A small rant about (some) Spec players

[Kineem]

While it sucks to roll spec and get FoB duty, and a good SL should let the spec go to the frontline with a QRF to help in the battle. I still think it's a good attitude to listen to your SL, atleast in my experience whenever I have a spec that refuses to stick with the squad it passes down to the PFC's who will also see no reason to stick with the squad and what ends up is a completely disorganised squad and a very stressed out SO and SL.

The FOB squad doesn't really need to have cohesion unless Command tells you that you'll be leaving soon to assist the frontlines, which, if they do, I'll stick around until we move out. Marines that want to leave FOB usually will leave no matter what the other marines do and those that want to stay with the SL will do so no matter what from what I've seen.

Spec is a gamechanging role in the right hands. You're a BIG MAN, if you're not out there kicking ass and taking names then you're just not doing it right. Some kits I understand more than others, but if you're a SADAR and you're just chilling at the FOB you're just wasting the specialist slot and squandering the fun you could be having with your fancy equipment.

SADAR is such an important kit it's not even funny. You can singlehandedly win the game for marines if you're good, systematically eliminating every problematic alien, which is why I don't care about staying at the FOB if I manage to get the kit. They are the only tool marines have to defeat a good Praetorian or a good combat Queen. On top of your serious importance in the game and the major responsibility you have to be out there killing shit, it's also seriously boring to just... afk at FOB.

[Kineem]

oh, and as a side note, if I'm SLing and my squad is assigned to FOB duty I form a QRF team that includes me, the spec, most of the PFCs and all but one medic that goes to the frontlines once contact is called out over Command chat, heheh.

[Sulaboy]

Maybe we should remove the specialist role, and balance around it's absence.

[Drevenshekel]

Maybe we should remove the specialist role, and balance around it's absence.

[Kineem]

Maybe we should remove the specialist role, and balance around it's absence.

never

[Drevenshekel]

Once I was playing as SL and my spec wandered of with other squad and died. First, I tried to call him back. He didn’t even answer to me. I reported to XO before his death. No reaction. I ahelped. That’s IC issue.
You can’t make people follow the rule if there’s no punishment.

This has happened to me plenty of times, its bad enough when they throw their own lives away but often it leads to entire squad wipes when your biggest weapon goes off somewhere else and you get ambushed by T3's who can see that your SADAR aint with you. Theirs no effective IC punishment for it, "We'll call the MP's on you when you return to the Almayer and they might do something" is not gonna do anything, their needs to be OOC standards to be upheld by spec players.

[KingKire]

I'd be down for turning specialist into its own form of unique scaling job slot.

You have 20 combat marines, you get 2 specs... you have 40 combat marines, you get 4 specs.

We can balance the game around the fact that having a bunch of specs in low pop isnt easy to balance (also slightly rediculous, having barely 2 pfc's, and 4 specialists running round), and getting specs in high pop as a seperate addon roll to an operation as a whole.

Fuck, maybe we should just balance the game around having squads be unlocked as you get more players into a game. If its low pop 20 players, you have alpha and bravo squads unlocked, if you have 40 players, you can unlock all the squads and their potential.

[CABAL]

MORE POWER TO PFC's!

Remove specs.
All you have to add are "single use rocket launchers". Going with Space Vietnam theme: "M72 LAW".
Maybe something like M60 machine gun and other fun stuff.
More toys for PFC's is what we need. Two birds with one stone: Fun for PFC's and the end of Special Spec Snowflakes/Rush for prep/RNG rolls.
Just make it that those toys are "unlocked" 10 minutes after round start and here you go.

[Steelpoint]

While a interesting idea, but how are you meant to balance out the heavy weapons if there is no dedicated role to use them?

Best concept I can think of is adding a style of 'billets' to each squad that each PFC can select a 'billet' that gives them a scaled down version of a spec kit, but there are a limited amount of bilets per squad.

So a flamer billet would give you the Pyro Armour and the Pyro Flamer, but the Armour and Flamer would not be as powerful as the Spec version to compensate for there being more of them. The RPG Billet would give you two or three single use SADARs. The Scout billet would give you the M4RA and the Scout armour but no cloak, etc, etc.

Big issues with this are two fold of balancing larger scale uses of Spec weapons, and now turning being a PFC into another shitty rush to the vendor to get your spec/billet kit before others do.

[kastion]

While a interesting idea, but how are you meant to balance out the heavy weapons if there is no dedicated role to use them?

Best concept I can think of is adding a style of 'billets' to each squad that each PFC can select a 'billet' that gives them a scaled down version of a spec kit, but there are a limited amount of bilets per squad.

So a flamer billet would give you the Pyro Armour and the Pyro Flamer, but the Armour and Flamer would not be as powerful as the Spec version to compensate for there being more of them. The RPG Billet would give you two or three single use SADARs. The Scout billet would give you the M4RA and the Scout armour but no cloak, etc, etc.

Big issues with this are two fold of balancing larger scale uses of Spec weapons, and now turning being a PFC into another shitty rush to the vendor to get your spec/billet kit before others do.

the idea sounds good if theres some way to stop rushing. Imagine having 10 people with sadars at the start just rushing across the map and instakilling 5+ young xenos especially t3s. That's game automatically.

[RuAlastor]

MORE POWER TO PFC's!

Remove specs.
All you have to add are "single use rocket launchers". Going with Space Vietnam theme: "M72 LAW".
Maybe something like M60 machine gun and other fun stuff.
More toys for PFC's is what we need. Two birds with one stone: Fun for PFC's and the end of Special Spec Snowflakes/Rush for prep/RNG rolls.
Just make it that those toys are "unlocked" 10 minutes after round start and here you go.

That would be a massive nerf for marines. To begin with, you can try to add 1 free HEFA to marine vendor and see what's gonna happen.

[CABAL]

That would be a massive nerf for marines. To begin with, you can try to add 1 free HEFA to marine vendor and see what's gonna happen.

I don't see nerfs here. Instead of one fragile SADAR spec, you have two-three PFC's in each squad with single use SADAR. You don't have to wait and count on that one Spec to be everywhere. Since we don't have any means of fast transport on the battlefield, many less powerfull "specs" are better than single powerfull spec. Atleast with multiple RPG's, many marines can test them out. First rounds after adding this would be rather painfull for marines, but in time they would learn. "Unga Dunga me RPG don't shoot at other marines" probably. Req could send more that kind of stuff.

Instead of one scout, you can have few PFC's with incendiary bullets in sidegrade versions of Pulse Rifle.

Instead of only one pyro, we can have few PFC's with flamer (we already do thanks to SL's).

Instead of only one sniper, we can have few PFC's with weaker bolt-action sniper rifles (IFF included). I imagine this as very long range slug. Teaming up with another PFC sniper would allow for some tactics to mess with boilers protected by defenders. Coordination while one shoots defender and stuns it and the other shoots boiler with incendiary.

We could get retrofuturistic M60 for few PFC's who could really spray suppresive fire and demolish xenos who use pure WWI tactics.

[RuAlastor]

I don't see nerfs here. Instead of one fragile SADAR spec, you have two-three PFC's in each squad with single use SADAR. You don't have to wait and count on that one Spec to be everywhere. Since we don't have any means of fast transport on the battlefield, many less powerfull "specs" are better than single powerfull spec. Atleast with multiple RPG's, many marines can test them out. First rounds after adding this would be rather painfull for marines, but in time they would learn. "Unga Dunga me RPG don't shoot at other marines" probably. Req could send more that kind of stuff.

Instead of one scout, you can have few PFC's with incendiary bullets in sidegrade versions of Pulse Rifle.

Instead of only one pyro, we can have few PFC's with flamer (we already do thanks to SL's).

Instead of only one sniper, we can have few PFC's with weaker bolt-action sniper rifles (IFF included). I imagine this as very long range slug. Teaming up with another PFC sniper would allow for some tactics to mess with boilers protected by defenders. Coordination while one shoots defender and stuns it and the other shoots boiler with incendiary.

We could get retrofuturistic M60 for few PFC's who could really spray suppresive fire and demolish xenos who use pure WWI tactics.

Nah, it's a nerf in the way HEFA nerfs muhreens. They never learn.
Instead of one potential FF-gib we have 3
Instead of one Unga m41 (for example, I though it had IFF, when I first used it) we have 3 and so on
But in general, yes it's a buff. And a huge one. It's hard to play around one decent SADAR spec as beno. 3 (even single-use) would be even more painful. You deffinetly should NOT increase number of spec weapon and armor.

[Avalanchee]

Hmm today I will sit in the FOB as a demo

[waswar]

I quite like that idea. Giving the corps a bit more weapon variety and also eliminating the need to learn at least four different load outs just to be second in command are two worthy things, in my opinion.

And god do I love that sniper idea.

[CABAL]

Nah, it's a nerf in the way HEFA nerfs muhreens. They never learn.
Instead of one potential FF-gib we have 3
Instead of one Unga m41 (for example, I though it had IFF, when I first used it) we have 3 and so on
But in general, yes it's a buff. And a huge one. It's hard to play around one decent SADAR spec as beno. 3 (even single-use) would be even more painful. You deffinetly should NOT increase number of spec weapon and armor.

I wasn't talking about Spec armors. Everything would be scaled down when number of available equipment raise.

Single-use SADAR would work like M72 LAW, no rail scopes, no mag harness, just pure rocket with less raw DMG power. Imagine a better HEDP grenade that explodes directly on impact. Weaker than real SADAR, but still decent to hit those cocky T3 xenos. Two per squad + additional stuff from Req after the first drop (There could be mechanic preventing acquiring more before first drop).

Bolt-action Sniper Rifle for PFC's would also be scaled down. Slower fire rate (big delays), less DMG, yet untility not reachable by single sniper spec.

Instead of demo: Retrofuturistic M79 Grenade launcher with two-three barrels and special nades like HEFA that don't send shrapnels in direction of which it was fired. Flare nades to light up areas outside screen range to combo with Snipers.

Three single-use SADAR PFC's won't be more painfull for xenos that one SADAR spec. Spec can ask for many more rockets, can ask for different types, his sole mission is to use it, he can attach minirail scope etc. If as a xeno you will encouter squad where SADAR spec is, you will have a hard time becouse he will target every xeno in his way, while other groups have more leeway. In scenario when there is few PFC's, it will be very lucky for marines for all of them to be decent. It will be balanced. One will be decent, other will not. While one SADAR spec is a mistery. He is good? Great! He is bad? SHit... We will lose. From single binary answer to few options in a matter of seconds.

They could get other armors to help xenos recognise threats. Sniper PFC would get "upgrade item" that will let him move slighty faster and his armor will get cool camo pattern. Something like that.

[Drevenshekel]

Hmm today I will sit in the FOB as a demo

you don't have to sit on the fob all day but it doesen't mean you have to rambo off and not worry about your squad

[Avalanchee]

you don't have to sit on the fob all day but it doesen't mean you have to rambo off and not worry about your squad

FOB duty or not, Good spec is one of the biggest game changers marines have and rolling it isn't easy, I won't ditch my squad unless I have a proper reason to do so;
(joining the offensive, active threat near me, group of robust people etc.)

I know that you're still angry about THAT ONE round where Lyla left you and joined Delta in caves, but she sure as hell helped alot to secure the epic marine victory.

Also
If you leave your squad as a spec it's your fault, good luck rolling spec twice in a row.

[Awesomesauce935]

PFC Unga Dungason yells like an idiot: "SPEC WHITELIST!"

[RuAlastor]

FOB duty or not, Good spec is one of the biggest game changers marines have and rolling it isn't easy, I won't ditch my squad unless I have a proper reason to do so;
(joining the offensive, active threat near me, group of robust people etc.)

I know that you're still angry about THAT ONE round where Lyla left you and joined Delta in caves, but she sure as hell helped alot to secure the epic marine victory.

Also
If you leave your squad as a spec it's your fault, good luck rolling spec twice in a row.

I believe, it's not about THAT round where spec left his squad to actually help marines and was with other squad NOT ALONE. But THAT round, where spec unga dunga'd from his squad in caves and died alone.

[Avalanchee]

I believe, it's not about THAT round where spec left his squad to actually help marines and was with other squad NOT ALONE. But THAT round, where spec unga dunga'd from his squad in caves and died alone.

We're not talking about the same round.

[RuAlastor]

We're not talking about the same round.

yes, I mean it's not about specs who are actually useful, but have baldie SL

[Gnorse]

honestly, making the guy with the biggest gun second in command is pretty damn stupid. Either lower the spec's rank to below the SG's or just add a dedicated 2IC role like a radioman or a fireteam leader.

[Awesomesauce935]

I agree, Smart gunner should be aSL

[coroneljones]

honestly, making the guy with the biggest gun second in command is pretty damn stupid. Either lower the spec's rank to below the SG's or just add a dedicated 2IC role like a radioman or a fireteam leader.

Well if you dont want the spec to lead you could try keeping the SL alive.