Leadership powers ACTIVATE!

[Renomaki]

Summary (a quick, 2-3 sentence summary): Make Squad Leaders all the more important by giving them the ability to provide a selection of temporary buffs to his men within a radius of his position.

Benefits (How this will benefit the server and game as a whole): As of current, squad leaders aren't really all that great when you think about it.

Sure, you got the ability to call for supplies anywhere with a supply beacon (although you don't have the ability to make it instant) and you also can summon a [really hard to use an inaccurate] orbital bombardment that can turn the tide of a battle if used right, along with being a source of intel for command thanks to his helmet cam. But other than that, he is mostly a heavier armored marine that has access to command comms.

Because there isn't a whole lot of reason to remain close to the SL (other than he told you so), marines have a habit of fucking off and getting lost in the jungle/tundra, and of course dying horrible deaths and weakening their squad and the marines as a whole due to carelessness. And even IF your squad doesn't do that, in the middle of combat, you don't really contribute much to a fight other than an extra pulse rifle (and possibly friendly fire). With this, SLs will have more importance and value to squads, and can contribute in ways other than simply shooting shit and being able to throw glowy things around, and hopefully make it so squads are a whole lot tighter and work together better.

Details (Description of how you think this would work, the benefits, etc): Xenos have three buffs to aid them, mainly in damage, armor and recovery, so I suppose giving SLs 3 buffs of their own to deploy when needed would be fair and allow for some tactical options to suit whatever situation might take place.

The Aggressive Stance: When this buff is activated, marines move somewhat faster than normal, which would be perfect for when you want to stage a charge into the enemy line with bayonets at the ready. if possible, I'd imagine a melee damage boost would also be in effect, encouraging the idea of an organized charge with a group of marines.

The Defensive Stance: This buff is useful for when the marines are getting overwhelmed and need a little help holding the line, giving them a minor damage reduction buff to keep the marines alive and on their feet a little longer before they all die horribly.

The Steady Stance: This buff I imagine would help improve the accuracy of marine's ranged attacks, as well as help marines get back on their feet a tad faster after being stunned.

You could only use one buff at a time, and they would only last for about 10-15 seconds before the effects fade away, and of course similar to the xenos, you could combine the effects with other SLs to make marines a tad more effective in several areas, but keep in mind that there is a long recharge between uses (probably 2-5 minutes), so SLs wouldn't just carelessly activate them to deal with a single runner. Just like with xenos, you need to know WHEN to use a buff and which buff to use in that situation to ensure the survival of your men under your wing.

Implementation (Optional, if you have an idea how to implement it): If we still have the wizard code in the game, I suppose you could make it so SLs have a "spell" of sorts that they can use. It would also be a good idea to do some testing to find that magical area that allows marines to have a buff that'll both help them and not be overpowered, since I don't want leadership buffs to be THAT strong. After all, marines are only human, a buff shouldn't turn them into SPESSMARINESS in a blink of an eye.

[TopHatPenguin]

You could just implement these buffs the same way pheromones are for aliens.

Also, +1 for this suggestion as it's pretty similar to this suggestion which would also be great but they are kind of the same idea just this current suggestion has more options for the buffs.

[Renomaki]

You could just implement these buffs the same way pheromones are for aliens.

Also, +1 for this suggestion as it's pretty similar to this suggestion which would also be great but they are kind of the same idea just this current suggestion has more options for the buffs.

I admit that I thought up the idea from that mentioned suggestion, but decided to make one more focused on increasing importance for the SL and providing incentives for marines to work together with their squad, rather than MAYBE getting a buff from a handful of random marines.

Like I said, being an SL is a rather thankless job with few perks and little respect from the men that follow you, so giving SLs the ability to use leadership buffs in an area around him to improve the men following him would not only make marines more willing to stick close to him and allow him to help in battle in ways other than spraying bullets, it'll also make it all the more appealing for players to play, meaning we'll have more players wanting to play as an SL and thus make it easier to ensure every squad has leadership.

I myself been trying to get into SL lately, but I honestly find it hardly rewarding at times due to just how difficult it can be to get marines to reliably follow you and how what little tools you have do only so much to help (and of course are in short supply, meaning one bad OB and it is gone for good, no second chances). I think having the ability to provide passive buffs would allow me to focus even MORE on leading than fighting, and encourage the marines to get into formation more instead of running off after the first runner they see in the middle of a heated fight.

[Jroinc1]

What's the SL DOING to give buffs?
-1, MIGHT be convinced to 0 with a better explanation.

[TopHatPenguin]

What's the SL DOING to give buffs?
-1, MIGHT be convinced to 0 with a better explanation.

Marine version of alien pheromones, Icly think of this as 'morale boosts' or 'tactics' which the Sl is employing, probably tactics as they all correspond to stances.

[naemless216]

We need a standard bearer for this, not squad leaders!

[solidfury7]

This idea would make it much more likely for the marines to play more as an organised force than they currently are.

If this idea is explored and tweaked, I could see this being an excellent addition.

[Jroinc1]

Marine version of alien pheromones, Icly think of this as 'morale boosts' or 'tactics' which the Sl is employing, probably tactics as they all correspond to stances.

But marines DON'T have pheremones, or resin building, they have overwhelming firepower and metal building... what is the SL doing to cause this? Screaming "SHOOT BETTER"? I'm worried this'll become like free combat stims for marines.

[Renomaki]

To add onto this, they should make it so that the moment a buff is triggered, the SL shouts out the name of the stance, to better coordinate with his men.

"Lets kick some ass marines, AGGRESSIVE STANCE!"

"Hold the line marines, not a step back! DEFENSIVE STANCE!"

"Take aim men, STEADY STANCE!"

Now that I think about it, they should do something similar with xenos so you know which xeno buff you got from a nearby drone or hivelord. But that is another topic all together.

[TopHatPenguin]

But marines DON'T have pheremones, or resin building, they have overwhelming firepower and metal building... what is the SL doing to cause this? Screaming "SHOOT BETTER"? I'm worried this'll become like free combat stims for marines.

Considering the marines have icly gone through military training to get to where they are now, the Sl shouting orders for certain stances isn't out of the ordinary, for instance i'm presuming in the modern military they employ different stances for assaulting an area instead of being in a blob, same goes for defending as well.

The aggressive stance can be linked icly to marines preparing for combat, limbering up and preparing themselves to storm whatever building or area the SL assigns.
The defensive stance could be linked to a morale boost from the SL icly giving a speech to encourage the marines nearby to stand and heed their call to hold the line.
The steady stance could be linked to marines being more aware of their surroundings as the SL is shouting at them.

There are many different ways to interpret what the stances could be related to icly, this is only some of them off the top of my head, Reno probably has a better idea of what they invision

I mean the only thing xenos do for their pheromones icly is release chemicals, so i'm sure marines with training icly would heed the orders of their SL for certain stances from military training.

[Renomaki]

But marines DON'T have pheremones, or resin building, they have overwhelming firepower and metal building... what is the SL doing to cause this? Screaming "SHOOT BETTER"? I'm worried this'll become like free combat stims for marines.

Leaders are supposed to push their men to the limit and encourage them to fight harder when the time needs it. When Japanese officers ordered men into banzi charges, those troops charged towards the enemy with considerable bravery and fury, no matter the situation they are charging into. Same goes for Russian officers ordering men to not take a step back when defending the motherland, going so far as to have men killed for daring to show any amount of fear. The Russian people pushed themselves to the very limit to serve their county, running into machineguns and through artillery and refusing to let any of that stop them despite how foolish it is.

It takes a great deal of charisma and training to be able to convince a bunch of young men to charge to their deaths, or hold the line to the last man (even going so far as to self sacrifice themselves to do it), and your "SHOOT BETTER" idea is probably what a lot of officers would tell men to do to avoid wasting ammo like idiots.

In general, officers are supposed to lead, and no amount of firepower is going to be enough. If you can't get your men organised, how are you supposed to be a good leader?

[Jroinc1]

Very well. +1

[Warnipple]

Condtional +1, for abilities but not what is stated in the OP.

Alright so I don't really like stances because it doesn't really make sense from a logical perspective. Instead I propose an active ability that has several positive effects. One that comes to mind is the Captain in Company of Heroes 2. They have an ability called "On me!" which buffs nearby infantry along with a bunch of other things.

Maybe make an ability for Squad Leaders called "On me!" which provide a small audio cue, grants nearby infantry stun resist or instant get back up from knockdown and provide a small speed boost for a short duration. This ability needs a 60 second cooldown or something and shouldn't affect the Squad Leader.

[Renomaki]

Condtional +1, for abilities but not what is stated in the OP.

Alright so I don't really like stances because it doesn't really make sense from a logical perspective. Instead I propose an active ability that has several positive effects. One that comes to mind is the Captain in Company of Heroes 2. They have an ability called "On me!" which buffs nearby infantry along with a bunch of other things.

Maybe make an ability for Squad Leaders called "On me!" which provide a small audio cue, grants nearby infantry stun resist or instant get back up from knockdown and provide a small speed boost for a short duration. This ability needs a 60 second cooldown or something and shouldn't affect the Squad Leader.

Well, this is the suggestion forum after all, and even if they don't use my powers, as long as they give SLs SOMETHING that makes them valued. Supply Drops and Orbitals just aren't enough anymore, they need abilities that make them LEADERS, and encourage players who play them to try and be less combative and focus more on leading.

I still think having a selection of more focused buffs would be nice, though, if only for balance. Don't want to cause too much salt now, having marines that can insta-getup after knockdown could nullify the queen's roar if used right, which would cause all manner of drama.

[Coldflame]

Rather than pheremone-style buffs, how about callouts on a shared cooldown which each have their own effect for a set period? You could use one of them every few minutes, so playing SL would actually involve reading fights and employing tactics rather than just hitting buttons any time you see ayys. Nothing solid, but things like:

-'Keep fighting!'- Mitigates the effects of pain for a moderate period, potentially reducing stuns as well. Allows a losing squad to potentially turn the tide.
-'Move it!'- A brief speed boost which can be used to either advance on the enemy or get a headstart for a retreat.
-'Focus fire!'- Shots have significantly diminished chances of missing their mark or being stopped by armor for a brief period. Useful for dropping solid targets during prolonged engagements rather than emptying several mags into a crusher sat behind a corner on weeds.

Some limitations would probably be in order, such as requiring at least three marines present and possibly only impacting the leader's squad.

[Karmac]

Where mah "HOLD THE LINE MEN!" order at though?

But in all seriousness, this is like the Orders system from the Warhammer 40k Tabletop game that the Imperial Guard get, it can be SUPER OVERPOWERED if you get lucky, the rest of the time you'll have a tard SL who won't understand or use it. And you can bet your ass if they don't block these buffs for some weapons such as the SADAR or Smartgun, Xeno salt levels will be very high indeed.

But it is a cool idea, I feel like it should just be limited to Movement speed and Toughness buffs unless a better suggestion can be implemented.

[ParadoxalObserver]

We need a standard bearer for this, not squad leaders!

>Standard bearer

Explain to me why the bearer...? The Squad Leader COMMANDS and the marines work through organization. Defensive buff, for example, would be telling the marines to form ranks, steady their position, take cover. Offensive position would be, for example, telling marines to follow him as he takes point, and ready the bayonets for a good charge. Steady is a bit weird and I'd feel a different one might be best here, if anything some of these buff ideas need to be changed to be more useful or really mostly only steady will be used as ranged is the most commonly used.

The point is there's a point to officers, it's that when you're following orders of someone tactically savy you all work better. It's why militaries have a chain of command to begin with. So yeah, the man yapping orders improving the squad's performance through cohesion makes a lot more sense than some dude with a flag somehow making everyone work better because flag.

[ParadoxalObserver]

Where mah "HOLD THE LINE MEN!" order at though?

But in all seriousness, this is like the Orders system from the Warhammer 40k Tabletop game that the Imperial Guard get, it can be SUPER OVERPOWERED if you get lucky, the rest of the time you'll have a tard SL who won't understand or use it. And you can bet your ass if they don't block these buffs for some weapons such as the SADAR or Smartgun, Xeno salt levels will be very high indeed.

But it is a cool idea, I feel like it should just be limited to Movement speed and Toughness buffs unless a better suggestion can be implemented.

Honestly, I think the sergeant from Warhammer should be what the SLs here are based on when it comes to the point. And the SADAR and Smartgun...? How would these buffs make people more salty? The SL wouldn't be improving ranged damage as someone yapping orders doesn't make your gun shoot harder and the SADAR and Smartgun already have insane accuracy so missing is already highly unlikely. If anything, ranged buffs seem like they'd barely affect these.

[Karmac]

In regards to the SADAR and Smartgun, I meant that as an argument to Coldflames order - "Focus Fire!", which would improve Armour Pen, which would make Smartgun fire a bit more punishing and SADAR AP missiles overkill. Sorry for not clearly stating that.

[ParadoxalObserver]

In regards to the SADAR and Smartgun, I meant that as an argument to Coldflames order - "Focus Fire!", which would improve Armour Pen, which would make Smartgun fire a bit more punishing and SADAR AP missiles overkill. Sorry for not clearly stating that.

I might be wrong, but I'm pretty sure if penetration beats armor all damage goes through. Even if not, AP SADAR missiles tend to put even elite T3's into critical so it's not like it'd make a huge difference. And if you check the Accepted Suggestions one is to improve the Smartgun's armor pen since it's more or less useless against armored targets. So again, this won't make a huge difference and will generally just help these weapons.

I actually think Focus Fire is a great idea since it'd mean that crushers can no longer just rush at marines crazily without thinking first. If there's an SL and the squad is now well positioned, the SL's leadership can have them set a good defense and although I'm certain an ability like this wouldn't suddenly make every single normal M41A shot go through the crusher, the increased likelihood of one going through along with the number of marines from that squad could start discouraging some insanely ballsy plays.

And it's not like this would be insane either, it'd once again force hunters to do the job that they're meant for in large fights - going after specific targets that will heavily hit the marines. Usually that's Specialists, now it'd come to include the SL.

And in a way, the aliens already have this but much stronger. They have a bunch of xenos that can cast pheromones and unlike SLs these can be replaced. And then you have the Queen with her godly screech of doom. The difference is if the Queen or other xenos are removed they get replaced. And SL being gone is permanent. So it'd mean the Xenos would actually have to start thinking who to target besides - "Target SADARs and after those are removed go to town"

[Renomaki]

Really, if SLs ever did get leadership powers, I'd want them to have a useful impact without going overboard and causing salt. Xeno buffs clearly are designed to improve damage, armor and regen, but at the same time aren't too major to turn xenos into unkillable war machines. The same should be for leaders, who can give buffs that should help the marines in some way or another, but not so much that it breaks the balance of the game.

It's easy to get tempted to make some really useful powers for SLs that could really turn the tide of a battle, but you gotta remember, you have to think of the other side as well. For instance, having an ability that can suddenly unstun a bunch of marines in a radius around an SL after a queen warcry would be INSANELY broken and would create an imbalance in the marine's favor.

Having powers that provide more minor, even almost subtle bonuses would be a little easier to balance, since while I want marines to have more incentive to follow their SL around, I don't want the SL to become a living crutch for the marines either. Like my main post suggested, the "stances" I used would have just enough impact to be useful, while at the same time balanced to still allow xenos a chance when fighting (which I know is strange to say, but still, xenos are players too).

Of course, like this whole forum, this is but a suggestion, and if people have better ideas for what kind of "leadership powers" you could give SLs to make them more valuable to marines, feel free to share. Suggestions that aren't flexible aren't going to have a chance at being accepted, after all.

[Renomaki]

I'm gonna be a DOUCHE and bump this up, because it needs to be considered.

#MAKESQUADLEADERSMOREUSEFUL

[masterspots]

Squad leaders make marines a bit more resistant to pain, that'd be nice letting you stay in the fight but not healing you or anything.

[Eenkogneeto]

FEAR ME BUT FOLLOW!

[forwardslashN]

I don't believe this is in line with what we are doing or the spirit of the game. Denied.