[ALPHA] (Major suggestion) Alien Full Medical system!

[Felkvir]

+1 for anything similar in the future

[Butterrobber202]

-1 From a player point of view... 1 if the warrior survives the injury. That player is cluster duck because he has 1 arm. If hosts escape and a xeno tries to stop then he many kill them w/ acid

[MrGabol100]

I'm just not really fond of this. Players would just find a way to quick end each other's lives. That was just religion joke.

UM this suggestion is about ending the Alien HP bars, because that'd mean that the acidic blood would be totally OP, and what I want is to add realism and do a balance between the now high damage dealer aliens and marines, Instead of nerfing alien damage and returning to the pre alpha system, we could actually add things instead of reverting them to fix the balance.

[MrGabol100]

Bumping the thread to get more input from the staff and if the dev team is willing to work in this in the future, the aliens on the alpha seem even more powerful because of the disadvantage of marines having actual medical needs.

[MikeHdez97]

+1 cuz is gonna be more balanced in the both sides(marines and xenos)

[speedybst]

Actually I really like this idea, since it seems balanced to my eyes. Actually have a high-risk, high-reward system in the game could make the marines think carefully about their actions, as well as having some more variance about them. As to abby's point, would it not be possible to recycle portions of the code for the xenos?
Anyway, i'd adore seeing this added in the future, +1 from me.

[MrGabol100]

-1 From a player point of view... 1 if the warrior survives the injury. That player is cluster duck because he has 1 arm. If hosts escape and a xeno tries to stop then he many kill them w/ acid

That's the point.

Implying the aliens survives an injury, he is fucked unless he gets help to get to the queen made healing structure, or he just goes around with one arm, why do you use the other arm at all? Like, you have no other purpose to have 2 arms more than get 2 facehuggers.

And yes, if a host escapes and a xeno tries to stop him, the xeno will die due to the wounds inflicted by the heavy cal 45. or whatever sidearm had the marine, and the marine will probably get major damage due to the CQC encountered in the hives.

My idea is to recycle the human code, with a minor sprite change on the limb area thing, and using basically the same base code as humans (Bones for exo, etc.) with stat changes when the "Bone" on that area is damaged.

I Hope we can get this to work.

[Juninho77]

I like the idea, but what worries me the most is the game balance issues that would arrise.

For example, a weapon with high stopping power aimed at an alien's leg would cripple it, and a crippled alien is a dead alien.

[Anon McAnon]

I like the idea, but what worries me the most is the game balance issues that would arrise.

For example, a weapon with high stopping power aimed at an alien's leg would cripple it, and a crippled alien is a dead alien.

Xenos will need to have a lot of ways to recover from what would cripple a human forever for it to be balanced. Xenos are almost always outnumbered, so having a single lucky hit take out a significant amount of their firepower forever is terrible. Take them out for awhile sure, but don't take out the queen/ravager/praetorian/hivelord for the entire game just because a lucky sniper took off a limb. Humans are expendable, aliens aren't,

Jesus, how did the roles get reversed this hard?

[MrGabol100]

Xenos will need to have a lot of ways to recover from what would cripple a human forever for it to be balanced. Xenos are almost always outnumbered, so having a single lucky hit take out a significant amount of their firepower forever is terrible. Take them out for awhile sure, but don't take out the queen/ravager/praetorian/hivelord for the entire game just because a lucky sniper took off a limb. Humans are expendable, aliens aren't,

Jesus, how did the roles get reversed this hard?

Thing is, the medical suggestion comes together with an increase of alien numbers at round start, maybe adding another 5 players as larvas to the start rooster.

Then, the aliens would have to actually think of strategies instead of frontal rush, maybe keep a ravager spongebobbing all the marine hits with his absurd high exoskeleton thickness, making only the revolver and shotgun viable for breaking it, and the sniper and Smartgun for penetration.

This is an alien nerf, neither a rebalance, this is a revamp to get more realism, we should get along with this a major reduction of marine numbers compared to aliens, to the point of aliens outnumbering marines not at late game, but at mid game.

If the 10+- aliens at the beggining actually get to do tactics on the marines, hide from them, and that, they can make a strong hive in aprox 30 minutes.
And if an alien gets crippled from a leg, he's not out, he's slower, the point of this suggestion is to make aliens expendable, and highly outnumbering, but keeping a balance, with the point of realism and fitting the movies.

[Felkvir]

I've talked with Gabol a bit and i do find myself agreeing more to this, if it can ever be implemented... Of course balance issues may arise, they always do. What i'd love to see is that mostly the higher tier aliens absorb more damage at least, and more rare/dangerous in general than the lower tiers so that when they are obtained they can cause some real trouble if the marines are not completely organized or prepared.

[Aeleto]

My only beef with this is the balance between realism and fun. I've felt that many players go on the server to shoot things, and get slashed without getting too much punishment at since this is one of the very few servers that are action focused and active. Wouldn't this cause a drop on the number of players? Just my two cents.
Just imagine how your round would be ruined because your teammates ran off in the dark and got ambushed, leaving you to be next.

[MrGabol100]

I don't know if Apop is ok with losing the goonstation playerbase, But i'd beg to wipe off from the server all those players you are talking about, who just get on the server to slash/shoot at things.

[Artouris]

Time to throw in my criticism.

First part comes in that for the most part xenos are suppose to be scary, and we don't have any spooky mechanics to make you afraid of them. This would continue to further that they are not scary when you blow off a leg or arm. I think the fear that you instill just by seeming to be damn near invulnerable is enough. But this is to maintain the illusion (or not illusion) of fear that a xeno should have. Most people see the SS13 sprite and go "awwh its a cutie alium thing". Its not as cute when it slices your friends head off and took more bullets than you thought.

Second part, if you do blow off the limbs, you either need to replace them somehow or retain the combat effectiveness of the xeno. Which would be just slightly nerfing the speed for missing legs, and making their crawl with their arms be fast. Not to mention that arms are fairly important and a xeno without arms is a xeno not worth playing. Even worse if its a xeno with no arms or legs... That would just be time to ghost because its dumb, you can't do shit.

Third part, is not from the aliens side, its from the marine side. Now there's a incentive to say aim for the head... or the arms, legs, feet, and hands. Which most of those areas are not protected by marine armor. So by virtue of massive population numbers of alpha, you WILL have friendly fire, and you WILL lose your arms or legs or anything else that can be blown off by friendly fire. Guess what that does? Makes YOU vastly less combat effective and easy bait for a xeno. Once you lose a hand you lose most of the heavy firepower weaponry, and thus lose any fighting chance against a xeno that's above tier one really.
Stemming from that would probably be a influx of A-helps because people would blame others for griefing them because of friendly fire. People instead of walking it off because they tanked the damage because it hit the chest plate they'd turn right around and proceed to kill or stab the other guy, which just leads to more stupidity. Don't say it wouldn't happen because there are quite a few people in this community and moreso in visitors who would just lash out against the simplest of offenses.

So overall I don't see this as much of a benefit as something that would require EXTENSIVE balancing or would just lead to events that screw one side heavily depending on the small events (friendly fire, or organization/effective leadership) that transpire during the round. Also kind of screws Xenos rather quickly. Not to mention there would be the very real chance that people would leave because they would be annoyed that no one aims for the chest and always aims for say the hands, thus screwing them from friendly fire when they get hit.

[MrGabol100]

Time to throw in my criticism.

First part comes in that for the most part xenos are suppose to be scary, and we don't have any spooky mechanics to make you afraid of them. This would continue to further that they are not scary when you blow off a leg or arm. I think the fear that you instill just by seeming to be damn near invulnerable is enough. But this is to maintain the illusion (or not illusion) of fear that a xeno should have. Most people see the SS13 sprite and go "awwh its a cutie alium thing". Its not as cute when it slices your friends head off and took more bullets than you thought.

Second part, if you do blow off the limbs, you either need to replace them somehow or retain the combat effectiveness of the xeno. Which would be just slightly nerfing the speed for missing legs, and making their crawl with their arms be fast. Not to mention that arms are fairly important and a xeno without arms is a xeno not worth playing. Even worse if its a xeno with no arms or legs... That would just be time to ghost because its dumb, you can't do shit.

Third part, is not from the aliens side, its from the marine side. Now there's a incentive to say aim for the head... or the arms, legs, feet, and hands. Which most of those areas are not protected by marine armor. So by virtue of massive population numbers of alpha, you WILL have friendly fire, and you WILL lose your arms or legs or anything else that can be blown off by friendly fire. Guess what that does? Makes YOU vastly less combat effective and easy bait for a xeno. Once you lose a hand you lose most of the heavy firepower weaponry, and thus lose any fighting chance against a xeno that's above tier one really.
Stemming from that would probably be a influx of A-helps because people would blame others for griefing them because of friendly fire. People instead of walking it off because they tanked the damage because it hit the chest plate they'd turn right around and proceed to kill or stab the other guy, which just leads to more stupidity. Don't say it wouldn't happen because there are quite a few people in this community and moreso in visitors who would just lash out against the simplest of offenses.

So overall I don't see this as much of a benefit as something that would require EXTENSIVE balancing or would just lead to events that screw one side heavily depending on the small events (friendly fire, or organization/effective leadership) that transpire during the round. Also kind of screws Xenos rather quickly. Not to mention there would be the very real chance that people would leave because they would be annoyed that no one aims for the chest and always aims for say the hands, thus screwing them from friendly fire when they get hit.

Nope, Xenos are supossed to be scary on the first movie, because no one had real guns, on the second movie, the point of the marines, was to make xenos stop being scary, but a overwhelming enemy, that's why alien3 didn't have weapons in it, if you read a bit about it, you can know further on this.

Xenos are supossed to stop being scary when the guns come in.

The marine combat system would stay the same, it's major addition for xenos, if we really want to continue with the server, we cannot stay stuck with the HP bars xenos, xenos may regrow their limbs on the alien queen healing structures.

This doesn't require balancing at all, this is about buffing marine weapons and add a system for xenos, balancing would be a minor part of it, and this is intended to be an overhaul.

Xenos, of course, would get damage nerfs too, but they arleady can slash limbs pretty easily in the alpha, and removing that ability, nerfing xenos, would be being regressive instead of trying to improve the realism and combat.

[Artouris]

Balancing isn't that easy...

Like heres my first question, if they can regrow their limbs that's good. But how do you get there with no legs, or the horrid combination of no legs or arms? Movement speed for humans is VASTLY impaired by a missing leg and it'd probably be similar for the xenos. Which at that point your dead regardless.

Also Xenomorphs are still scary WITH guns. We're not talking about the movie being a HORROR movie. That might scare you as a audience member. The Marines in the movie for the most part tend to be afraid of the xenomorph. Hell Hudson is broken basically mentally from them until his redemption when they come out of the ceilings. The point is, they turn bad ass soldiers into something less. Sure there will be soldiers that wont break. But for the most part a enemy that you cannot see half the time comes out and kills you one by one is not something that would make you feel safe as a duck in a nuclear bunker.

Also you seemed to skip over the whole part of the friendly fire part i wrote up. Which literally means all the marines will end up hating each other, attempting to kill each other, blown off limbs, etc. Which is NOT beneficial to people playing the marines. Not to mention will cause people to ragequit after multiple rounds in a row they got their arm blown off by people trying to shoot a xeno. And this is critical. Because unless you really want a overstressed medbay, your going to still end up with dead marines from the bleeding out. Also useless marines since most of the effective guns require TWO hands. The only guns that would be effective is SMGs and those for the most part don't do much.

Now if you want to make a system where we have different rounds have different effectiveness against xenos, I'd be fine with that. But this full medical system brings a host of problems. Half of them actually on the marine side itself because the whole server is not made up of byond sharp shooters. Not to mention there's still misfires along the veteran population because of accidental clicking.

[MrGabol100]

What does scary do with that the can die at all? Right now xenos are giantic impenetrables HP bars, very badly balanced, and i'll say it again, in the alpha you can friendly fire, and blow off marine limbs, still, do you see marines blowing up everyones' limbs in the alpha? We are talking about aliens.

Aliens will still be scary, but for once, they'll have to work on their tactics, ambush and not rush frontal like idiots, or they can die, right now a warriro can rush frontal, tank the bullets, take one marine out, and get away with it, and I'm talking about going FRONTAL agaisn't a group of marines...

My suggestion is about nerfing the aliens, but not their HP, but actually adding something to the game, for the sake of realism.

The aliens will still kill you in two slashes to the head or so, and if that doesn't scares you, then what do you want? Everyone has ravager health world day?

[Aeleto]

Aliens will still be scary, but for once, they'll have to work on their tactics, ambush and not rush frontal like idiots, or they can die, right now a warriro can rush frontal, tank the bullets, take one marine out, and get away with it, and I'm talking about going FRONTAL agaisn't a group of marines...

Except this is wrong, warriors cannot tank more than 10 bullets before going into crit on the Alpha. Hell, they can't barely engage two marines head-on without dying. Every other tier 2/tier 1 is already squishy. Every single time I played a xeno on the alpha testing, xenos had to rely on each other much more instead of just lolrushing a FOB, and when defending the hive.

Artouris showed some good points, as right now marines kill each other over absolutely nothing. Aiming for other limbs would just lead to pain and infighting.

[MrGabol100]

Except this is wrong, warriors cannot tank more than 10 bullets before going into crit on the Alpha. Hell, they can't barely engage two marines head-on without dying. Every other tier 2/tier 1 is already squishy. Every single time I played a xeno on the alpha testing, xenos had to rely on each other much more instead of just lolrushing a FOB, and when defending the hive.

Artouris showed some good points, as right now marines kill each other over absolutely nothing. Aiming for other limbs would just lead to pain and infighting.

Then it's just happening what i was saying, we are back to small HP bars instead of having actually something that makes sense.


BRB going to hang myself

[Sebro]

MUST...HAVE...THIS

[Dyne]

+1. I want this as an alium player. Wont change much for marines- still friendly fire issues and center mass.

[Lostmixup]

I'm just not really fond of this. Players would just find a way to quick end each other's lives. That was just religion joke.

Wat.

I like the idea of a full medical system, but as mentioned it would require a maaaassive overhaul of the aliens. At the current time I think it'd be best to refine what's already there, and add in what's already been planned.

[GingerCultLeader]

I don't think aliens would have the advantage of surgeon aliens for when one loses an arm or leg.

[Keyword]

+1 it sounds really amazing, but at the same time really time-consuming and perhaps complicated to do.
but if it gets worked on and done this may change the server forever for good. Instead of having every other server's alien health system, CM would get their own custom, and arguably better one.

[Derpislav]

I'd just like to say that aliens need to be far more resistant to damage than described there - with "1/3 chance to chop off limb off a warrior" we'd have quadra amputees all around, except they would die in 2 seconds from the bleeding rate you suggest. And acidic bloods need to do FAR more damage - it should really PUNISH marines for letting xenos get close.

(also you kinda got the guns wrong, but it's a game, not gun nut simulator)