A question about marriage...

[Gamarr]

This is as stupid as the lizard hate on tg-station, which reaches ridiculous, station-crashing levels of idiocy. I'm going to point out though I voted No on the poll, because marriages would not be allowed for good reason, pretty much exactly what was described in the medbay incident above is why you separate any sign of a 'couple' in a military institution since few ever really want to go through the whole rigmarole for dealing with it, and the emotional fallout from the two involved people.

Saying that, however, the whole situation looked great, far as rp opportunities go, and sadly both sides (doctor and the couple) are to blame:
-Wife player shouldn't have tried forcing into surgery, and flipping out. Maybe you should've been in there, but surgery is one of those things where everybody needs to get out and let a doctor do their thing. Doesn't matter who it is barring incredible (you know a larva might pop out and need to be there to kill it dead) circumstances.
-Doctor is a shitler for ghosting with that reason. Grow a fucking skin, it's laughable he let a 'bullying couple' ruin his round. Honestly if he feels that way then the server loses fuckall when that kind of player effs off, because he can't fucking adapt and throws a shitty little tantrum over a couple. Atop of his response, to chloral them both being wayyyyyy unneeded. If the wife was breaking the windows then she's obviously not shooting/hitting the doctor, and the husband was there for surgery. There was no need as a doctor to chloral them both instead of just leaving the medbay or waiting in surgery for an MP. He fucked up the most in the situation, and it is skewing the whole argument against the marriage stance in the wrong way when said doctor is the one who handled it the WORST possible way, icly and oocly.
-The Husbando sayin he didn't want it anymore and to let him the fuck out, he should've just let him the fuck out and moved onto another marine who needed help.

Now saying thus, marriage is not good because of this kind of things. You do not want marines/crew not doing their jobs in the interest of their spouses. Just don't allow marriages. I am all for relationships though, there is nothing to say that a pair couldn't be together without getting married. Because really if they did, the USMC would wash one of them out or transfer them to the opposite end of the ship to get the couple separated during work hours, until they can transfer one or both away to a planet or something.

As for burning out, you need more admins. The coverage is bad sometimes and coding+adminning will really ruin ya.

[Lostmixup]

I would like to ask that when people reply to reply in one post (when you're the newest reply I mean). Makes it easier to go through.

[Wickedtemp]

And to support Veradox and Gelovina's point... I'm going to say this short.

Colonial Marines is all about Aliens v. Marines, not soap opera. Not Romeo and Juliet v. Families. We come to play Aliens vs. Marines. I am fine with you bein' buddies as long as you don't take it far like busting friend out of prison even though friend was in wrong. Like I said, Marines met each other for first time. Not, "Hey, I just met you. Let's get married and bear babies, we'll name him Kakarot." This is unreasonable otherwise sexist. And... We have military rules unalloyed soldiers to marry each other.

Again, Aliens V. Marines. You can be war buddies. Not marriage buddies.

Cool. I also don't come here to get random pizza deliveries, so we should scrap that too! Glad we're on the same page!

The problem also is that it distracts players from the game. The main RP of colonial marines is RP derived from the combat situations marines are thrown into, not of marines being married, or of marines doing anything else. You come to this server to have fun shooting things, and maybe RP a little bit, not to marry someone and have a loving relationship in the sulaco bridge. Simply put, it doesn't fit with the server at all.

We aren't actual marines, we don't have the training to take orders without considering our own personal interest, or to properly know the horrors of war. That doesn't mean that we should make the server a fantasy land where cringe worthy relationships can take place while everyone is getting slaughtered by a near perfect alien race.

Also gel, I didn't read all of his post because it's pretty clear which side he's on from the first couple sentences.

No, it doesn't distract people from the game. People have just found something to do OTHER than shoot aliens. You're exaggerating. Also, the whole "Oh, yeah, I didn't read that post because I found out I wouldn't agree with it." Great stance to have, especially coming from Staff!

Honestly, the RP I have with the people on the Sulaco and sometimes on the surface is the reason I come to this server. It isn't the guns or the xenomorphs or the custom maps (although those are all awesome in their own right) but rather the players. There are quite a few people on this server my characters have friendships wth and I also have some rivals which my character despises but I enjoy still. SS13 isn't a game about pure action and so to allow a relationship to develop enhances the game for people. If we disallow marriages, we'd probably have to disallow any continuity of relationships whether they be at the friendship level or greater.

I'm not saying we need to be an ERP fest or even "The Sims" as someone described it, but it certainly makes the action-packed moments more intense when someone your character has a bond with is involved. I can tell you that my characters tend to go to great lengths to save others even at my own expense because of these relationships and it leads to some very fun and interesting situations.

This might not be realistic in current military standards, but lets not forget this takes place in the future and many of the customs of the USCM are not at all like the modern military. Times change and society evolves. Our military evolves alongside it, so why do the regulations not evolve?

Tl;dr: If it enhances RP, why not? RP is the best part of this server imo.

If you play purely for the RP, you'd... probably be best going to another server... This server, while it claims to be Med-RP doesn't always vote for RP, as seen in this thread. Baystation12 is ALL about RP. There's less guns and aliens, but so much more RP.

And to support Veradox and Gelovina's point... I'm going to say this short.

Colonial Marines is all about Aliens v. Marines, not soap opera. Not Romeo and Juliet v. Families. We come to play Aliens vs. Marines. I am fine with you bein' buddies as long as you don't take it far like busting friend out of prison even though friend was in wrong. Like I said, Marines met each other for first time. Not, "Hey, I just met you. Let's get married and bear babies, we'll name him Kakarot." This is unreasonable otherwise sexist. And... We have military rules unalloyed soldiers to marry each other.

Again, Aliens V. Marines. You can be war buddies. Not marriage buddies.

"You don't play the game the same way I do. That's wrong. You shouldn't do that. Different is bad!"

Also, the whole "You've never met each other before waking up in cryo." thing really fuckin' sucks, hardly anybody ACTUALLY RP's like that. I know I don't, and I know others that don't as well. It pretty much ruins a large factor of RP, which is continuity and character development. By having the marines repeat the same day over and over, you're shooting that in the head. And that's just... kidna fuckin' dumb. Nobody really cares about that point.

[Gelonvia]

I say at all that I didn't read it because he had an opinion, I didn't read it because it was too damn long. I appreciate him telling me that it was too damn long as well. I simply understood his stance after the first few sentences.

It has been going on for a while, and every single time I see a married couple they're doing something stupid, or doing their own thing ignoring orders and other people around them.

If your saying its going on for a while, and every single married couple you see is doing something stupid then your clearly not seeing any married couples. Casca is constantly building FOB's or covering her team-mates and takes her job very seriously more so then the majority of the playerbase and even staff characters, Tanya is constantly doing her job being entirely fair and upholding the code while she patrols the halls only to every so often spin or hug a person to keep herself interested. Mike is on the field fighting his butt off, and Xur is either helping build the FOB or devising plans with Casca to win the battle.

Please don't say you are seeing something that isn't happening or trying to say its going on when it has yet to start, lying frankly makes me sigh in aggravation when I see it.

To go onto the post from Jack however that's good to know that you were not ignoring them, you were just not willing to put the time in to read the topic.

[Wickedtemp]

... Now I'm genuinely wondering what'll happen if people vote to allow the marriages? Will they be included, or will it just be over-ruled?

[Gelonvia]

This is as stupid as the lizard hate on tg-station, which reaches ridiculous, station-crashing levels of idiocy. I'm going to point out though I voted No on the poll, because marriages would not be allowed for good reason, pretty much exactly what was described in the medbay incident above is why you separate any sign of a 'couple' in a military institution since few ever really want to go through the whole rigmarole for dealing with it, and the emotional fallout from the two involved people.

Saying that, however, the whole situation looked great, far as rp opportunities go, and sadly both sides (doctor and the couple) are to blame:
-Wife player shouldn't have tried forcing into surgery, and flipping out. Maybe you should've been in there, but surgery is one of those things where everybody needs to get out and let a doctor do their thing. Doesn't matter who it is barring incredible (you know a larva might pop out and need to be there to kill it dead) circumstances.
-Doctor is a shitler for ghosting with that reason. Grow a fucking skin, it's laughable he let a 'bullying couple' ruin his round. Honestly if he feels that way then the server loses fuckall when that kind of player effs off, because he can't fucking adapt and throws a shitty little tantrum over a couple. Atop of his response, to chloral them both being wayyyyyy unneeded. If the wife was breaking the windows then she's obviously not shooting/hitting the doctor, and the husband was there for surgery. There was no need as a doctor to chloral them both instead of just leaving the medbay or waiting in surgery for an MP. He fucked up the most in the situation, and it is skewing the whole argument against the marriage stance in the wrong way when said doctor is the one who handled it the WORST possible way, icly and oocly.
-The Husbando sayin he didn't want it anymore and to let him the fuck out, he should've just let him the fuck out and moved onto another marine who needed help.

Now saying thus, marriage is not good because of this kind of things. You do not want marines/crew not doing their jobs in the interest of their spouses. Just don't allow marriages. I am all for relationships though, there is nothing to say that a pair couldn't be together without getting married. Because really if they did, the USMC would wash one of them out or transfer them to the opposite end of the ship to get the couple separated during work hours, until they can transfer one or both away to a planet or something.

As for burning out, you need more admins. The coverage is bad sometimes and coding+adminning will really ruin ya.

Gamarr, what happened is the CMO botched the Husbands surgery, shattered his internal organs and bones in his chest, then let him out, the wife came in and had to be the one to notice and point it out and wanted to be there for him, CMO got upset about the wife wanting to watch for safety of their loved one, so the wife and husband just left politely understanding the consequences and mostly due to the husbands fear of being under the knife from the CMO who botched the surgery again. CMO called wife a stupid cunt for cause she wanted to see, she never forced her way in ever, husband got upset at him calling his wife that, he then tried to get the two passively killed through a grudge by telling all doctors they cannot be treated, wife shatters the window, he comes out tries to kill them both, MP's come and stop him then doctors safe the Husband and Wife knowing the CMO was in the wrong.

[Gelonvia]

... Now I'm genuinely wondering what'll happen if people vote to allow the marriages? Will they be included, or will it just be over-ruled?

Wicked its been decided that even if the Majority say they want marriage that action will still be taken regardless, just in slightly lesser degree or on an equal but different manner.

[UnknownMurder]

It's not Democracy, you guys. It's never Democracy and has always been same with Suggestion. Your votes don't count. Those are just for public opinion. That's right, ladies and gentlemen. Your opinion.

[Toroic]

I would like to take a moment to point out if the reason apop doesn't like the idea of marriages is because of military as he claims, then he can't complain about marriages between the non-military staff like CL or how he's thinking about having medbay staff be 'civilians' on board.


Even just the simple RP of calling the shuttle the bird, describing places on the map with xeno-like descriptions, not calling the humans 'marines', and acting towards each other like they should in the hive. Most especially deference to the queen. I don't think this is a huge problem with xenos but it's really painful to see more than half the hive not even doing simple RP as a xeno because they're so focused on winning. - but that isn't really the main topic of this thread anyway, would rather not derail the marriage discussion.

I've never played a xeno round where ooc names were a problem, but I also only play medium or high pop.

As far as deference to the queen, xenos must obey but that doesn't mean they have to like it. Xenos can think for themselves, but they also can't disobey a direct order.

@Wickedtemp

"People finding something else to do besides shoot aliens" is exactly the problem.

This is an action server, and if you're not doing your job or fighting aliens you are a waste of space. RP as long as it doesn't interfere.

[Wickedtemp]

I've never played a xeno round where ooc names were a problem, but I also only play medium or high pop.

As far as deference to the queen, xenos must obey but that doesn't mean they have to like it. Xenos can think for themselves, but they also can't disobey a direct order.

@Wickedtemp

"People finding something else to do besides shoot aliens" is exactly the problem.

This is an action server, and if you're not doing your job or fighting aliens you are a waste of space. RP as long as it doesn't interfere.

Really, aside from one incident, this hasn't interfered. At all. Or, it IS, but Staff isn't sharing that info so it doesn't get included in the discussion.

If the only kind of RP acceptable is the kind of RP that's directly related to fighting either aliens or marines, then this isn't exactly a 'medium' RP server, is it? I mean, I got bored of the whole "GO TO PLANET, SHOOT ALIEN! OORAH!" shit, so I started playing as an MP. And you know what MP normally does when not dealing with idiots? We RP. Just a few days ago, I RPed with another player, the word 'alien' wasn't even so much as uttered. There was a soap fight, a humorous 'interrogation' and then it ended with a few laughs and smiles and we went about the day.

We found something else to do rather than shoot aliens. But apparently, this kind of behavior, since it isn't directly related to fighting aliens, is bad. If people here are going to go after RP that doesn't directly involve the Marine/Xeno conflict, you guys have to stop pretending that this is a 'Medium' RP server.

[Gelonvia]

I've never played a xeno round where ooc names were a problem, but I also only play medium or high pop.

As far as deference to the queen, xenos must obey but that doesn't mean they have to like it. Xenos can think for themselves, but they also can't disobey a direct order.

@Wickedtemp

"People finding something else to do besides shoot aliens" is exactly the problem.

This is an action server, and if you're not doing your job or fighting aliens you are a waste of space. RP as long as it doesn't interfere.

I agree with Toric here, we do come here to fight, its why those of us who do have married characters take it as a second priority. And as a suggestion for anyone else who wishes to take up that RP aspect? I suggest following us by example.

#1: Marine Job comes first, hold some professionalism.
#2: Be prepared to know you probably won't be around your characters spouse any more then when you wake up in the beginning to say hello, and when the round is finishing and maybe some tiny conversations in between, you won't get alot of time though.
#3: (This goes for RPers in general, not just married RP) only RP if your in free time and you have a good 1 minute - 2 minutes to RP. Do not exceed this limit.

^ This is my Code I stand by and it usually helps.

[Veradox]

I've actually left to play Fallout. If you want to me to discuss the underlying theorems of fun I'd be willing to humor you via the BYOND client.

[Lostmixup]

I didn't read it because I wouldn't agree with it, I simply didn't read it because I got the gist of it in the first few lines and because it was longer than I had time for. I simply wanted to post what I had felt quickly because I was in school at the time. I was just passing through and commented on what I thought about the topic, with plans to read more on it later. I have read the topic at this point and still hold my opinion on the whole matter. Maybe it was a little rude to the guy, but honestly I'm not the nicest guy.

I don't think marriage RP has any place on the server. I come here to try to win while at the same time having little tiny bits of human interaction. I don't care all that bad about marriage because it isn't what this server is about, and never will be what the server is about. This server is about fighting aliens and having little bits of RP here and there while fighting aliens. Not about forming loving relationships that are probably not real with other people.

I'm the guy that likes the large battles of CM, when combat gets tight and everyone is fighting for their lives. I like the charges against the hive that make you feel invincible (until you actually get there). I also like to win when I play marine. To me, marriage is another thing that'll get in the way of me winning, and as close minded and simple as it is, I don't like it. I'm that one guy who plays to win when I'm a marine. I like working with my teammates to kill aliens in a badass ways; I like blowing through the hive with explosives and killing off as many aliens as possible. This is simply the kind of player I am.

When I do RP it's because I have to do so to keep the game interesting for the other person as well, and to create a small narrative that doesn't interfere with other marines and I winning. I don't usually carry relationships across games because I don't see a point in doing so. I'll recognize people, and trust them more than others, but that's just the effect of playing the game for a while.

An in game married couple, to me, is pointless and obtrusive. It'll never be as tragic as an actual couple being killed in war (this is obvious), and I never see it actually producing anything interesting to anyone other than the couple doing it (Anyone remember the miller's?) . They tend to also be very cringe worthy a lot of the time. I also feel like in the long run it'll just give people more excuses to do things that normally wouldn't fly like killing someone, going against orders because their partner is in danger, getting in the way of people doing their jobs, etc. Marriages aren't a super often occurrence that happen every single game, and most of the time they simply go unnoticed; however, when they are noticed it's usually not because people are like "Hey, you guys did some really awesome RP!"

TLDR Version: I posted this to explain the way I think, and why I don't like the marriage of in game characters in general. It's more of a defensive post describing what I think about IG marriage from my point of view. You can tell me I'm wrong, but it'd take me changing the way I like to play video games to actually change my opinion on the matter.

[Westhybrid]

Well. Might as well weigh in on this shit.

There's nothing wrong with IC marriages. Gonna agree with Gel, Metafriending is where the root problem lies. That being said, plenty of the people on this server currently doing IC marriages have Metafriended fucking hard. Yes, you're getting called out.

Take for example this past week. We're getting ready in Brief. Got Mike Hernandez, our Spec, and a few others in my squad for Charlie. Tanya, Xur, and a few other players that tend to play together are in Bravo. Mike left Charlie with all of our Spec shit, and a few others took off to Bravo as well. By the time I get to brief, I have one other marine in my squad, and Bravo is overinflated with marines they don't need, because this specific group on the server loves to play with eachother. That's irking, because it fucked Alpha, Charlie, and Delta over.

So already, there's an issue here that manifests from Metafriending. It's not an issue that can be solved with a rule, it's an OOC behavior. So, here's what has to be said about it:

Stop prioritizing your OOC friendships over the fucking game.

You can't begin to comprehend how frustrating it is. You also should understand how EASY IT IS to just let your friends be in a different squad. I have a roommate who plays this game when I do. Multiple staff members I've become friends with and others who introduced me to SS13 whom play here often. We do not focus solely on hanging around eachother constantly, and you know what, the rounds are better for it.

To recap, IC marriages aren't the issue, but the playerbase at large needs to recognize this Metafriend bullshit should stop.

[Gelonvia]

I didn't read it because I wouldn't agree with it, I simply didn't read it because I got the gist of it in the first few lines and because it was longer than I had time for. I simply wanted to post what I had felt quickly because I was in school at the time. I was just passing through and commented on what I thought about the topic, with plans to read more on it later. I have read the topic at this point and still hold my opinion on the whole matter. Maybe it was a little rude to the guy, but honestly I'm not the nicest guy.

I don't think marriage RP has any place on the server. I come here to try to win while at the same time having little tiny bits of human interaction. I don't care all that bad about marriage because it isn't what this server is about, and never will be what the server is about. This server is about fighting aliens and having little bits of RP here and there while fighting aliens. Not about forming loving relationships that are probably not real with other people.

I'm the guy that likes the large battles of CM, when combat gets tight and everyone is fighting for their lives. I like the charges against the hive that make you feel invincible (until you actually get there). I also like to win when I play marine. To me, marriage is another thing that'll get in the way of me winning, and as close minded and simple as it is, I don't like it. I'm that one guy who plays to win when I'm a marine. I like working with my teammates to kill aliens in a badass ways; I like blowing through the hive with explosives and killing off as many aliens as possible. This is simply the kind of player I am.

When I do RP it's because I have to do so to keep the game interesting for the other person as well, and to create a small narrative that doesn't interfere with other marines and I winning. I don't usually carry relationships across games because I don't see a point in doing so. I'll recognize people, and trust them more than others, but that's just the effect of playing the game for a while.

An in game married couple, to me, is pointless and obtrusive. It'll never be as tragic as an actual couple being killed in war (this is obvious), and I never see it actually producing anything interesting to anyone other than the couple doing it (Anyone remember the miller's?) . They tend to also be very cringe worthy a lot of the time. I also feel like in the long run it'll just give people more excuses to do things that normally wouldn't fly like killing someone, going against orders because their partner is in danger, getting in the way of people doing their jobs, etc. Marriages aren't a super often occurrence that happen every single game, and most of the time they simply go unnoticed; however, when they are noticed it's usually not because people are like "Hey, you guys did some really awesome RP!"

TLDR Version: I posted this to explain the way I think, and why I don't like the marriage of in game characters in general. It's more of a defensive post describing what I think about IG marriage from my point of view. You can tell me I'm wrong, but it'd take me changing the way I like to play video games to actually change my opinion on the matter.

However when it comes down to it there are always amazing RP going down, it took me over a RL month period of my own existence on earth constantly having Casca RP with Xur and going from down right hating him on first glance to even tolerating him before Xur saves her in what was every bit of a chance against him and appearing as a hero 3 different times. Ended with quite a circle of RP behind Casca and her friends including Arty, Nat, Tanya, Mike, Leo at one point with Xur there.

Don't assume everyone is like some "Miller" people, just because of one person doing something doesn't mean we all did it, but I think you know that.

It's been over 30 minutes, so it's time for me to answer the question sense apparently no-one has observed relationships that are going on and knows the answer to my Question.

ANSWER: Casca turned to Xur when he was in his cell, looked at him and scolded him saying, "No, sit there and accept your time, do not cause trouble then get out." with a frown on her face and making Xur huff in annoyance but listened to her.

[apophis775]

Again: Guys, don't reference Eden as a source or resources.

We broke away from Eden, because we couldn't set our own policies and rules, and other differences. Your not going to convince me of anything, if you use Eden, considering their eventual fate.

However the issue as stands is the Doctor was not defending himself, he intentionally tried to kill both the couples using CH over his window, and ICly he got handled for it and the doctors came and treated the couple while he was taken away. Saying the doctor was defending himself is stretching it.

And I totally agree, I believe there should be a sense a professionalism to stand-by, however thats requiring RP such as Marriage is, RP when you want less RP, however to go so far as to call some of your better players who not only Roleplay but are fantastic marines is a blunt disregard for their co-operation ingame and actual high standards they meet under staff wishes, to be straight up honest calling them snowflakes looks more like an attack against them more then anything for the sake of the arguement.

He called MPs several times before, and even after the injection. I looked into it personally, and I do not believe he was attempting to kill them, but to keep them unconscious until MPs arrived, as again, they broke the windows and were heavily armed marines against a single doctor. One of the other issues about the situation that bothered me, was that the other 2 were not arrested, until staff got involved, which is unacceptable.

"We saw a few instances where ___ caused a problem, and some people might be annoyed by ____. Therefore we're going to ban ____ despite the fact that some people do actually enjoy ___."

Seriously. You guys saw ONE incident (that has been mentioned in this thread) that was handled ICly, the doctor got salty and ghosted after attempted murder and being arrested for that reason. From what I heard, Casca broke a window or something. Should they have done that? No, probably not, but who gives a damn?

I mean, shit, I see fights over the SMALLEST things on this server because people just WANT a reason to shoot each other in this game. Just handle this shit on a case by case basis, as if dealing with any other rule-breaking player. It's as simple as that.

His salt was JUSTIFIED. A "marriage" created an uncomfortable situation for someone who was just coming onto the server to play and relax. That's why, I don't mind people being "friends" across rounds, but the level of meta-friends promoted by marriage and some of the other things I've seen recently is getting to crazy. I know the defense is that "players will leave if marriage is illegal", but what about the players who join and run into that stuff and leave? greater than 90% of our playerbase, joins to play for a few rounds at a time. They come for the maps, the weapons, the gameplay. Not the RP. In fact, overall, while we are medium, our "reputation" is "Shit RP, but good action" across most of the places I track (such as the bay forums, reddit, and the global host chat. I'm not going to allow the bullying i experienced on HRP servers to start up here, and from my view, the level of meta-friending promoted by "marriages" is the start down that slope, especially since, I already saw that basically happen. I saw, 2 characters basically "RP-team up" against a fresh spawn doctor, to the point that the final result was his round ruined. He had been on the server for 4 MINUTES.

Honestly, the RP I have with the people on the Sulaco and sometimes on the surface is the reason I come to this server. It isn't the guns or the xenomorphs or the custom maps (although those are all awesome in their own right) but rather the players. There are quite a few people on this server my characters have friendships wth and I also have some rivals which my character despises but I enjoy still. SS13 isn't a game about pure action and so to allow a relationship to develop enhances the game for people. If we disallow marriages, we'd probably have to disallow any continuity of relationships whether they be at the friendship level or greater.

I'm not saying we need to be an ERP fest or even "The Sims" as someone described it, but it certainly makes the action-packed moments more intense when someone your character has a bond with is involved. I can tell you that my characters tend to go to great lengths to save others even at my own expense because of these relationships and it leads to some very fun and interesting situations.

This might not be realistic in current military standards, but lets not forget this takes place in the future and many of the customs of the USCM are not at all like the modern military. Times change and society evolves. Our military evolves alongside it, so why do the regulations not evolve?

Tl;dr: If it enhances RP, why not? RP is the best part of this server imo.

I don't think they'll ever remove the spousal regulations, which are, basically:

1. Both can't be deployed at the same time
2. Both can't be assigned to the same ship or unit.

In fact, there's even an additional rule, that if your spouse dies in combat overseas, you are permanently removed from being deployable unless you have a "male or female blood heir at least 18 years of age". Now, that can be a "brother/sister" or a son/daughter.

The problem also is that it distracts players from the game. The main RP of colonial marines is RP derived from the combat situations marines are thrown into, not of marines being married, or of marines doing anything else. You come to this server to have fun shooting things, and maybe RP a little bit, not to marry someone and have a loving relationship in the sulaco bridge. Simply put, it doesn't fit with the server at all.

We aren't actual marines, we don't have the training to take orders without considering our own personal interest, or to properly know the horrors of war. That doesn't mean that we should make the server a fantasy land where cringe worthy relationships can take place while everyone is getting slaughtered by a near perfect alien race.

This. The focus is the mission before everything else. I know many people here weren't in the military, but you share a bond with people in your unit and want to protect them. A perfect example of how romances can negatively affect the server, is that situation with the one guy in isolation, while the MP grilled him acting like a psychiatrist (someone posted the link). While that was going on, how many marines died on the planet surface? How many could have been prevented?

This is as stupid as the lizard hate on tg-station, which reaches ridiculous, station-crashing levels of idiocy. I'm going to point out though I voted No on the poll, because marriages would not be allowed for good reason, pretty much exactly what was described in the medbay incident above is why you separate any sign of a 'couple' in a military institution since few ever really want to go through the whole rigmarole for dealing with it, and the emotional fallout from the two involved people.

Saying that, however, the whole situation looked great, far as rp opportunities go, and sadly both sides (doctor and the couple) are to blame:
-Wife player shouldn't have tried forcing into surgery, and flipping out. Maybe you should've been in there, but surgery is one of those things where everybody needs to get out and let a doctor do their thing. Doesn't matter who it is barring incredible (you know a larva might pop out and need to be there to kill it dead) circumstances.
-Doctor is a shitler for ghosting with that reason. Grow a fucking skin, it's laughable he let a 'bullying couple' ruin his round. Honestly if he feels that way then the server loses fuckall when that kind of player effs off, because he can't fucking adapt and throws a shitty little tantrum over a couple. Atop of his response, to chloral them both being wayyyyyy unneeded. If the wife was breaking the windows then she's obviously not shooting/hitting the doctor, and the husband was there for surgery. There was no need as a doctor to chloral them both instead of just leaving the medbay or waiting in surgery for an MP. He fucked up the most in the situation, and it is skewing the whole argument against the marriage stance in the wrong way when said doctor is the one who handled it the WORST possible way, icly and oocly.
-The Husbando sayin he didn't want it anymore and to let him the fuck out, he should've just let him the fuck out and moved onto another marine who needed help.

Now saying thus, marriage is not good because of this kind of things. You do not want marines/crew not doing their jobs in the interest of their spouses. Just don't allow marriages. I am all for relationships though, there is nothing to say that a pair couldn't be together without getting married. Because really if they did, the USMC would wash one of them out or transfer them to the opposite end of the ship to get the couple separated during work hours, until they can transfer one or both away to a planet or something.

As for burning out, you need more admins. The coverage is bad sometimes and coding+adminning will really ruin ya.

A sort of additional aspect, was that the doctor TRIED to RP with the MPs, but the MPs knew the couple, and thus, he was imprisoned a bit harsher than normal, which is why he was upset. (He was fully stripped and put into prison garb, then left in the cell for a bit without interrogation or even discussion.). I monitored the situation, if I was the doctor, I'd have been upset, since he was the one calling the MPs for help, but they didn't show up, until the couple was down and people called for help for that.

... Now I'm genuinely wondering what'll happen if people vote to allow the marriages? Will they be included, or will it just be over-ruled?

Honestly, I don't know. I do lean against marriages, but I was expecting much more of a lean.

Originally, my plan was that if it was super skewed, to follow the skew, but this is dead even, and close enough that I'll have to rely on both the votes, and points in the discussion.

So, if you want to change my view, focus on how we can regulate or adjust it to prevent things like the scenarios presented in the future. Because personally, if there's a way to not get complaints or issues, I have literally no fucks to give. But when players get rounds ruined over behavior I see that is almost identical to stuff that has personally chased me off of HRP servers, that's when I get up in arms.

Gamarr, what happened is the CMO botched the Husbands surgery, shattered his internal organs and bones in his chest, then let him out, the wife came in and had to be the one to notice and point it out and wanted to be there for him, CMO got upset about the wife wanting to watch for safety of their loved one, so the wife and husband just left politely understanding the consequences and mostly due to the husbands fear of being under the knife from the CMO who botched the surgery again. CMO called wife a stupid cunt for cause she wanted to see, she never forced her way in ever, husband got upset at him calling his wife that, he then tried to get the two passively killed through a grudge by telling all doctors they cannot be treated, wife shatters the window, he comes out tries to kill them both, MP's come and stop him then doctors safe the Husband and Wife knowing the CMO was in the wrong.

I'm fairly certain the one who botched the surgery, was not the same CMO. That CMO, had been on the server, for around 4 minutes, and was sorting out all the issues. I had literally been observing him nearly the entire time (barring ahelps and minor shenanigans), due to ahelps about shitlers in medbay.

"People finding something else to do besides shoot aliens" is exactly the problem.

This is an action server, and if you're not doing your job or fighting aliens you are a waste of space. RP as long as it doesn't interfere.

I try to take this into account of a lot of things. For example recently someone was complaining that some upcoming changes for maintence techs might shift them to being less social as they would actually have a job to do. Apparently, being social over-rides the jobs they should be doing.








Let me try to clarify something:


We are trying to generate RP in a MILITARY environment, it's one of the reasons we have so many rules and that we restrict RP the way we do. Because this isn't a server for people to RP however-they-want, it's a server to RP in a military situation. When people break outside that for their own stuff, they are taking away from the "global RP" for their own special RP (hence, snowflakes). The gist of this, is supposed to be that: "your a marine, follow orders pretend to be a marine, fight the aliums". That is the RP/universe i set out to create.

[Lostmixup]

Well. Might as well weigh in on this shit.

There's nothing wrong with IC marriages. Gonna agree with Gel, Metafriending is where the root problem lies. That being said, plenty of the people on this server currently doing IC marriages have Metafriended fucking hard. Yes, you're getting called out.

Take for example this past week. We're getting ready in Brief. Got Mike Hernandez, our Spec, and a few others in my squad for Charlie. Tanya, Xur, and a few other players that tend to play together are in Bravo. Mike left Charlie with all of our Spec shit, and a few others took off to Bravo as well. By the time I get to brief, I have one other marine in my squad, and Bravo is overinflated with marines they don't need, because this specific group on the server loves to play with eachother. That's irking, because it fucked Alpha, Charlie, and Delta over.

So already, there's an issue here that manifests from Metafriending. It's not an issue that can be solved with a rule, it's an OOC behavior. So, here's what has to be said about it:

Stop prioritizing your OOC friendships over the fucking game.

You can't begin to comprehend how frustrating it is. You also should understand how EASY IT IS to just let your friends be in a different squad. I have a roommate who plays this game when I do. Multiple staff members I've become friends with and others who introduced me to SS13 whom play here often. We do not focus solely on hanging around eachother constantly, and you know what, the rounds are better for it.

To recap, IC marriages aren't the issue, but the playerbase at large needs to recognize this Metafriend bullshit should stop.

Gel, you've also got a flair for the dramatic. You're like one of two people I actually see on server doing things like that. That isn't a bad thing, I'm just saying you're like a rare case for the most part.

To another point, perhaps marriage could be disallowed now, but allowed again later on when we have more gamemodes and such in that would benefit RP wise from such a thing, and for when we have a proper plan in place to handle these kinds of relationships. The new game mode specifically would be a-ok for this kind of stuff (I don't know how much I can reveal about the plans for that mode) because of how it is structured. Currently, marriage has no place in CM because all the staff are stressed out handling all manor of problems (apop having to do practically everything programming related, joshuu being the only spriter, staff having to deal with new map problems like breaching) that stem from new maps, people taking time off, and all other manors of things. Once we have all this stuff worked out I think it might be fine to bring back in, it would certainly fit in a lot more with the planned gamemodes than with the current gamemode.

[Gelonvia]

Again: Guys, don't reference Eden as a source or resources.

We broke away from Eden, because we couldn't set our own policies and rules, and other differences. Your not going to convince me of anything, if you use Eden, considering their eventual fate.

He called MPs several times before, and even after the injection. I looked into it personally, and I do not believe he was attempting to kill them, but to keep them unconscious until MPs arrived, as again, they broke the windows and were heavily armed marines against a single doctor. One of the other issues about the situation that bothered me, was that the other 2 were not arrested, until staff got involved, which is unacceptable.

His salt was JUSTIFIED. A "marriage" created an uncomfortable situation for someone who was just coming onto the server to play and relax. That's why, I don't mind people being "friends" across rounds, but the level of meta-friends promoted by marriage and some of the other things I've seen recently is getting to crazy. I know the defense is that "players will leave if marriage is illegal", but what about the players who join and run into that stuff and leave? greater than 90% of our playerbase, joins to play for a few rounds at a time. They come for the maps, the weapons, the gameplay. Not the RP. In fact, overall, while we are medium, our "reputation" is "Shit RP, but good action" across most of the places I track (such as the bay forums, reddit, and the global host chat. I'm not going to allow the bullying i experienced on HRP servers to start up here, and from my view, the level of meta-friending promoted by "marriages" is the start down that slope, especially since, I already saw that basically happen. I saw, 2 characters basically "RP-team up" against a fresh spawn doctor, to the point that the final result was his round ruined. He had been on the server for 4 MINUTES.



I don't think they'll ever remove the spousal regulations, which are, basically:

1. Both can't be deployed at the same time
2. Both can't be assigned to the same ship or unit.

In fact, there's even an additional rule, that if your spouse dies in combat overseas, you are permanently removed from being deployable unless you have a "male or female blood heir at least 18 years of age". Now, that can be a "brother/sister" or a son/daughter.



This. The focus is the mission before everything else. I know many people here weren't in the military, but you share a bond with people in your unit and want to protect them. A perfect example of how romances can negatively affect the server, is that situation with the one guy in isolation, while the MP grilled him acting like a psychiatrist (someone posted the link). While that was going on, how many marines died on the planet surface? How many could have been prevented?



A sort of additional aspect, was that the doctor TRIED to RP with the MPs, but the MPs knew the couple, and thus, he was imprisoned a bit harsher than normal, which is why he was upset. (He was fully stripped and put into prison garb, then left in the cell for a bit without interrogation or even discussion.). I monitored the situation, if I was the doctor, I'd have been upset, since he was the one calling the MPs for help, but they didn't show up, until the couple was down and people called for help for that.



Honestly, I don't know. I do lean against marriages, but I was expecting much more of a lean.

Originally, my plan was that if it was super skewed, to follow the skew, but this is dead even, and close enough that I'll have to rely on both the votes, and points in the discussion.

So, if you want to change my view, focus on how we can regulate or adjust it to prevent things like the scenarios presented in the future. Because personally, if there's a way to not get complaints or issues, I have literally no fucks to give. But when players get rounds ruined over behavior I see that is almost identical to stuff that has personally chased me off of HRP servers, that's when I get up in arms.


I'm fairly certain the one who botched the surgery, was not the same CMO. That CMO, had been on the server, for around 4 minutes, and was sorting out all the issues. I had literally been observing him nearly the entire time (barring ahelps and minor shenanigans), due to ahelps about shitlers in medbay.


I try to take this into account of a lot of things. For example recently someone was complaining that some upcoming changes for maintence techs might shift them to being less social as they would actually have a job to do. Apparently, being social over-rides the jobs they should be doing.








Let me try to clarify something:


We are trying to generate RP in a MILITARY environment, it's one of the reasons we have so many rules and that we restrict RP the way we do. Because this isn't a server for people to RP however-they-want, it's a server to RP in a military situation. When people break outside that for their own stuff, they are taking away from the "global RP" for their own special RP (hence, snowflakes). The gist of this, is supposed to be that: "your a marine, follow orders pretend to be a marine, fight the aliums". That is the RP/universe i set out to create.

The problem with asking us to RP Marines is we will never live to that expectations because this is a videogame, the main flaws I have seen with servers who get super into their designated RP types is that they get SO into it they extract and pull out the fun from it, it turns into Job Simulators that get repetitive and boring and restricted to a point its nolonger fun. Alot of people disliked Hypatia for example for becoming a Job Simulator where it felt like you were going to work instead of hopping onto a game to have fun.

The last thing we want is for people to hop on CM and feel like they are forced to nolonger play a Videogame and instead are being forced to play a Marine to its elevated expectations which drains the concept of it being a Video game where you are meant to unwind and have fun on. One thing people dislike already is people view CM as a time where you hop on, go "Yesh sur" go down, see Alien go " OMG Alien!" when you already know what they are from doing this repetitively 30 times over, then they shoot Aliens and eventually die, or stay alive in the FOB and slaughter aliens, one side always feeling stressed cause they are losing. And that's not what you want, you want to have fun when you come on the server, not do a repetition of RL, I love accommodating to making things Realistic but there's a barrier between To Much RP and Too Little, noone wants to be forced to be a Marine on a Videogame but also people don't want to sit around and not RP because then your just marines shooting random shit wildly without any justifications.

Finally, yeah my bad on the Eden thing guys, lets not discuss that at all.

[SASoperative]

At the rate of these fucking quotes I am going to just lock this shit it looks like god damn spam.

[Gelonvia]

Gel, you've also got a flair for the dramatic. You're like one of two people I actually see on server doing things like that. That isn't a bad thing, I'm just saying you're like a rare case for the most part.

To another point, perhaps marriage could be disallowed now, but allowed again later on when we have more gamemodes and such in that would benefit RP wise from such a thing, and for when we have a proper plan in place to handle these kinds of relationships. The new game mode specifically would be a-ok for this kind of stuff (I don't know how much I can reveal about the plans for that mode) because of how it is structured. Currently, marriage has no place in CM because all the staff are stressed out handling all manor of problems (apop having to do practically everything programming related, joshuu being the only spriter, staff having to deal with new map problems like breaching) that stem from new maps, people taking time off, and all other manors of things. Once we have all this stuff worked out I think it might be fine to bring back in, it would certainly fit in a lot more with the planned gamemodes than with the current gamemode.

Ah, so heres where it falls to from what I am hearing, let me get this straight,

We currently have only Apop working on Code which we know about alread,y we have lack of spriters even though the FANTASTIC one we ahve is by far one of the highest in caliber seen we still need more, staff are stressed with what is going on. Now instead of tackling these issues (WHICH IS A TOTALLY DIFFERENT ISSUE) by getting on hiring more people and opening doors, reaching out, we are going to use this entire completely different dilema as an excuse for why we should start banning random tiny things. See the problem with what your saying Lost?

And I sofar I have talked with alot of people! Turns out I learned by others that people use, "Your dramatic yourself." to lead off topics and try to discredit things I say in passive manners as a last resort. Which makes sense right now Lost cause sofar you have,

A: Ignored the opinions of certain posts.
B: Strayed off the topic.
C: Tried to discredit my valid points by lashing at me by using personal opinions.

I hope your aware of this, cause its not a good sign Lost, not even a little, now please stay on topic which is Meta-friending and marriage, mkay?

[KeyWii]

At the rate of these fucking quotes I am going to just lock this shit it looks like god damn spam.

This. Please, please. If you're going to quote a huge ass post, snip it.

My eyes.

[apophis775]

Well, I've been talking with some of the other server hosts, who have more experience in this. They also range from Low RP to high-RP, and they've all said the same thing basically:

"Marriages don't belong on servers like CM".

(on marriages for CM)

I find it highly unlikely. A marine out on space travels flying towards an uncertain fate everytime, and fighting battles that contain enemies ten times worse than ISIS? Doubtful. Whether such a marriage holds for longer than 2 years? Extremely doubtful, heading towards fully impossible. Most marines are trainwrecks in relationships. Colonies I can most certainly agree with. But marines? Ayyyyyyyy NOPE.

Different person:

And 'families' in general?
Most families I see tend to metagame so I'm not a fan

HRP server host

we've had similar problems with that and it is not fun at all to deal with, it's best to disperse that kind of stuff before it happens. once it starts its a non-stop railroad to drama

This is for reference. I'm trying to get as much information before i make a decision as possible.



Also, I apologize for huge-ass posts, I'm typically trying to reply to several people at once.

[Gelonvia]

Well, I've been talking with some of the other server hosts, who have more experience in this. They also range from Low RP to high-RP, and they've all said the same thing basically:

"Marriages don't belong on servers like CM".

(on marriages for CM)

HRP server host
This is for reference. I'm trying to get as much information before i make a decision as possible.



Also, I apologize for huge-ass posts, I'm typically trying to reply to several people at once.

Ohhh, I know who the last guy is, from what I know and have heard about him? He's incredibly ceredible and an extremely nice man, honestly his wording should be considered more then anyone elses... lemme poke Apop to see if I am correct, if so this should be considered extremely.

[Gelonvia]

Ohhh, I know who the last guy is, from what I know and have heard about him? He's incredibly credible and an extremely nice man, honestly his wording should be considered more then anyone elses... lemme poke Apop to see if I am correct, if so this should be considered extremely.

I can't get a silent confirmation but i have no doubts who it is, and personally I think he should be taken into all consideration with his experience.

I still stand by a Yes it should be allowed however due to all the things I said still being a factor, until what happens ACTUALLY happens and its serious enough to become an issue then naw, not a problem.

What the main issue guys to remove the Vagueness is the worry behind staff of IC people who get together, make IC relationships and then they take it tofar into an OOC Relationship which will obviously be complicated. To quote a famous quote, "Long Distance Relationships don't work." this issue is still pressured as being a personal problem, I don't believe preventing IC Marriage would OOCly stop the people from Metafriending or getting into a complicated Relationship if that's on their mind. Thats up to them to learn how that will go.

[Lostmixup]

Ah, so heres where it falls to from what I am hearing, let me get this straight,

We currently have only Apop working on Code which we know about alread,y we have lack of spriters even though the FANTASTIC one we ahve is by far one of the highest in caliber seen we still need more, staff are stressed with what is going on. Now instead of tackling these issues (WHICH IS A TOTALLY DIFFERENT ISSUE) by getting on hiring more people and opening doors, reaching out, we are going to use this entire completely different dilema as an excuse for why we should start banning random tiny things. See the problem with what your saying Lost?

And I sofar I have talked with alot of people! Turns out I learned by others that people use, "Your dramatic yourself." to lead off topics and try to discredit things I say in passive manners as a last resort. Which makes sense right now Lost cause sofar you have,

A: Ignored the opinions of certain posts.
B: Strayed off the topic.
C: Tried to discredit my valid points by lashing at me by using personal opinions.

I hope your aware of this, cause its not a good sign Lost, not even a little, now please stay on topic which is Meta-friending and marriage, mkay?

[/quote][/quote]

You used your own RP as an example! I was saying that you're generally a dramatic person, so you tend to RP in a more detailed manor than most people. You are literally a rarity in CM. I barely see anyone RP the way you do, meaning that RP probably has more meaning to you than it does to me or some other people. It's a compliment more than anything.

For one thing, joshuu is very overwhelmed. He does a fantastic job, but he isn't a one man army. Just because he's the best damn spriter in the world doesn't mean he can do everything without any help.

What I was trying to provide was a solution to the problem that would appease both sides of the coin. The new game mode that apop will be introducing in the future will be a prime space for actual RP to occur because it's a very RP oriented gamemode. What I was suggesting was that we simply disallow marriage for the moment, but try re-allowing it once that game mode is properly out.

Marriage is something that mostly is currently used to justify meta-friending which causes more problems that could be prevented by simply not allowing it. Right now, marriage has no place in CM. It doesn't make sense thematically, and really doesn't add much to most peoples games. In your case as a person that focuses very heavily on RP, it has the potential to make the game a lot more enjoyable and fun. Most people who visit CM though are not looking for RP, they're simply people trying to play as tacticool spacemen who sometimes have cool cinematic RP moments here and there because that's what the server encourages. Doing better RP is fine, but it's not the priority of the server.

If you'd had properly read my opinion piece that I gave earlier, you'd know that I simply do not like the concept of marriage in game anyway. I feel that it's just abused by people being meta. I have not ignored anyone's opinion, I just do not agree with them because I find in game marriages silly to begin with. I did not ignore the dude's opinion when I wrote "TLDR." As I said, I was in school and was skimming through topics and didn't feel like reading every single paragraph that people posted. Also it blatantly said in bright red text "rant" on the top of it (appreciate that btw) which made me immediately think "oh I should scroll past this because it's going to be long, I'll read it at some other time."

Honestly, once CM has the newer more RP focused game mode implemented it'll actually be very good to let marriage be a thing! It could lead to some actually touching scenes being played out. The current gamemode does not allow for very touching scenes to play out at all, it's too combat oriented for that. Marriage, at the moment, is mostly used to justify rule breaking things that are just annoying to deal with as staff, and annoying to have happen to you as a fellow player. It has no place in CM at the moment.