Ban research grenades from use on the sulaco.

[xBoBox3]

Summary (a quick, 2-3 sentence summary):As the title entails, research grenades should not be used on the sulaco, at all. ICly, you might cause a breach that will doom you completely to the void of the space. OOCly, you're just being a dick for killing the entire xeno race when they board.

Benefits (How this will benefit the server and game as a whole): No more "one boom, gg" grenades that win rounds because a researcher decides to powertrip into madness.

Details (Description of how you think this would work, the benefits, etc): So far, i've seen three situations when the researcher just bombs the fuck out of the rasputin when the xenos board and just win the round for the marines, no matter how well/bad they did, no matter how many xenos there are, no matter how the round has been going up until that point. This is just like the old "death cages" from when we were allowed to build in the hangar and it should be banned, just like those. It's annoying to be on a roll, streamline marines as alien for two hours, getting close to reaping your rewards with that xeno major, then getting wiped out because a researcher decided to man up. This is unfun for marines as well, since why the hell would you work for a victory when you can just bait the xenos on the shuttle and bomb them?

Implementation (Optional, if you have an idea how to implement it): Simply add a rule that disallows the usage of research grenades on the Sulaco, or on any of the transport shuttles.


Pic related, a wild researcher decides to decimate the entire lower deck.

[Radimir]

Someone is salty about the round that is in progress, lmao.

-1

Researcher can't make grenades anymore? Then what do they even do in the round? And please don't say 'RP'. 90% of the crew is more focused on stopping the xenos. The other 9% is focused on running the engine or ordering the marines more gear, they don't have time for the research department. If you want to remove the research department entirely, that's fine. But banning them from making the last combat item that they possibly can anymore is just stupid.

[Neray]

Sir, you're being salty after last round. It takes quite a while to make such nade, plus 95% of time it ends up just stunning even t1's.

I'll tell you more - we can even use valve bombs on Sully, in case of full scale alien shit.

Summarizing it all:
DEAD: Dimitri Paramo says, "why would a human kill a xeno"
DEAD: Dimitri Paramo says, "that is so dickish"

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------1
is it odd?

[xBoBox3]

In response to both posts above this one: Look, this is the exact same reason we banned building in the hangar. Remember when we used to make "death cages" in the hangar, with emitters and electrified grilles surrounding the shuttle? Why do you think we removed those? I've seen this happen THREE times in a row and admins never dealt the same punishment to the researcher, even though i've been assured that the researcher making grenades has been punished.

It's not about "xenos die, boo-hoo, pls nerf". It's about marines not even bothering to play the game anymore. Why would marines even bother setting up sentries, putting up barricades at the ladders, trying to defend, when you can just ask the researcher to make 20 32x32 death grenades and wipe the xenos as soon as they land? Preferably picking up a marine major along the way as well, since if xenos are landing, they're probably coming up with all their forces.

Look, this is just complete unfun for all sides involved, and when marines just kill 20-30 xenos without any effort, we're supposed to ignore them? Preferably even give them an award, right?

[Radimir]

Because he didn't just whip up those grenades like you imply. He spent the entire three and a half hour round making and testing those grenades. The only sudden change was slapping signalers on them to be able to trigger them.

Stop being salty just because you lost.

[Neray]

1) If you're killing too many marines with it as well, you're getting a tasty ban.
2) I can count researchers who know how to do it with less than 10 fingers.
3) Same can be applied to valve bombs. They're rare, they're hard to make properly and you can consider each one a small achievement. For example, few months ago I used a valve bomb at lower deck when we had 10:1 aliens:marines ratio, killed almost whole raiding party and one SSD marine in closet. Later on we killed 2 surviving runners, repaired hull, regrouped, retook LZ and won that round.
4) You're acting like one of those people who think that everything extraordinary is bad and should be removed. I've seen many of em in usual SS13 and, damn, those guys are cancer.

Once again - successful research nades are even more rare than valve bombs and it takes tons of work to make even one powerful enough to crit somebody.

[EXOTICISME]

It takes quite a while to make such nade, plus 95% of time it ends up just stunning even t1's.
is it odd?

Yes it take quite a while to make such nade.
Yes 95% of grenade (not grenades) just stunning T1
But from what i've seen it always multiple huge area grenades that activated with signallers. The question is, why do researcher even bother to make such nade if they won't give it to marines?

Yet again, "That's a good strad to defend Pod/Rasputin/Sulaco hangar from overwhelming alien". But then they shouldn't know that the Queen has ability to use console so they shouldn't be preparing grenades at such caliber for above reason.

How do you think the grenades manage to get inside the Rasputin when the queen call it? Because it's built before hand.
Why the scientist keeping so many grenades and not giving it to the marines? For when the aliens board Sulaco. That's metagaming.

Im guessing that no matter how huge the radius is, it still deal the same damage as normal frag grenade. Then you have 3-9 grenades ready to be detonated when Aliens doesn't have so much room to move. Which will completely wipe most of the xenos.

And please, stop saying about salty aliens that get killed by bombs, don't act childish. We are here to discuss about the 9x9 nades that always used to kill xenos when they try to board the Sulaco. Not smearing salt on other people wound and laugh at them.

Then what should we do with science 9x9 grenades? I'd say make the max cap to 3x3. Signaller grenades is fine, it's another way to kill unexpecting xenos. But a grenade that can cover the whole screen and easy to be made so you have 10 stacks of it is cancerous.

[Kevinthezhang]

Because he didn't just whip up those grenades like you imply. He spent the entire three and a half hour round making and testing those grenades. The only sudden change was slapping signalers on them to be able to trigger them.

Stop being salty just because you lost.

I don't think the time it takes to make these grenades should be a factor given the gameplay implication. It's like saying: "The researcher has a Marine Major Victory button and that is ok, because he spent a lot of effort to make it"

[Neray]

That's metagaming

We still have a rule about premade defenses and metagame. In current round, though, researcher placed those nades AFTER queen used shuttle console.

> researcher can't have nades in stock
Oh, alright, what's next? RO can't have weapons in stock? Engineers can't have tools in stock? Oh, medics that made med chems before wounded with proper injury came in should be banned as well!

[EXOTICISME]

> researcher can't have nades in stock
Oh, alright, what's next? RO can't have weapons in stock? Engineers can't have tools in stock? Oh, medics that made med chems before wounded with proper injury came in should be banned as well!

You are missing a point here. Researcher suppose to be making grenades so marines can happily armed with frags. But lately they keep it for themself. Unless i'm missing the part where researcher announcing it in radio that he has stocks of grenades free for take and the marines ignore it. If that's the case im fine with them making tons of grenades for people who actually listening to radio channel.

[Neray]

You are missing a point here. Researcher suppose to be making grenades so marines can happily armed with frags. But lately they keep it for themself. Unless i'm missing the part where researcher announcing it in radio that he has stocks of grenades free for take and the marines ignore it. If that's the case im fine with them making tons of grenades for people who actually listening to radio channel.

You want RP reason to make those? He's a fucking researcher. He can do whatever he want with his chems, experiment after experiment. IC wise, he just kept em for testing on something, for example.

Using your logic one can blame anyone for anything. Marine took too many spare ammo mags with him? UUUU, BAN HIM! Medic took some organ-healing pills from medbay? UUUU, BAN HIM! MT replaced few wires at Sully, in order to prevent powerline from damaging in case of shit? PERMA THIS BASTARD!

[xBoBox3]

And this is why i didn't suggest "removing grenades in general".
I just want them to be banned from usage on the sulaco. Big difference there. Researchers can make whatever the fuck ultra grenade they want, just don't use it on the sulaco.

[Neray]

And this is why i didn't suggest "removing grenades in general".
I just want them to be banned from usage on the sulaco. Big difference there. Researchers can make whatever the fuck ultra grenade they want, just don't use it on the sulaco.

Listen, Box. There're 2 parts of game: OOC and IC. ICly speaking, if you have anything you can use to survive this alien horde madness - you'll use it. OOCly, if you're not being a total dick, like, for example, you didn't kill 20 marines with that nade, just cause you thought ALIUMSOVERRUNIT - it's fine. There're not so many special weapons marines can use on sully and rare res nades are one of those.

[xBoBox3]

Listen, Box. There're 2 parts of game: OOC and IC. ICly speaking, if you have anything you can use to survive this alien horde madness - you'll use it. OOCly, if you're not being a total dick, like, for example, you didn't kill 20 marines with that nade, just cause you thought ALIUMSOVERRUNIT - it's fine. There're not so many special weapons marines can use on sully and rare res nades are one of those.

That logic can go for more than two thirds of the rules we have in place.
Not to say that grenades shouldn't be used on a space ship, ever. No matter how you look at it. RP-wise, you might doom the entire ship to the void of space, as i said in the OP. Lore-wise, even a standard frag grenade is shown to cause breaches. I touched both of these subjects in the OP. Did you even read it?

By this logic, we should also re-allow building in the hangar, right? It's not like it makes any sense not to build defenses there.

[Neray]

It's not like it makes any sense not to build defenses there.

RP wise droppod and dropship aren't just teleporting in, they're flying in and so they need free space around to do so (also, if you watched original film, you should remember how whole undocking procedure worked).

RP-wise, you might doom the entire ship to the void of space, as i said in the OP. Lore-wise, even a standard frag grenade is shown to cause breaches.

Those massive spaceships aren't made out of 2cm steel plates, lore-wise. They can easily handle even a SADAR, except for areas with direct access to space, like if you AP hangar doors (it'll take few good hits though, it's not a single piece of metal, but rather a huge system of lined up doors). Even though Sully isn't that new and was refitted few times, it's still a fucking warship. It has outer and inner armor, it has automatic defense systems, it has orbital cannons and antispacecraft lasers. Even though english wikipedia for some reason lacks info about Sulaco's armor, other sources claims that it has few layers of pressurized empty space between armor layers and that inner and middle layers and explosion-proof. Which includes even special AP rounds.

IT IS A WAR MACHINE. IT CAN HANDLE THIS SHIT.

Code-wise though, folks are just too lazy or busy to implement new game mechanics, such as realistic armor, turn-based space ship-to-ship combat, working z-levels etc.

Our Sully is far from its original counterpart.

[Warnipple]

The amount of people I banned for metaing the shuttle with research grenades is too damn high.

+1

[Toroic]

I think you could even just make them prohibited in the hanger it would stop the level of metagaming that currently occurs.

[Sarah_U.]

Prohibited in hangar, whole sully is a no-no for me as I find them good for bridge last stand and other areas. Plus, xenos are able to retreat once they see you're throwing grenades at them every single time they try to push... Or they can play smart and work the attrition war.

[Casany]

i remember one round when i was queen and had only 5 xenos left...we were fighting bridge, and EVERY push was met with death grenades. the humans won, but went from 12 to 4 and 1/2. Anyway, i agree to restrict them from the hanger but not from the ship as a whole

[Radimir]

By the way just so you all know, the grenades for this round were NOT on the shuttle/pod. The bag of bombs was tossed down the ladders where the cluster bombs went off in a spectacular series of blasts.

[YungCuz]

I mean unless the research update can get here faster i wouldn't really remove the only real useful thing the researcher can do. Aside from that probably just have it restricted to hanger. Neutral i guess.

[Lamby]

95% of time it ends up just stunning even t1's.

Seriously? Look at this image and tell me again how researcher nades arent round enders for xenos.



+1

[Neray]

Seriously? Look at this image and tell me again how researcher nades arent round enders for xenos.

We should ban OB as well! I heard those can be quite deadly, we don't want any xenos to die, right? It totally ruins roleplay!

By the way just so you all know, the grenades for this round were NOT on the shuttle/pod. The bag of bombs was tossed down the ladders where the cluster bombs went off in a spectacular series of blasts.

*claps*
Now we should ban people for throwing items down the ladder, that's bullshit. I mean, those poor drones built such a good trap with 9 huggers, and marines griefed it with a single nade! That's OP!

[zskninoh]

-1 Research nades are bae. They even the odds.

[Spider]

-1

:^)