Stop Stunlocking

[Surrealistik]

Summary (a quick, 2-3 sentence summary):

Stop skilless, unfun, bullshit stunlocking by applying a cumulative stun resistance for each application of a stun effect.


Benefits (How this will benefit the server and game as a whole):

Stop skilless, unfun, bullshit stunlocking.


Details (Description of how you think this would work, the benefits, etc):

Whenever a Weakened(i.e. knockdown)/Paralysis effect is applied to a Marine, Alien or other mob, a stack of 'stun resist' is applied. Each stack cumulatively reduces subsequent/following stun durations by 50% (or some other % as tweaks dictate; formula would be X * 0.5^Y where X is the initial duration, and Y is the # of resist stacks), causing most stuns to suffer diminishing returns (I would add a field in a stun application function that enables certain stuns to bypass/ignore resist stacks for the sake of things like Chems/Stun Batons/Tasers/Halloss strikes/TACKLES (just to be clear) etc). All resist stacks are removed 5-10 seconds (per tweaks/testing) after the last application of one.

Also to make this work correctly, stun times should probably be standardized and not RNG bullshit.


Implementation (Optional, if you have an idea how to implement it):

Minor coding changes.

[Sarah_U.]

I'd actually do the opposite, with a fast recovery rate. Call it stagger. If you disrupt the balance of a marine to the point he can't stand, he trips and now you can stunlock him by keeping him pinned with certain mechanics.
Otherwise recovering because you,re disbalanced seems off.

I still like the idea, but I'll stick to neutral.

[Toroic]

Stuns already have highly variable times for things like tackle and a failure rate to make stunlocking relatively difficult, and this would prevent being able to move infected hosts any significant distance if they escape the hive.

[Surrealistik]

Stuns already have highly variable times for things like tackle and a failure rate to make stunlocking relatively difficult, and this would prevent being able to move infected hosts any significant distance if they escape the hive.

Tackles would probably be subject to exemption much like Stun Batons/Tasers would be per the bypass element of the stun application function.

Also swallowing is still a thing.

Stun times should not be variable; that's fucking retarded.

[Toroic]

Tackles would probably be subject to exemption much like Stun Batons/Tasers would be per the bypass element of the stun application function.

Also swallowing is still a thing.

Stun times should not be variable; that's fucking retarded.

Infected hosts can't be swallowed if they're awake, because they can chestbuster out of the xeno within 10 seconds.

[forwardslashN]

>Implementation (Optional, if you have an idea how to implement it):

>Minor coding changes.

So you say. This is not changing with the current system of combat, hugger carrying and all. What you are talking about is a major change to the game, and right now xenos have no way to keep hosts down at all without spam tackling. I'm debating closing this right now, but in itself this suggestion isn't that bad. Stun-based combat is pretty awful. It's also completely unworkable with how things are now.

[Surrealistik]

@Toroic: I'm aware; what I'm saying is that per the current system, hugging + devour still works, as does tackle spam.

@forwardslashN: Spam tackling isn't affected per the OP; they receive an exemption like chems, batons, tasers, etc.

[forwardslashN]

If you're not talking about applying resistance to things like tackles and tasers, what will this actually prevent? There are very few ways in the game to get stunned for decent duration without that stuff you listed, as far as I'm aware anyway. A lot of stuns are simply pain-based rather than true stuns, too. Queen's screech, for example, stuns you for a few seconds. The queen can't spam it. Pounces and tackles wear off in a second or two. Batons and alien disarms are the only things that I can think of that are consistently used against humans. Xenos only get stunned by explosions, and getting hit by one is usually a death sentence regardless.

[TopHatPenguin]

I'm presuming the suggestion would affect when you get stunlocked through neurotox spam.

[Surrealistik]

If you're not talking about applying resistance to things like tackles and tasers, what will this actually prevent? There are very few ways in the game to get stunned for decent duration without that stuff you listed, as far as I'm aware anyway. A lot of stuns are simply pain-based rather than true stuns, too. Queen's screech, for example, stuns you for a few seconds. The queen can't spam it. Pounces and tackles wear off in a second or two. Batons and alien disarms are the only things that I can think of that are consistently used against humans. Xenos only get stunned by explosions, and getting hit by one is usually a death sentence regardless.

I'm talking about hard stuns, such as that via Screech, Stomp, Neurotox and Pounce. This will also help vs chain stuns from grenade spam when Marines are going full Campaco even though I don't think it will be at all a complete solution (Aliens really need to have multiple points of invasion).

In general Neurotox and Pounce based suppression will be most affected, and it will significantly impact cheesy strategies where these are used as Screech/Stomp follow up, or in tandem with each other.

[LiquidRecluse]

+1

witnessed myself getting tacklespammed repeatedly without no way to get out of it.

[Yacobpo157]

+1

Deployed at B18 Spec early game, two runners and a spitter stun locked me back to their hive, and took out my helmet. They got their Queen killed, but they still shouldn't be able to do that and me not having a chance to fight back.

[Toroic]

+1

Deployed at B18 Spec early game, two runners and a spitter stun locked me back to their hive, and took out my helmet. They got their Queen killed, but they still shouldn't be able to do that and me not having a chance to fight back.

You seriously feel that a third of the xeno team working together shouldn't be able to stun you back to their hive?

Seriously?

[Surrealistik]

You seriously feel that a third of the xeno team working together shouldn't be able to stun you back to their hive?

Seriously?

Yeah, I'm not sure this is the best example of chain stuns being problematic, since if they all chain tackled you which this proposal doesn't address, they would be just as successful.

That two runners and a spitter can chain suppress two marines in a combat almost indefinitely is more problematic.

[Tristan63]

The devs wont change the system they already have in place because of a possible salt filled addition.
While I do agree that getting tackled in any situation ends the round for you with no way to resist at all, is pretty shitty.
I also find some realism in it, but I also don't think xenos should be able to tackle because they have huge claws for hands.

[Sailor Dave]

Something like this would be putting an unnecessary band-aid on an issue that is hotly debated right now, hugger combat. Most people don't like it, and solutions like halloss are still under consideration, although based on Forwardslashn's comment, possibly not. There should be, and probably is, more of a focus on reworking the system entirely right now for something better, rather than trying to make the current one work.

[Surrealistik]

Something like this would be putting an unnecessary band-aid on an issue that is hotly debated right now, hugger combat. Most people don't like it, and solutions like halloss are still under consideration, although based on Forwardslashn's comment, possibly not. There should be, and probably is, more of a focus on reworking the system entirely right now for something better, rather than trying to make the current one work.

It should be noted that this isn't intended as a 'bandaid' solution, or a substitute for getting rid of combat huggers, which I've outlined a comprehensive fix for here: http://colonial-marines.com/viewtopic.php?f=59&t=7572

This is intended as a _supplement_ for removal of combat hugging, but also works as a standalone fix to bad existing mechanics that are separate and distinct from hugging.

[MrJJJ]

Pounces and tackles wear off in a second or two.

Unless i missed something, pounces from hunters and any T2-T3 aliens last a hell lot longer than 2 seconds, to the point where a mature/elite hunter can pounce you once and slash you to death withing the entire stun time

[forwardslashN]

Unless i missed something, pounces from hunters and any T2-T3 aliens last a hell lot longer than 2 seconds, to the point where a mature/elite hunter can pounce you once and slash you to death withing the entire stun time

I don't know what you mean by other t2's, 3's, but you are right about hunters. Their pounce is longer than two seconds. I think I had it confused with an older version of the game, where hunters were changed to pounce marines for less stun time, but pounce more often. It probably got changed pretty quickly after that, unsure.

[Jakers457]

Isn't stun locking the bread and butter of killing people?

+1 would shake things up a bit.

[Surrealistik]

Isn't stun locking the bread and butter of killing people?

+1 would shake things up a bit.

Yep, including for Marines at times with chained shotgun blasts and grenade spam.

[Surrealistik]

Bump due to being on 2nd page.

[Butterrobber202]

-1

No. If you get stunlocked it's because you didn't have any marines around you to shoot the stunner. This would make Rambos really good

[InterroLouis]

Don't forget that when you do get pounced, any marine that does try to shoot the xeno is more likely to hit you and not the xeno.

[Surrealistik]

-1

No. If you get stunlocked it's because you didn't have any marines around you to shoot the stunner. This would make Rambos really good

...Or you got machine gunned by neuro/chained by pounce/stomp with plenty of combatants on both sides.

...Or you were a Xeno being deluged with grenade spam.

Rambos are still going to get rekt by 2-3 v 1s, unless he's robust and the aliens he's fighting aren't. That bad players can't use stunlocks as a crutch is a _good_ thing.