Vendor Restocking

[KingKire]

Summary:
Retool Vender-Restocking (where you unscrew a vendor and shove a depleted or almost depleted item back into the vendor to get a "fresh" version of that item) to be a more dedicated feature instead of a bug-turned-feature or possibly even remove it.

Benefits:
To me, Vendor Restocking has always been a little bit on the edge when it comes to cheesy bug vs. Actual Feature. I think its cool that marines have a way to restock the vendor machine when more meds are needed, such as inprovaline bottles or extra dexlin+ autoinjectors, but its really easy to go into Item-Duping Territory in my opinion. Things like advanced burn kits can be duplicated multiple times for each patch to create up to 4 new fully restocked burn kits, Inprovaline and dylovene bottles can be mixed to create unlimited amounts of tricord, etc.

Now, I know this is an RP server, and like at a table top, people are asked to govern themselves and to play well, but in my opinion that when possible we should always have a decently tight rule set to follow up on just so everyone is on the same page. I think Vendor-Restocking toes the line enough where it could use a more dedicated game-rule/coding on what is or isnt fair to create out of the infini-machine.

Personally, I think that Gameplay-wise, having limited/depleting amount of resources to work with definitely helps reinforce the theme of Aliens; where our heroes are getting more and more desperate as time goes on, especially when it comes to critical resources like medical supplies and such.

Details:
If i had to think of some ideas to make vendor restocking more "restricted", I would code in some way that restocking items causes the machine to lock up for a bit as it tries to refill the item, the same as when an autolathe takes metal sheets or is in the process of producing something. This would be a simple way to fix the problem, but i think there would be more elegant and interesting solutions out there, such as maybe a "charge" system, where you can restock "x" amount of items before the vendor needed to recharge itself. This would create an interesting dynamic as people would have to think carefully about what items they wanted to charge for the first batch scince the second batch is going to be some time away.

Ex:
A) Time-Restriction: Sticking a depleted item into a vendor causes it to freeze up for "3 seconds" as it refills the item

B) Charge system: You can stick in "5" separate items into a vendor to have them be refilled fully, before the vendor takes "30 seconds" for it to be able to do it again.

C) Limited Charge System: You only have "X" amount of charges before the vendor is completely out of supplies to restock medicines/ ammo with.


There are more ideas that can always be had, and i hope some people post them down below, or have more indepth comments and thoughts about the issue.

[Sarah_U.]

To me, it's all explainable.
If you restock chemicals you're simply implying the nanomed has a built-in feature to mix chemicals at will.
If you restock ammunition or items inside a box or container (Such as medkits or whatever) you simply imply the vendor inserts the proper amount of material using a serie of tools (Sci-fi). After-all, maybe there's a storage inside the ship or the vendor somewhere.
If you REPAIR an item... Well the vendor simply mold it back in shape, having molds prefabricated to do so- The items aren't all really that complex.

Otherwise, I'd still give it a -1 on any form of removal of the feature as a whole. I deeply enjoy the idea of having a way to restock indefinitely as long as it takes EFFORT.
(Annoying as hell to stock on ammo, especially when vendors are empty and marines are trashing the entire prep).

Cargo could also always have a way to move the vendor over a restocking mechanism that would slowly start filling up the vendor, or a method involving a large crate that would be connected to the machine for refill, who knows. Charges and delay sounds good if both are very unrestrictive.

[Toroic]

The only issue I have with this is that currently this can be used for marksman ammo, which is significantly superior to AP rounds.

[NoahKirchner]

When it comes to medical, if you like the idea of having a depleting amount of resources, you have to make injuries fix-able through stuff like surgery. For example, add in a surgery to fix internal bleeding instead of using quick clot etc. That was just how I would do it if I had to, but I like the current ability to restock vendors, but I wouldn't be opposed to a short timer for refilling stuff.

[TopHatPenguin]

For example, add in a surgery to fix internal bleeding instead of using quick clot etc.

I know that's a example but still, you can already fix internal bleeding through surgery the steps are even clearly shown on the wiki surgery page.

[NoahKirchner]

I know that's a example but still, you can already fix internal bleeding through surgery the steps are even clearly shown on the wiki surgery page.

Oh, oops, guess I never saw that. Thanks :D

[Neray]

-1, I'll basically double Sarah here.

The only issue I have with this is that currently this can be used for marksman ammo, which is significantly superior to AP rounds.

Noize already fixed this issue, M41/M will be the only gun that can use those. We just have to wait until he'll upload it.

Personally, I think that Gameplay-wise, having limited/depleting amount of resources to work with definitely helps reinforce the theme of Aliens; where our heroes are getting more and more desperate as time goes on, especially when it comes to critical resources like medical supplies and such.

Listen, just look at medical crew in usual rounds. Those guys are barely able to do bone surgery or mix something as easy as bic. It's a fucking warship and I can't imagine a fucking warship running out of, I don't know, BASIC MEDICAL SUPPLIES after 2 hours of battle.

Whole restocking thing is highly optional and 95% of the time marines won't bring back their mags. Or broken helmets. Or empty/used medical equipment. Imo, this is a solid and well-placed feature.

[completelynewguy]

-1, even if the knowledge about restocking is spread, it's likely the marines aren't going to recycle used resources.

[Iatots]

+1 For evolving it out of a bug/feature status.
I feel the best way to do this RPly would be to have similar restocking mechanics as the food and drinks vendors on other server. You could even turn that secondary anesthetics storage near operations 2 into a general stock room. I would also like to see tiny warehouses in the sulaco remaps, but there is no ETA on that.

[EMT_321]

Its hard enough to do medical as is. This seems like it adds to that.

-1

Total: -2

[KingKire]

Just to reiterate my point here, its VERY easy for people to abuse this restocking "feature" who, like me, tend to push space stations engine to the limits of what it can do. I would rather have it be instead of relying on say, ones own intuition, we had a more concrete definition of where the limit line is.

Its not very hard to grab a several bottles of dylovene and several bottles of inprovaline, and bam, you have infinite easily mass produced tricord pills for the rest of the round, as well as unlimited amounts of dylovene and inprovaline. The same can be said for mass producing incendiary shells, where the amount of effort put in to get them is impossibly small compared to the amount of use they bring. This is technically game-breaking, and the only limit on it is where the player himself decides to draw the line between "troops need supplies" vs. "I need to limit what i can do for the sake of RP".

I personally have some, but not alot, of trust in players to do the right thing RP wise, and self govern, but even then many players cant help themselves. Most people dont want to be the xeno who "forced" themselves to die to OB strikes. Most people dont want to be that marine who trys to pet the xeno and then gets two huggers to the face.

Its important that we make a few ground rules, and in my opinion, having an infinite dispenser of supplies could use some more clearing up.

[Neray]

So far I saw only 1 guy abusing cargo too much. Yes, Ruben, I'm talking about you.

All another points except for this one are meh, since we already have inf amounts of trick anyway aka sleepers. AND that's why we have OD on every chem in game.

Also, about that "no efford". It actually takes a lot of time and CLICKCLICKCLICKs to do any of those things that you, hm, don't like so much. And even 200% abuse of restock system can't win a round for marines if they're bad in general. Tested many, many times.

[Surrealistik]

-1. Make medical even harder and more stressful? Make chemistry less chem charge efficient? Fuck no. It should be officially recognized as a feature as is, not removed from the game or nerfed.

Literally felt obliged to log in and post just for this.

[freemysoul]

Restocking has NEVER been a bug, it was a ported feature from Baystation. It is a legitimate ability of the vendors. the only problem I have is AMMO restocking for certain weapons *Cough* SADAR *Cough*

[username123]

Restocking has NEVER been a bug, it was a ported feature from Baystation. It is a legitimate ability of the vendors. the only problem I have is AMMO restocking for certain weapons *Cough* SADAR *Cough*

Restocking sadar rockets from empty shells it's a feature, devs are fully aware of the restocking mechanic, if they don't wanted the RO or CTs to restock sadar rockets from empty shells, they would not add the sadar rockets to that vendor in the back of req in the first place.

[Snypehunter007]

Just use a screwdriver. -1 from me

Asking this to be locked.

[forwardslashN]

Restocking sadar rockets from empty shells it's a feature, devs are fully aware of the restocking mechanic, if they don't wanted the RO or CTs to restock sadar rockets from empty shells, they would not add the sadar rockets to that vendor in the back of req in the first place.

Restocking is actually problematic for a number of reasons, including this one. The two back-end cargo vends are there for people to stock items so they don't have them lying around everywhere on the floor, not to restock rockets. But clearly people find new and interesting ways of abusing that feature (and not just the rockets, mind you), so I think I will either remove them entirely or severely limit what they can store.

[Snypehunter007]

This has been implemented.

Asking this to be locked.