Ban Appeal- Mikeche

[DesFrSpace]

-.- Tip: Don't fuck up the 2nd chance, and you didn't put your past history of playing on other server.

[apophis775]

I'll wait to hear from Rahlzel, since he did the permaban.

[Rahlzel]

The previous ban appeal, which was denied exactly one month ago: http://cm-ss13.com/viewtopic.php?f=87&t=3326

On one hand, I think "permaban" should mean something, especially to someone as toxic and hypocritical as you. Humans will do or say anything to get what they want, so it's difficult to believe that what you're saying is genuine.

On the other hand, I'm not byond second chances. Though I'm extremely reluctant, I'll agree to lifting the ban if that's the consensus amongst staff, heads, and any members of the community that want to add their opinions.

[Feweh]

I'm a strong believer in second chances, after all sometime's you need to make small and big mistakes to improve yourself as a person.

I hope this is truthful and you are indeed sincere about your previous action's.

+1 If you read all our rule's again and you guarantee you'll be an amazing player in-game.

[SASoperative]

I honestly do not really know if I want to give you that second chance yet but I suppose I can give a +1. If you commit any form of rule breaking though expect the staff to be harsher given this is your second chance

[apophis775]

I re-checked the last one.

I'm gonna vote -1, for one main reason. Because you, in-game, did this:

[01:23:14]ADMIN: Rahlzel/(Valdus Rahl) used Toggle Sleeping on Mikeche/(Alien Larva (640)).
[01:23:18]OOC: (LOCAL) Alien Larva (640)/Mikeche : ok ill srop lol
[01:23:26]OOC: (LOCAL) Alien Larva (640)/Mikeche : oi fucking admin
[01:23:29]OOC: (LOCAL) Alien Larva (640)/Mikeche : stop faggot
[01:24:28]SAY: Alien Larva (640)/Mikeche : Gay

[01:25:35]ADMIN: PM: Mikeche/(Alien Larva (640))->Rahlzel/(Valdus Rahl): u mad ninja?
[01:26:22]ADMIN: PM: Mikeche/(Alien Larva (640))->Rahlzel/(Valdus Rahl): See if I care about some notes, whats youre issue?
[01:27:33]ADMIN: PM: Mikeche/(Alien Larva (640))->Rahlzel/(Valdus Rahl): ok crybaby

In my opinion, you can fuck right off.

[Allan1234]

I re-checked the last one.
In my opinion, you can fuck right off.

^^^^^^^^

[Rahlzel]

Completely understandable, i'd feel the same way if I didn't know how to forgive

You're already on the fence, so you follow up with a snide remark?

I've seen less sentences over worse scenarios then pushing.

If you think this is just about pushing around the Queen, you haven't been paying attention.

You removed me outright because my defensiveness was interpreted as offensive and that because of what I said, the sentencing was escalated and when I disputed it defensively, it of course didn't make the case any better because again I was being interpreted as offensive, or in your terminology, "toxic." This was my first ban by the way.

"Interpreted"... If you scroll up a bit to see Apophis' pasted quotes of yours, I think anyone of sane mind would easily be able to "interpret" what you said in one possible way.

-1

I'm rescinding my previous statement about agreeing to lift the ban. Your OP was obviously a lie. You don't regret a single thing. You're back in defensive mode, desperately trying to find blame on anyone but yourself. You're not toxic. You just haven't grown up yet.

[SASoperative]

I will leave this open for a bit more input before I make my decision.

[apophis775]

I know how to forgive, and I've given a LOT of second chances when it's deserved and if people might actually positively contribute.

But you don't seem to care about our rules or structure at all, to reply to the co-host so offensively in-game in the first place.

And your getting defensive and trying to defend your actions, when you shouldn't be. Those actions are NOT ACCEPTABLE ON ANY SERVER. If anything, you should be explaining why those actions wouldn't happen again.

The thing is, I can VERY EASILY tell if someone deserves a second chance fairly quickly. And from my view, right now, you don't. Maybe one day, but not now. I have the feeling that, if we lifted your permaban you'd end up doing something again (probably within a few days) and get permabanned again.


As far as my "variable" punishments. I try to adjust the punishments to fit to the situation and what happened. If someone is a repeat offender and on their last chance, I'll sometimes give them a lengthy ban instead of a perm, because in some cases (for long time players) a 7 day ban, will give them time to calm down and reflect on what they did so they don't do it again. That's the purpose of lengthy ban, and we've had some players who did get long bans, and then realized we were serious about them not breaking the rules, and they stopped.

Nothing I do is random (at least, when I do things officially), it all has a purpose and a reason.

A permaban, isn't mean to give someone time to reflect on what they did, it's done because we don't believe they the person can be a contributing member of the community, and the consensus is that they need to be removed. Typically, because said person acts like an angry dick to staff, super openly griefs, or just denies that they really did anything wrong. Sometimes, like your case, it's because toxicity was detected on par with the League of Legends community, and it's better to remove thatquick and clean than to let it fester. That's what happened here, I saw your reaction to, again (for emphasis) the CO-HOST (who is also, the much more lenient side of our overall command structure, and one of the 3 main powers of the server), and realized, you would be nothing but toxic if you were to remain as a player.

I mean "see if i care about some notes?" Apparently, you care about those notes now, and it only took a permaban to get your attention. That's not the type of player we want.

[apophis775]

I am speaking in reference to the first encounter, and previous appeal, hence, when i was talking about you responding to the co-host in-game like that.

[Feweh]

In my opinion I think he made a selfish mistake.

He didn't cause server wide grief or cause any real round impacting issues. However, you were rude and extremely immature in how you handle authority. One thing you need to realize quickly with any form of authority is that your opinion is usually invalid and void. Arguing and defending yourself with rude of snide remarks will get you no-where, especially if you're already in trouble... sometime's you just need to bite the bullet and accept your situation.

However, I don't think he deserves a PERM ban.

Yes, he was rude to staff but in all honesty we've had WAY worse offenders get off with less and we've dealt with players who have been far more aggressive. I don't believe this warrants a permanent removal from the community.

This player has not been a CONSTANT toxic individual, he made a few minor mistakes (I checked his notes). He also caused no SERIOUS round disruption aside from "annoying" the Queen.

My point being and I agree with him is that we've let people off are FAR worse incidents. So essentially, if he's being banned permanent it's for poor attitude which I do see from him. I just disagree with you Apop when you say that he'll simply jump in-game and be a giant asshole who causes problems.

[apophis775]

For reference: http://cm-ss13.com/viewtopic.p ... 515#p30515

[DesFrSpace]

It's sad to see, but the person isn't sane enough, he's gone fu-bar. Aye, well one less person to worry about. If I only got that second chance on the other server. Later.

^who are you?

Note sure who you're talking about? PM PM

[Wickedtemp]

On the fence, though my +/- 1 won't have much of an affect on this I'm sure.

Second chances are nice, it's good to forgive and such, but they seem like a toxic player, and if there's one thing this server DOESNT need, it's toxic players.

[Lostmixup]

I cannot take someone with "troll" in their name seriously at all. Ignoring that point though, it just looks like a sob story begging to be brought back instead of a legitimate apology (the original appeal, as in the original post*).

* = edit

[Lostmixup]

And what about this appeal where there is a legitimate apology?

I meant the original appeal as in the original post; I tried to clarify that a little bit.

I still stand by my opinion that your appeal seems more like you just trying to appeal to our good side (which isn't 100% bad of course) with some empty sweet words such as: "I apologize to the Administration for giving you guys such a hard time. I know you work hard to make the game fair for all players. I completely respect you."

Your first ban appeal - since you reminded me of it - is actually the polar opposite of this one entirely as well. The first one was blaming the person who banned you, this one is appealing to the person who banned you. Now, of course it's important to appeal to us but you're just over doing it in my opinion. It comes off like you don't really think what you did was wrong, but you're just saying it is so you can get back on. Now, regardless of if what you originally did was right or wrong, the over dramatic nature of this second appeal just comes of - as stated before - as insincere and fake.

Perhaps you're 100% genuine and want to play again because you want to, it's understandable a person may have changed their views on something a bit in a few months. Honestly though, you've come across like a child trying to get his toy back; trying to get the parent to pity you, and saying a bunch of sugar coated words that don't have any meaning behind them all so you can do what you want with your toy again.

I don't think I need to put down a vote, it's pretty clear what I think.

[Lostmixup]

Ok if i am "overdoing" it. How should have apologized since I've come off with the impression of a child. Since this post is very dramatic and a polor opposite of the origional appeal. Trust me the original appeal was over dramatic. The reason why I apologized to the administration is because I work as a supervisor in UPS customer service. SO I WORK DAILY with adults in their 20-50s who call on the phone like 12 year old kids with tantrums. So trust me when i apologized, it was 100% genuine.

Well, the way you apologized almost sounds like a customer service guy, and since you are one it kinda explains why it feels that way. Although, you can't tell me that all of your apologies as a customer service guy are genuine, they just sound genuine, and that's the largest problem with the apology: It sounds like someone trying to sound genuine instead of someone actually being genuine.

Perhaps that's just the nature of trying to make an appeal such as this, but we aren't big wigs at a company. Being frank and unprofessional can sometimes come off as more genuine than your second appeal. I mean simply saying "I'm sorry pls unban me" wouldn't have worked obviously, but perhaps sounding a little less... artificial would've worked out better.

This is all my opinion of course. I'm just a guy on the internet, not some boss at a company; maybe Rah and Apop appreciated the apology more, but I personally found it to be superficial.

[apophis775]

Same thing, it felt like he was saying what he thought we "wanted" to hear.

And we don't necessarily want an apology, typically, we want people to convince us that it won't happen again and that you won't be breaking more rules.

But I don't think you seem to understand us.

[Adjective]

Based on what I can infer from the situation I would define him as a player that is not only toxic, but oblivious to his own actions. Being one who is normally all about giving people second chances, I cannot find it in my heart of ice to forgive this poor unfortunate soul. He comes to appeal a ban, yet he makes crude remarks and then speaks to non-staff that are permitted to share their opinion as if they are not important towards his appeal.

-1

[ChickenShizNit8]

I know it's hardly my place to speak, but from all the other problems he's caused, the general lack of shits to give about the trouble he caused... It seems to me like some heavy back-peddling he's done here. I agree fully with Apop, a Perma-ban should not really just be lifted. If he got Perma-banned, it should STICK. Here is the definiition of PERMANENT

lasting or intended to last or remain unchanged indefinitely.

This guy is toxic, and it needs to be removed, and kept removed. You don't let a terrorist back out into freedom because they realized they're in the wrong, right? (I know, he wasn't banned for grief but it's just an example aye?)

Just my input though

[Lostmixup]

I know it's hardly my place to speak, but from all the other problems he's caused, the general lack of shits to give about the trouble he caused... It seems to me like some heavy back-peddling he's done here. I agree fully with Apop, a Perma-ban should not really just be lifted. If he got Perma-banned, it should STICK. Here is the definiition of PERMANENT

lasting or intended to last or remain unchanged indefinitely.

This guy is toxic, and it needs to be removed, and kept removed. You don't let a terrorist back out into freedom because they realized they're in the wrong, right? (I know, he wasn't banned for grief but it's just an example aye?)

Just my input though

I think some of the logic there is a tiny bit weird lol. Either or, I don't think this guy should be unbanned either.

[Jdobbin49]

i give him a -1 I do believe in second chances however he does not seem to regard the rules.

[Jdobbin49]

ok ok I am sorry then I am staying neutral so just forget I was here.

[Jdobbin49]

I Probably should have just stayed out of it completely now that I think about it