A question about preds...

[Renomaki]

I feel like Predators would best be without so many rules.
It causes conflict for every side arguing about what they can and cant do.

As Fritigern said, it's silly that marines have to avoid stepping on egg-shells just to not get slaughtered. Then you have certain players who want to fight the Predator and other's who just want to avoid it.
A rookie mistake on most predators is to use any justification to murder-bone, like killing all the marines simply because one player is an asshole and shot the predator.

We have all these restrictive rules that most of the player base doesn't understand and we have no mechanics in-place to really enforce fair balance.
I'm so tired of dealing with predator complaints and reading DSAY during pred rounds.

To be honest, there's no real way to check into predator complaints.
There are so many variables that make bypassing certain predator rules acceptable that no matter of logs can properly show that.

Predators will be fun when we put mechanics in that enforce the ruleset we have in-place.
Or we do away with a good chunk of rules.

We do have a very strong whitelisted group of predators currently and any that break rules are quickly punished. The player base does need to chill the fuck out though with the constant crying in dead-chat and thinking predators are breaking rules all the time.

Well, if you could remove or edit the pred rules somewhat.. What WOULD you do?

As is, the current setup is designed to encourage controlled kills over mindless slaughter. Anyone who has played a wizard round on vanilla knows full well what it is like to deal with an antag with god-like power: The murderbone... Sweet god the murderbone.. And over a stinking tank of plasma..

If you intend to edit the rules to allow more freedom, you also have to keep in mind that with great power comes great responsibility, and that you'll still have to try and enforce some form of self control onto hunters to keep them from going off the deep end and killing a whole squad while cloaked, since I just know there is at least ONE pred that is hankering to do that.

[Iatots]

What I got from here and experience:

Some marines keep shooting pacific preds
Some marines are unfazed after seeing their comrades get their spines ripped for shooting at an hostile
Marines walk on eggshells because any confrontation is licence to murderbone for some preds
Marines shooting preds for no reason is one of the reasons preds need tankyness

What I suggest:
Marines on a search and rescue mission that shoot first and ask questions later is a break of the RP rule, and possible metagaming: you don't know who/what it is, that's not how trained professionals do.
1st offense is warning, 2nd day ban, 3rd possible perma because it's really fucking straightforward. If you see a wierd as fuck humanoid on a desert colony you could at least ask "who the fuck are you?!" for some RP.
And no this doesn't apply to xenomorphs, because they look nothing like a civilized species.

Marines not returning fire to a predator that deliberately, with no provocation, attacked a fellow soldier, is a break of RP rule and metagaming. I would also encourage preds to duel marines in isolated locations: "Better not prevent that thing from killing my comrade, it might come for me" is exactly the opposite a trained soldier would think. God gave you a gun, use it.

Turn preds in what they are: glass cannons. It might take arnie and friends 30 shots to the face to kill a pred in 1980-something, and they might tank 1990 shogun slugs, but a smartgun shreds them in a burst if everything connects, and the reason our 22nd century shotguns are pump action is because they are so powerful any semi-auto mechanism is unreliable. 12 gauge is itty bitty ammunition for itty bitty late 20th/early 21st century auto-peashooters, like the AA12.

And once preds are tough side characters, instead of godly "round arbiters" and "game balancers", their OOC regulations can become more lax. Everything in the honor code stays, the actual moderation becomes more lax: That ravager/spitter combo wreking marines? Uncloak, throw some smartdisks and go to town on their ass.That marine saying "fuck off" and firing a warning shot at a wall after you throw a knife at his feet and demand a duel IS a great stain on your honor, and you ARE allowed to laser his ass with your plasma rifle, but can you take on his friends too? The answer is probably not.

[Kevinthezhang]

What I got from here and experience:

Some marines keep shooting pacific preds
Some marines are unfazed after seeing their comrades get their spines ripped for shooting at an hostile
Marines walk on eggshells because any confrontation is licence to murderbone for some preds
Marines shooting preds for no reason is one of the reasons preds need tankyness

What I suggest:
Marines on a search and rescue mission that shoot first and ask questions later is a break of the RP rule, and possible metagaming: you don't know who/what it is, that's not how trained professionals do.
1st offense is warning, 2nd day ban, 3rd possible perma because it's really fucking straightforward. If you see a wierd as fuck humanoid on a desert colony you could at least ask "who the fuck are you?!" for some RP.
And no this doesn't apply to xenomorphs, because they look nothing like a civilized species.

Marines not returning fire to a predator that deliberately, with no provocation, attacked a fellow soldier, is a break of RP rule and metagaming. I would also encourage preds to duel marines in isolated locations: "Better not prevent that thing from killing my comrade, it might come for me" is exactly the opposite a trained soldier would think. God gave you a gun, use it.

Turn preds in what they are: glass cannons. It might take arnie and friends 30 shots to the face to kill a pred in 1980-something, and they might tank 1990 shogun slugs, but a smartgun shreds them in a burst if everything connects, and the reason our 22nd century shotguns are pump action is because they are so powerful any semi-auto mechanism is unreliable. 12 gauge is itty bitty ammunition for itty bitty late 20th/early 21st century auto-peashooters, like the AA12.

And once preds are tough side characters, instead of godly "round arbiters" and "game balancers", their OOC regulations can become more lax. Everything in the honor code stays, the actual moderation becomes more lax: That ravager/spitter combo wreking marines? Uncloak, throw some smartdisks and go to town on their ass.That marine saying "fuck off" and firing a warning shot at a wall after you throw a knife at his feet and demand a duel IS a great stain on your honor, and you ARE allowed to laser his ass with your plasma rifle, but can you take on his friends too? The answer is probably not.

I think if you find a weird as fuck humanoid on a desert colony that is completely fucked with everyone dead could justify a shoot-first action rather than attempting to speak english to the humanoid.

Also marines are hardly capable of telling predators apart from one another, so if one pred attacks marines, all preds would be declared hostile.
Marines also can't tell if a predator attacked a fellow soldier with provocation or without and you can't really expect them to perform detective work before shooting up the humanoid alien attacking their buddy.

[Iatots]

I think if you find a weird as fuck humanoid on a desert colony that is completely fucked with everyone dead could justify a shoot-first action rather than attempting to speak english to the humanoid.

It's not completely fucked, neither are there any bodies to be seen. You are there to find out what happened, and that humanoid can only be human since you know of no other sentient life. That humanoid is where you should look for answers, and shooting it is dumb as shit.

Also marines are hardly capable of telling predators apart from one another, so if one pred attacks marines, all preds would be declared hostile.

So? If two separate squads meet two separate preds at the same time, one pacific and the other not, then ARRPEE happens and the pacific pred gets a gun pointed in their face until they answer some questions. If any pacific pred gets near humans after they already met a hostile hunter, MORE ARRPEE happens and that pred can starts earning their whitelist by trying to communicate no hostility, or just flees.

Marines also can't tell if a predator attacked a fellow soldier with provocation or without and you can't really expect them to perform detective work before shooting up the humanoid alien attacking their buddy.

And? You are a trained soldier, and so is the other marine. You see a hostile attacking a friendly, you SHOOT. If you really think the other marine is a shithead and probably spit in his face, or have reasons to think the other pred is not a savage murderbeast, you can lay down some SUPPRESSIVE FIRE (shooting without aiming to kill, crazy right?) to get them separated and start making questions. If the pred doesn't stop shooting after you do, kill him. If he does, MORE ARRPEE.

[northcote4]

ARRPEE.

Pretty sure what you're talking about is a myth.

Jokes aside, I like the way you think.

[Simo94]

they should stay in but they need to focus more on balancing the round by hunting the winning side

[Shyguychizzy]

they should stay in but they need to focus more on balancing the round by hunting the winning side

The thing is that's a huge no no, I mean it be quite unfair for both sides. If muhreens are winning then pred comes and finishes the xenos off, they are hunters, they aren't a factor to balance the round.