who have problems with this, since their disarm is short enough to be non-exsistent, but it's not the drones job to watch hosts, it's a Sentinels job. If drones are watching hosts, your team is doing it wrong.

4) Pounce delay is minimal at best, especially for warriors who can put a person into a hard crit by pouncing a person and slashing them 5-6 times immediately. Plus it's an autohit, there is no way to actually avoid being pounced and it puts one of the 2 strongest melee Xenos directly ontop of you. If you can't infect a lone marine after pouncing them, you REALLY need to learn how to play.

5) This goes back into previous points. Unless a marine is helped out of a nest, he only has 2 tries to escape. He'll begin blacking out on his third try and likely be unconscious when he does wiggle free and burst before he wakes up if someone is in the ghost-queue. The only times Marines escape is when other marines rescue them, or the nest was so poorly made that he can bolt for the door and shoot/slash it open and run out of the hive into the rest of the station. If you didn't even bother to remove a Marine's armor, you can't be surprised when he pulls a rifle out and shoots his way out.

6) Sentinels have nearly twice as long of a disarm as Drones do right now, and drones shouldn't be hunting or disarming marines except in direct defense of the Hive (which if they are, means the runner and sentinel castes are all dead.) As drone, you should be avoiding fights and making sure the queen is safe. If Runners and Sentinels are trying to fight the marines and you run in to try and slash marines, you're probably going to get in the way and more likely to push an actual combat caste into the line of fire and get them killed. When armed marines show up, get the fuck out of the way. If this is about subduing infected marines, that's not that much harder either, especially for runners or sentinels who can use their LOLSTUN abilities and drag a host to a nest. If you're really having that much trouble with one host you should go play on goon or hippie and learn to be robust.

[Butterrobber202]

1.) I REALLY dont think you have played alien recently, Warriors got the Disarm nerf to, and runners who get jelly and dont die are few and far between.

2.) YEAHHH, Shift + Clicking a Marine spamming his arrorw keys in Engineering Lobby is fun and When we DO HIT him our Nerroutoxin DOESN'T FUCKING LAST LONG ENOUGH FOR US TO GET TO HIM.

3.) 3x3 Room filled with nests, you have to be DAMN fucking careful not to click another fucking nest and end up Freeing another marine. WHILE the Marine you are trying to tackle is running around freeing people. And Sentinel spit last about as long as DRONE Disarm times, so when you spit, he will fall, the get right back up.

4.) Pounce can be used by 2 types of Xenos. ONE of them cant even fucking pull. And you shouldnt be slashing infected hosts.

5.) Put when you try to open the door to that 3x3 room he will BOLT to the fucking door, and push you out of the way, getting out of the nesting zone, And when we try to drag him back, our disarm timers are shit.

6.) Sentinels are fucking nerfed as hell. They have a almost a HALF second spit time, and weak tackle. And if the Marine doesnt land on a nest or a nest that has another marine on it, well,. He has to drag and spam tackle to get him there, then when he hops up, he runs in the fucking other way. And then you repeat

[Evilkyle24]

1) Runners are the only ones who can't pull marines without grabbing them. Warriors, Drones, Sentinels and Spitters are all notorious for disarm tackling marines, ctrl dragging them and running away spamming tackle. Warriors, who are ludicrously fast, can drag a marine from the bridge to Robotics before the first tackle even wears off.

2) You were both Sentinels, and both had spit. You can easily quick spit and recent updates added a Shift + Click spit interface so a Xeno doesn't even have to target a marine to spit, so they can hit people they can't even see.

3) If your hive was even half competently made, even a 3x3 room shouldn't be that hard to renest a marine. Especially since most Hive layouts have nesting rooms covered from wall to wall with nests, you really only need to disarm the marine once and quickly drag their sprite onto the giant purple nest they tripped in front of and you've nested them. Drones are the only ones who have problems with this, since their disarm is short enough to be non-exsistent, but it's not the drones job to watch hosts, it's a Sentinels job. If drones are watching hosts, your team is doing it wrong.

4) Pounce delay is minimal at best, especially for warriors who can put a person into a hard crit by pouncing a person and slashing them 5-6 times immediately. Plus it's an autohit, there is no way to actually avoid being pounced and it puts one of the 2 strongest melee Xenos directly ontop of you. If you can't infect a lone marine after pouncing them, you REALLY need to learn how to play.

5) This goes back into previous points. Unless a marine is helped out of a nest, he only has 2 tries to escape. He'll begin blacking out on his third try and likely be unconscious when he does wiggle free and burst before he wakes up if someone is in the ghost-queue. The only times Marines escape is when other marines rescue them, or the nest was so poorly made that he can bolt for the door and shoot/slash it open and run out of the hive into the rest of the station. If you didn't even bother to remove a Marine's armor, you can't be surprised when he pulls a rifle out and shoots his way out.

6) Sentinels have nearly twice as long of a disarm as Drones do right now, and drones shouldn't be hunting or disarming marines except in direct defense of the Hive (which if they are, means the runner and sentinel castes are all dead.) As drone, you should be avoiding fights and making sure the queen is safe. If Runners and Sentinels are trying to fight the marines and you run in to try and slash marines, you're probably going to get in the way and more likely to push an actual combat caste into the line of fire and get them killed. When armed marines show up, get the fuck out of the way. If this is about subduing infected marines, that's not that much harder either, especially for runners or sentinels who can use their LOLSTUN abilities and drag a host to a nest. If you're really having that much trouble with one host you should go play on goon or hippie and learn to be robust.

You REALLY need to play alien more, and read what I said. You clearly have no idea what we were talking about, because you mention infecting the marine. We're not talking about that. We're talking about someone who has already been infected and got out of the nest and its now fucking impossible for anyone other than a warrior to get him back in the god damn thing.

Sentinel and drone disarms are fucking short, they're meant to let you infect someone, not subdue a target, and the spit time is a joke until you evolve. All it does is make them drop their gun and they're immediately back on their feet, its to give a warrior a chance to grab the slimy git.

Why you would slash at someone who is infected is beyond me, and like I said, that stuns you when you pounce, so unless you jumped on him when he was on a nest, you're gonna have a fun time getting him back on it. Sentinels and warriors have better things to do than watch prisoners, a sentinel is ostensibly designed for defense but its better to have him run with a team of warriors so you can get more xenomorphs, and have them crawl back to the hive if you're under attack.

This guy wasn't in a room full of nests, we snagged him and moved him into a room about three layers of defense in, so the hive's nesting grounds in that area were rudimentary. Mostly eggs with one or two nests. We didn't move him deeper because we didn't want to risk him waking up on the way. We couldn't just slap another facehugger on, because they're really picky about sloppy seconds.

Again, did you even read what I wrote? He was IN THE HIVE, the Warriors and Sentinels were out hunting, and he had already been huggered. We were just trying to keep him from being able to get out and got a knife from his boot in the face for the trouble. We got him down, but it took so long he started blacking out almost immediately after we strapped him in, because he would stand back up by the time we moved him a single tile. I was the fucking QUEEN and he wasn't staying down for long enough to get him two blocks into a nest.

[MrJJJ]

If someone get's up after a warrior or ravager or queen tackle in like, 1-3 or any low time, they powergamed and took some stun-resistance items (yes, those exist)

[apophis775]

What are the thoughts, after I recently re-extended it. Is it better? I noticed, aliens hvae been steamrolling marines last 2-3 days...