Buffing the Sniper-rifle

[Surrealistik]

So adjust the damage output accordingly.

[Infernus]

I also support the buff for the sniper. I shot one sentinel 3 times with it, and it was still standing, probably due to it healing most of the damage between the reload.

[Steelpoint]

Maybe increase its fire rate?

Aside from bullet speed increase and a damage buff I would also look at removing the inverted accuracy the Sniper seemingly has.

The inverted accuracy is artifical difficulty, the gun is already unwieldy enough to use in close range combat.

[Tetsip]

HEAVILY EDITED

I also support the buff for the sniper. I shot one sentinel 3 times with it, and it was still standing, probably due to it healing most of the damage between the reload.

There's a little bit of news on the sniper now regarding the new caste.

As should be common knowledge, the sniper has 100% armor penetration value, meaning no xeno is blocking a shot from this, and about 80 damage per hit. With the new Crusher caste announced any lore-studied person will know these things are moving tanks with nearly impenetrable crests. Most weapons have a very small chance of wounding it from the front.

Not the sniper.

The sniper will be the weapon, excluding armor-piercing rockets probably, that will be extremely effective in stopping, stalling, or forcing a Crusher to retreat. Because of the armor penetration values the sniper will deal its damage to the Crusher head-on, making it effective and invaluable against them. However, I feel that at its current damage/charging speed ratio it is completely useless, and won't much intimidate any T3.

That being said, there's still a problem. Sniper damage is too low as is known. T1 alien castes are fast but weak, your chances of actually hitting them long-range is very slim. In fact, you're really only going to have a viable opportunity to 'snipe' T3s that have 300+ HP, at which point your bullets are completely wasted, INCLUDING the soon-to-arrive Charger.

I DO NOT think that the sniper should have a faster bullet, or more accuracy. I think what it needs is an absurd amount of damage, enough to crit or kill a T1 which I say again is EXTREMELY hard to hit if it isn't holding still. Again, it's very difficult to actually hit an alien with the sniper rifle from a distance, so make it extremely punishing when it does. The artificial accuracy from close-range no-scoping (If it exists. If it doesn't it should for this) would act as a balance preventing marines from using this overpowered rifle as a close-range weapon.

By making the bullet damage extremely high, aliens have to adapt when one is on the field. If they get hit by the sniper you don't have to worry about them healing if the bullet slaughters them. It also provides some stopping power (By that I mean enough damage to actually put a significant dent in a T3) that will make even a T3 alien re-evaluate their approach and actually plan as opposed to the usual Zerg gore-fest that sometimes happens with T3s.

This rifle is supposed to fire rounds that could tear apart a man. You get a very limited supply of ammo, it's incredibly difficult to hit things with it, and its charging speed is absurdly high. Even with 100% armor penetration, it doesn't actually do enough damage to be useful on the field. By doing damage I mean the total damage dealt successfully to aliens. Using all of your ammo the average player may actually hit an alien with the sniper rifle 10-12 times. 2/3 of those shots will be unscoped shots, and most if not all of them will be wasted because of weed regeneration.

[Steelpoint]

The Crusher is a interesting case scenario, but as you just said Tetsip if the SADAR Rocker Launcher is just as effective against the Crusher as the Sniper is, then why pick the Sniper over the Rocket Launcher? Considering the Rocket Launcher has all the perks of being able to easily go up against all T3 Aliens and the Queen single handedly, not to mention being able to down a large group of aliens, yet the Sniper might be effective against one particular xeno type.

Increasing its damage is good but not increasing its bullet speed would make this weapon even more idiotic to use at range where allies are involved, one wrong shot and you've probley just killed a Marine from off screen who's only crime was moving around.

Meaning the Sniper remains a highly situational weapon that is only ever useful in defensive situations, and where smart aliens will know not to run down that defensive location to avoid the sniper.

Yet when you compare the highly situational Sniper to other versatile weapons (SADAR again) then the choice is clear that why bother with a unwieldly Sniper when I can get something else that's more reliable.

[SecretStamos (Joshuu)]

Increasing its damage is good but not increasing its bullet speed would make this weapon even more idiotic to use at range where allies are involved, one wrong shot and you've probley just killed a Marine from off screen who's only crime was moving around.

Bullet speed cannot be changed. Abby has mentioned it a how impossible it is, yet nobody seems to listen to her :/

[Tetsip]

The Crusher is a interesting case scenario, but as you just said Tetsip if the SADAR Rocker Launcher is just as effective against the Crusher as the Sniper is, then why pick the Sniper over the Rocket Launcher? Considering the Rocket Launcher has all the perks of being able to easily go up against all T3 Aliens and the Queen single handedly, not to mention being able to down a large group of aliens, yet the Sniper might be effective against one particular xeno type.

Increasing its damage is good but not increasing its bullet speed would make this weapon even more idiotic to use at range where allies are involved, one wrong shot and you've probley just killed a Marine from off screen who's only crime was moving around.

Meaning the Sniper remains a highly situational weapon that is only ever useful in defensive situations, and where smart aliens will know not to run down that defensive location to avoid the sniper.

Yet when you compare the highly situational Sniper to other versatile weapons (SADAR again) then the choice is clear that why bother with a unwieldly Sniper when I can get something else that's more reliable.

Thank you for pointing that out. I add to my argument this and emphasize that the rocket launcher is just as if not amazingly more effective at dealing with aliens. It uses no scope, does AoE damage, and knocks down the enemy aliens (I think), making it an extremely punishing weapon. Sure, you got a much more limited ammo supply, but you can do so much more with it than you ever could with all of your sniper rounds at the moment.

I actually disagree for the bullet speed buff because it'd make it easier to hit aliens, which would be an absurd concept if we're going to give a heavy buff to damage. Additionally, as said increasing the speed is nearly impossible. Going off another thing you said, marines should have to learn to clear the fucking way. If a marine gets wasted by a sniper shot for leaping in front of an announced shot it's on them. Again, just like aliens would have to adapt to it marines should have to adapt to the use of these weapons as well, just as they do when a flamer is out, or a rocket launcher is in play.

[Steelpoint]

The only draw back to the Rocket Launcher is how limited your ammo is, but that's not even a problem if you have a half competent RO/SL. Not to mention I usually just order a explosives crate before the mission starts and I leave it in the FoB to resupply later on.

The SADAR is the reason why I'm turned off by many other Spec choices, I'm simply not going to be as powerful as I can be if I don't take the Rocket Launcher.

Considering there will only ever be four Spec's in the game, of which there may be anywhere from twenty to nearly one hundred Marines, I think its acceptable to look at ensuring all Spec weapons are very powerful in their own rights. Hence why I do support a massive damage boost because if the SADAR can one shot practically every Alien in the game (Getting hit by a AP Rocket as a T3 is essentially a death sentance) then I think we can look at making other Spec weapons deal competitive damage.

[Tetsip]

To sum up what he's saying: In comparison to the SADAR Rocker Launcher, the sniper is pretty chumpy. The way he and I see it every piece of specialist gear has its massive pros and cons that make it amazing on the field in unique ways and ineffective in others.

Smartgun has decent damage, red night-vision, and doesn't hit marines and a high refire rate and some armor penetration. Stick to the back of the pack and mow your enemies down through the marines like the stone cold badass you are while wearing that specialist headband and smoking, pretending you're some next-gen Rambo. Cons however, you're one of the first marines to be targeted down by the aliens, so know what you're doing if you choose this path because they will hugger-love you every chance they get. Additionally, it expends ammunition quickly and you must hold still for some time to reload from the powerpack and the powerpack occupies your back slot, disabling you from carrying the same amount of supplies as a standard marine.

SADAR has an AoE, adaptable rounds, and knockdown. Fire and forget as your alien foes are turned into minced meat product while the surviving xeno scum are cleansed by the tide of marines whose morale is bolstered by this explosive show of force. Whether you need high explosive for crowd control or an armor-piercing round for shattering a Praetorian's crest, the SADAR is the choice for any demolitionist. Fire and forget, minimal aiming is required when you have a SADAR. Cons include a high risk for friendly fire during use, manual reload after every shot, and extreme ineffectiveness at close ranges unless you're willing to off yourself.

B18 makes you a walking tank with a 95% damage reduction from melee and ranged. Laugh in the face of ravagers and spit into the eye of Predators as their claws and blades do little more than tickle you through the thick plating. Add the riot shield and a flamethrower and aliens will beware your approach. Cons include sacrificing the opportunity to get a potent specialist weapon. Additionally, aliens that recognize you're in the B18 suit will target you for facehugger loving. Once you lose that helmet, your head is completely exposed to being cut right off, too.

Sniper has armor penetration and a pretty damn high amount damage The long refire rate however makes the high damage rather pointless, turning into a RELATIVELY low damage when you factor damage per second into the equation as well as how accurate you need to be in order to even land the shot if they haven't already fucked off entirely. God forbid the alien is standing on weeds, because by the time you can shoot again they've shrugged off some of the damage. Has too many flaws going for it to be a viable choice. Even with 100% armor penetration I doubt this will scare a Crusher because it will likely have a lot of HP and doing about 80 damage every 5 seconds won't cut it. I would rather just use SADAR AP rounds. At the very least the explosion might intimidate it if the round's damage alone does not make it reconsider its advance.

[Surrealistik]

Again, I think the Sniper rifle should ignore friendly fire, basically never miss, effectively ignore armor/deflection chance, and have a (near) instantaneous projectile.

If the projectile speed cannot be increased, give it increased damage instead, otherwise there will never be a reason to use this weapon as it would be (and currently is) a bona fide piece of shit. Ignoring friendly fire is especially important, especially if you mean to use it in any sort of offensive capacity given the swirling maelstrom of marines engaging in run and gun.

[Snoopy11]

If you need a laser sniper idea, you could take from the 40k universe. From Gaunt's Ghosts, Hlaine Larkin. The snipers tend to use 'hotshot' rounds, with Longlas'. What it could turn into: Instant shots, but the barrels on the snipers will wear out. And, it has an ammo count still. So instant, good damage dealing shots. But at the need of having to repair/replace parts of the gun. Just a thought!

[Evilkyle24]

Hotshot las gun packs also give you only one shot before you have to reload.

[MrGabol100]

Hotshot las gun packs also give you only one shot before you have to reload.

25-40 shots for cadian lasguns, it's not 1 shot, it's just less shots.

[Snoopy11]

Aye, I'd say give around about the same amount of shots, and maybe ten or so shots for each barrel. It's neat, that the sniper becomes viable, but is also a pain because you have to strip it after a certain amount of shots.

[Evilkyle24]

25-40 shots for cadian lasguns, it's not 1 shot, it's just less shots.

Thats a Hellgun. Not a Hot Shot pack.
I stand corrected.
Turns out, there's hotshot lasguns and hotshot power packs.

A hotshot power pack can be used with any lasgun but is damaging and you get exactly one shot before reloading, as it consumes all the energy to fire an extremely powerful bolt.

A hotshot lasgun replaced the outdated Hellgun, but its much more expensive and requires some seriously rare components. On top of that, it likes to break in the middle of stressful situations, and requires frequent part replacements. Fortunately the troopers who carry them are trained well enough to rebuild the gun from scratch and are issued a lot of spare parts.

[MrGabol100]

Thats a Hellgun. Not a Hot Shot pack.
I stand corrected.
Turns out, there's hotshot lasguns and hotshot power packs.

A hotshot power pack can be used with any lasgun but is damaging and you get exactly one shot before reloading, as it consumes all the energy to fire an extremely powerful bolt.

A hotshot lasgun replaced the outdated Hellgun, but its much more expensive and requires some seriously rare components. On top of that, it likes to break in the middle of stressful situations, and requires frequent part replacements. Fortunately the troopers who carry them are trained well enough to rebuild the gun from scratch and are issued a lot of spare parts.

Or you can just overcook a roast of power packs on a field fire for a cadian troop and tell the commissar to start yelling to add more ork spores to the fire until the fucking packs are so overheated they just explode in the lasguns, well the fuckin' Primer said I could charge my powerpack on the fire... )=

[Evilkyle24]

You can charge them on a fire but it can cause damage.

They can also be overcharged to act as a grenade.

[Dyne]

So let them burn.
Feel free to just borrow a sniper lasgun from BayCode, and play with the damadge a bit, its pretty well made.

[K0NFL1QT]

Up the damage. Make it something T1's fear and T3's avoid. If you can manage to snipe a Runner you should blow it clean into pieces, because you're not gonna get a second shot. From full to crit at the very least.

[Jeser]

Up the damage. Make it something T1's fear and T3's avoid. If you can manage to snipe a Runner you should blow it clean into pieces, because you're not gonna get a second shot. From full to crit at the very least.

Actually, scope rifle is one of few weapon that should deal great damage exactly to T3 and especcially crusher cause of it armor penetration.

[K0NFL1QT]

Exactly. I'm just saying that the T3's have enough health to back off if they take a Sniper round. Lesser castes should be knocked into crit or gibbed with extreme prejudice.

[K0NFL1QT]

http://avp.wikia.com/wiki/WY-102_Railgun

Lore compatible Sniper upgrade.

"It fires a super heated slug at extreme velocities that can pierce most forms of body armour and even penetrate thick armour plating of vehicles and structures."
"The slug it fires is capable of ripping through multiple enemies in a single shot and is extremely capable of penetrating the exoskeletal armour of Praetorians. It is also capable of penetrating doors and heavy duty glass windows with ease."

Six round capacity and requires manual loading of and 'pumping' like shotguns. Beam based firing animation, like Pulse Rifles. Deals extremely high damage. Penetrates through walls, marines and Xenos alike. The 'scope' function should have some sort of Nightvision or Thermal Vision. Highly inaccurate at close range, highly accurate at long range.

[Surrealistik]

Again, whatever the change, it needs to ignore friendly fire to be a viable squad weapon because chances are you're going to be in the back while a bunch of run and gun marines are in the front complicating shots that have an excruciatingly slow reload speed.

[Dyne]

Wait, what? Remove friendly fire to adjust for idiot marines?
No, adjust tactics accordingly. Shout about LOF, shoot a couple in the chest so they understand. Find better positions, hideouts, vantage points.

[Surrealistik]

Nothing idiotic about run and gun; it's how you don't die as a marine, especially with acid spit being a thing; they shouldn't stop trying to survive because you want to take a shot once every couple of seconds.

Besides, it's a sniper rifle that's carefully aimed; it has all the reason in the world not to friendly fire like the smartgun.

So long as the sniper rifle doesn't ignore friendly fire, its status as a viable weapon will remain questionable at best.