Add Derelict Shuttle With Random Boarding Points

[Surrealistik]

Summary (a quick, 2-3 sentence summary):

Per subject.


Benefits (How this will benefit the server and game as a whole):

Prevents Xenos from being hangar camped each and every time they come to the Campaco which is a boring and stale meta which forces an all-or-nothing do-or-die engagement that Xenus can't retreat from. Also allows for explosives and other marine toys to be made better since you don't have to balance them and the marines in general around Campaco/Rasputin spam/camping.


Details (Description of how you think this would work, the benefits, etc):

Each map has a derelict shuttle of some kind (which probably features evidence of would be escapees getting rekt/kidnapped/dragged away). The Queen can utilize this shuttle to board a random point on the Campaco exactly as the mercenaries/EMTs do, thereby preventing Xenus from getting ASSBLAST U-S-Aed with unlimited explosives in a tiny space while they're flanked and can't run/disperse. Rasputin and Droppod destinations are unchanged. No human can operate the fucked up computer of this shuttle; only the Queen with her voodoo psychic hoodoo is capable of such a miraculous feat (she's got friends on the other side).

When the derelict shuttle is in the process of boarding (landing noise etc), the marines will get an automated warning as to its location, so they have _some_ time to prepare and redeploy. They will also get a warning about the derelict launching towards the Campaco when it revs up, so they can prepare distributed albeit not focused defenses at each possible point of entry.

If necessary, to give marines more time to coordinate a defense and set some barricades up at each access point, the derelict shuttle can be made to take more time to dock with the Sulaco (vs the Rasputin and such) as it's a banged up piece of shit. The idea is to allow the marines to get defenses in place and delay the Xenus long enough for some reinforcements to arrive and inflict casualties, but not long enough that it effectively amounts to Rasputin camping 2.0.


Implementation (Optional, if you have an idea how to implement it):

Coding, mapping.

[Monoo]

If xenos make it to the hangar in the first place, they have about a 75% chance of winning already, and that's with a god-tier hangar defense where the 'rines have either recovered all their heavy weapons from the planet or emptied out requisitions. What more do you want?

Honestly this suggestion would cause the Sulaco to fall in under five minutes. Marines would have no chance of a last stand because of the 50-even chance that the xenos would instantly swarm the upper deck, and then neuter all the important systems/massacre vulnerable personnel like command and doctors.

-1

[Surrealistik]

If xenos make it to the hangar in the first place, they have about a 75% chance of winning already, and that's with a god-tier hangar defense where the 'rines have either recovered all their heavy weapons from the planet or emptied out requisitions. What more do you want?

Honestly this suggestion would cause the Sulaco to fall in under five minutes. Marines would have no chance of a last stand because of the 50-even chance that the xenos would instantly swarm the upper deck, and then neuter all the important systems/massacre vulnerable personnel like command and doctors.

-1

#1: I'm a marine main (obviously) if you're attempting to imply Xenu bias (I never play Xenu these days). What I want is a satisfying meta that doesn't revolve around the inevitable hangar camp every round.

#2: Obviously other segments of the game need to be rebalanced given that CM as it stands is in large part orientated around the assumption of a massive Rasputin camp; this will mean probable marine buffs per the 'Benefits' section of the OP (like more explosives being worth a shit other than the SADAR HE rockets as an example).

#3: When the derelict has docked, or is in the process of docking (i.e. landing noise etc), I can see the marines getting an automated warning immediately, so that they can rush to defend the area; the main thing is avoiding a massive camp fest before hand at a singular point of entry. Mind also that marines get the usual warning when the ship revs up to leave planetside, so they can make distributed defenses at each possible access point which hopefully is enough to hold until reinforcements can arrive after the exact location is disclosed.

[Monoo]

What I want is a satisfying meta that doesn't revolve around the inevitable hangar camp every round.

Camp? As in, two or three people actually fortifying and the rest hanging out for a bit before making a mad dash up the ladders? Yeah, no. I'm not sure what you're trying to assert here - for one, it would be natural to defend the hangar if it's announced the dropship is landing, so I don't see the logic behind calling it "camping." The alternative would be suicide charging down to the surface, which is a waste of, well, everything. And calling it inevitable, hah. It's an integral part of the gameplay. Do you also complain about the "inevitable FOB construction" or the "stale and uninteresting river assault?"

#2: Obviously other segments of the game need to be rebalanced given that CM as it stands is in large part orientated around the assumption of a massive Rasputin camp; this will mean probable marine buffs per the 'Benefits' section of the OP (like more explosives being worth a shit other than the SADAR HE rockets as an example).

I would respectfully disagree here, saying that the entire server, and all of the rounds that occur on it, are oriented towards one phase of a xeno-sided round is kind of silly. I've seen rounds go plenty of different ways at this stage, things don't necessarily devolve into the same "Rasputin camp" every time... hell, come to think of it, I can't remember any meta at all regarding hangar defenses. Nothing cut and dry; they've all been different and had different outcomes.

#3: When the derelict has docked, or is in the process of docking (i.e. landing noise etc), I can see the marines getting an automated warning immediately, so that they can rush to defend the area; the main thing is avoiding a massive camp fest before hand at a singular point of entry. Mind also that marines get the usual warning when the ship revs up to leave planetside, so they can make distributed defenses at each possible access point which hopefully is enough to hold until reinforcements can arrive after the exact location is disclosed.

Marines are in their best form while defending. Their mechanics are built around setting up fortifications and holding them, and protecting their equipment from offensive xenomorph tactics (Queen screech, Crusher charge in tandem with a boiler cloud, etc.)

To give them maybe two minute's warning of an attack and expecting them to perform well is outrageous. They won't survive with rushed, basic defenses and the hope of reinforcements. A single Queen screech, and all of them are down and decapped because of the lack of turrets, barricades, and the like. Same thing as my previous post, Sulaco falls in under five minutes.

[Surrealistik]

Camp? As in, two or three people actually fortifying and the rest hanging out for a bit before making a mad dash up the ladders? Yeah, no. I'm not sure what you're trying to assert here - for one, it would be natural to defend the hangar if it's announced the dropship is landing, so I don't see the logic behind calling it "camping." The alternative would be suicide charging down to the surface, which is a waste of, well, everything. And calling it inevitable, hah. It's an integral part of the gameplay. Do you also complain about the "inevitable FOB construction" or the "stale and uninteresting river assault?"

No, I mean the lines of grenade launchers on both sides of the Rasputin + sentries and shockbolted doors, and barricades. The all or nothing, do or die moment that aliens can't escape or withdraw from, and that the entire game generally hinges on. It's too decisive and too polarizing.

Yes, there are several inevitable and routine elements of the game, but none of them share these characteristics; there is no engagement in the game that's more pivotal, nor is any other engagement in the game effectively mandatory and all-in.

I would respectfully disagree here, saying that the entire server, and all of the rounds that occur on it, are oriented towards one phase of a xeno-sided round is kind of silly. I've seen rounds go plenty of different ways at this stage, things don't necessarily devolve into the same "Rasputin camp" every time... hell, come to think of it, I can't remember any meta at all regarding hangar defenses. Nothing cut and dry; they've all been different and had different outcomes.

Rasputin camp is a staple and centralizing element. The only time it doesn't happen is when Marines curbstomp the Xenos. Further, it is indisputable that many things, and in particular explosives, have been balanced (i.e. nerfed) around the assumption of the Rasputin camp; decoupling balance from this centralizing element is a major boon.

Marines are in their best form while defending. Their mechanics are built around setting up fortifications and holding them, and protecting their equipment from offensive xenomorph tactics (Queen screech, Crusher charge in tandem with a boiler cloud, etc.)

To give them maybe two minute's warning of an attack and expecting them to perform well is outrageous. They won't survive with rushed, basic defenses and the hope of reinforcements. A single Queen screech, and all of them are down and decapped because of the lack of turrets, barricades, and the like. Same thing as my previous post, Sulaco falls in under five minutes.

You're essentially assuming no other marine buffs and an incompetent command staff. Two minutes is certainly enough to set up barricades at, and open up routes of access to each possible point of entry (there aren't actually that many). 20 seconds land time is enough to get reinforcements to the threatened area (and if necessary, the derelict shuttle could take more time than the Rasputin to dock as it's a banged up piece of shit).

[McRipfist]

-1 from the no.1 unbiased Perma marine. We can barely keep the bald dimwits as is, with this we'd have to corral them around the ship. Unless the thing comes full of attachments we'll have no luck with moving our forces.

[Surrealistik]

-1 from the no.1 unbiased Perma marine. We can barely keep the bald dimwits as is, with this we'd have to corral them around the ship. Unless the thing comes full of attachments we'll have no luck with moving our forces.

Here's the thing: the shuttle's dock time can be adjusted upwards as needed and there's a narrative basis for that because it's banged up and barely functional, thus allowing marines enough time to set up at least a meaningful defense at each access point that can delay the Xenus long enough for some reinforcements to arrive, but not long enough that it effectively amounts to a Rasputin camping 2.0.

[McRipfist]

I dunno. Just already a piss to try and organize a hanger defence. More hassle and less chance of a 'successful' defence. Only plus is we can blast the one entrance they have if we can move their fast enough. Downside is anti-'meta' rules that bar us from preparing defended at any of the secondary hangers.

[Surrealistik]

I dunno. Just already a piss to try and organize a hanger defence. More hassle and less chance of a 'successful' defence. Only plus is we can blast the one entrance they have if we can move their fast enough. Downside is anti-'meta' rules that bar us from preparing defended at any of the secondary hangers.

By secondary hangars do you mean docking points? Once the alert goes out that a shuttle is attempting to dock at an unknown bay, marines are definitely within their rights to secure all of the bays and place defenses there (there are three as I recall: South Hangar, Cargo and south of main ladders on the main floor).

[McRipfist]

By secondary hangars do you mean docking points? Once the alert goes out that a shuttle is attempting to dock at an unknown bay, marines are definitely within their rights to secure all of the bays and place defenses there (there are three as I recall: South Hangar, Cargo and south of main ladders on the main floor).

Tell that to every time we prep defenses at an XRT docking. As I recall it's frowned upon to do so.

[Surrealistik]

Tell that to every time we prep defenses at an XRT docking. As I recall it's frowned upon to do so.

So the admins were being silly, unless of course you have no reason to expect XRT hostility, or boarding by XRTs.

In this case you have clear and present danger coming from one of three places. Obviously it wouldn't make sense to prevent marines from building defenses, or classify that as meta.

[Szunti]

I generally like this, because when I play xeno it's either an empty Sulaco and easy win or 20+ marines including PMCs camping the Rasputin and spamming grenades everywhere.

But I think there is only a single tile door on those shuttles, there are 4 locations and 3 emitters. But even without emitters it's real pain to get through a one tile door. You will be pushed by xenos from tha back and shot/naded from the front. You can melt the walls next to the door, but it's still a narrow choke plus then there is no cover at all, and unless you have a boiler (or even with boiler acid), by the time it melts every marine will be there. So I think it needs a redesign of the shuttle and docks to work.

[apophis775]

Denied.