Jack Knight, Illegal Arrest and Execution

[Gookamungus]

Your Byond Key:
Gookamungus

Your Character Name:
Malik ibn Khassis

Accused Byond Key(if known):

Character Name:
Jack Knight

Approximate time and date of the incident (Central US Time for fastest results):
CST 11:00 AM 13/8/17

What rule(s) were broken:
Powergaming? Griefing? Being a dick?

Description of the incident:
Here are the facts and the way events went down:

I spawned as XO. While the marines dropped, I decided to check out the Requisitions Office. There was a Req Officer briefly but he SSD'd, so I took over. I began to ferry pistols over to the autolathe to turn into metal for the FOB at nexus. The Chief Engineer comes in, tells me I would probably be more use in the CIC than in the Req Office. I agree with him, and decide to give him req access because he says he can handle juggling both engineering and the req office. I go to the terminal behind briefing and give him access to the office.

Before I leave completely, I decide to ferry another backpack of pistols into the autolathe for metal sheets. CMP WO Jack Knight comes in and tells me that I'm under arrest for destroying government property. He tells me to lay down on the ground and put my hands behind me. I say that I dispute his charge, and will not comply with his arrest. I do not run. He tazes me, cuffs me, and brigs me.

This is when he charges me with 1. Damage to Government Property (for turning the pistols into metal). 2. Resisting Arrest (my refusal to lie down), and 3. Hooliganism (for giving the CE access to requisitions). I am also charged with 4. Conduct Unbecoming an Officer (I am the XO). He gives me the max charges-- 30 mins, 30 minutes, 10 minutes, and with the fourth charge doubles it to over the timer limit, so he decides to put me in security isolation for permabrigging pretty quickly. I still have my headset on me so I make an appeal to anyone who will listen but I know the commander is busy with the battle and needs his staff officers paying attention.

I argue that as the XO, I have the authority to take the actions I did, but he refuses to listen. I ask them (anyone who will listen) to fax high command or the provost marshal. Knight receives a fax. Apparently it gives him permission to execute me. He gets the commander to come down, who apparently signs off on it. I am then put in the execution room and shot to death, although I accuse Knight of being a criminal for charging me unlawfully.

That's when I ahelped to figure out if this was some joke or actually truly lawful, though I dispute it in any case. I explain the situation to trial mod Adrialimas, who said that from what they saw it was all legal. However, they also say they do not have the best grasp of marine law and tells me that they can forward the issue to the current mod on, who turned out to be Kavlo, who told me I should probably make a player report.


Evidence (screenshots, logs, etc):

How you would punish the accused:

Job ban. Or at least a warning. If this is lawful, then marine law needs to be adjusted.

[Westhybrid]

CO here.

Wasn't present for all of it, but as far as the High Command fax goes, it was either a properly sent fax from one of the Mods or Stamos, or a very well done forgery by Jones. It wasn't a matter of me signing off on the fax, the terms of the execution were clearly stated as non-negotiable. We initially argued against Jones to put him back in a regular cell and let the timer run, but then the fax arrived. I didn't argue it because the marines were getting reamed and I had to get back to the CIC.

[coroneljones]

Putting in my story:
Spawned in as soon as the old CMP cryoed, joined just as an MT took the RO´s stamp from cryo and ran for requisitions, as I was passing requisitions to head to the brig, I saw the CE and the MT in the backroom for some reason, So I decided to check it out, I then spot the XO putting pistol after pistol into the autolathe for metal, to which I then question him on it and he replies that he is "repurposing them".

I proceed to arrest him, (Mild mistake here, seems like you need to fax and get a reply prior to arresting anyone from command, was PMed about this and sent a fax as an attachment to the Unauthorized ID increase) and move him to the brig, counting the sheets made, 20 minutes for Damage to government property for Five whole stacks of metal from pistols (Doubled, 40), Hooliganism(Modified the CE´s ID without checking or getting authorization from the Commander ) /5 minutes, minimum, doubled to ten, and then Resisting arrest(Refusing to comply with the arrest peacefully), 10, then 20 due to Conduct Unbecoming, I proceeded to move you to Permanent Isolation, seeing as you had changed an ID´s access without a proper reason or the CO´s authorization, had five whole stacks of 50 metal from destroying weaponry and refused to comply with the arrest.

Sent a fax to High Command inquiring about what to do about the modified ID, since the commander "authorized it" post-arrest and I was later pinged about the fax-clause( sadly not present to full extent in marine law apart from incompetent command mentioning anything apart from faxing to remove from command).

The Commander requested for the Executive Officer to be moved to a cell with a timer, I debated it while awaiting a fax reply and proceeded to then move him to a cell, a downgrade/approved appeal, with 65 minutes left on the 70 minute sentence, around the appropriate time considering the time spent in perma, and then I recieved a reply from High Command regarding the XO´s situation, which ordered an immediate execution via firing squad that was non-negotiable.

I requested the Commander to the brig, gave him the fax and allowed him to read it, and then prepared for the execution and following the proper procedure.

[Kazuko_myu]

CO here.

Wasn't present for all of it, but as far as the High Command fax goes, it was either a properly sent fax from one of the Mods or Stamos, or a very well done forgery by Jones. It wasn't a matter of me signing off on the fax, the terms of the execution were clearly stated as non-negotiable. We initially argued against Jones to put him back in a regular cell and let the timer run, but then the fax arrived. I didn't argue it because the marines were getting reamed and I had to get back to the CIC.

I was the one to write the USCM fax, with permission from @adralimas. I read through the USCM fax where it listed all of his transgressions, then I asked the Mod for allowance to write on his behalf. When we weren't sure whether or not it would be possible to demote the XO to janitorial work, we settled for execution in order to free up a job slot if it was neccessary. If the punishment was the best choice, I don't know, probably not. But the CMP dramatized it a little on his report.

[Kavlo]

Here is the logs related to the event:

Special thanks to Jay Burns for pulling these while I pulled logs for something else.

Code: Select all

JONES LOGS:


[10:32:44]SAY: Jack Knight/Coroneljones : Lieutenant-Commander, what are you doing with an autolathe and that pistol?
[10:33:54]SAY: Jack Knight/Coroneljones : You are destroying government property...to make metal
[10:33:29]SAY: Jack Knight/Coroneljones : Lieutenant-Commander Khassis, you are under arrest for Damage to government property and Conduct Unbecoming of an Officer, you have five seconds to get on the ground and comply with this arrest
[10:34:58]SAY: Jack Knight/Coroneljones : Resisting arrest it is
[10:35:02]ATTACK: Coroneljones/(Jack Knight) stunned Gookamungus/(Malik Ibn Khassis) with the the stunbaton.

[10:35:22]SAY: Jack Knight/Coroneljones : Damage to government property, Conduct Unbecoming of an officer
[10:35:26]SAY: Jack Knight/Coroneljones : And resisting arrest as of now

[10:36:37]SAY: Jack Knight/Coroneljones : So you gave the Chief Engineer access, but did you talk to the Commander about this?

[10:37:16]SAY: Jack Knight/Coroneljones : So you decided to give someone unauthorized access against protocol and then destroy weaponry
[10:37:27]SAY: Jack Knight/Coroneljones : Thats Hooliganism charges then

[10:38:01]SAY: Jack Knight/Coroneljones : We have a set amount of access that is not to be tampered with.

[10:39:02]SAY: Jack Knight/Coroneljones : Engineering, I suggest doing less requisitions work and handling power
[10:39:05]SAY: Jack Knight/Coroneljones : The brig is offline

[10:40:57]SAY: Jack Knight/Coroneljones : Hooliganism, Ten Minutes. Damage to government property, Fourty Minutes. Resisting arrest, 20 Minutes.
[10:41:07]SAY: Jack Knight/Coroneljones : 70 total minutes
[10:41:23]SAY: Jack Knight/Coroneljones : 70 Total Minutes for the Lieutenant-Commander, now to debate permanent Isolation..

[10:43:25]SAY: Jack Knight/Coroneljones : Well, 70 minutes is out of the scope of the timer
[10:43:34]SAY: Jack Knight/Coroneljones : So sadly its going to have to be permanent Incarceration, Lieutenant-Commander

[10:44:31]SAY: Jack Knight/Coroneljones : Seeing as his timer is above the needed time, He resisted arrest, has about..250 metal sheets in destroyed pistols and the timer caps at 60...its for the best

[10:48:57]SAY: Jack Knight/Coroneljones : You changed ID access for mostly invalid reasons, Lieutenant-Commander

[10:51:19]SAY: Jack Knight/Coroneljones : Lieutenant-Commander, it was a low level shenanigan that tampered with standard protocol and the way the ship functions

(after reciving THE FAX)
[11:11:58]SAY: Jack Knight/Coroneljones : Knie, move the Lieutenant-Commander to the Execution Chamber
[11:12:08]SAY: Jack Knight/Coroneljones : Firing Squad or Lethal Injection, Commander?

[11:18:48]SAY: Jack Knight/Coroneljones : Bring forth the law, Fire!

MALIKS LOGS:

[10:32:11]SAY: Malik Ibn Khassis/Gookamungus : I gave you access to prep as well, Spaghetti.

[10:32:52]SAY: Malik Ibn Khassis/Gookamungus : Feeding pistols into the autolathe.

[10:33:40]SAY: Malik Ibn Khassis/Gookamungus : Jack, I'd like to hear the logic behind this charge.

[10:33:57]SAY: Malik Ibn Khassis/Gookamungus : This is recycling for military usage.
[10:34:06]SAY: Malik Ibn Khassis/Gookamungus : The metal is going down to the surface for barricades.

[10:34:52]SAY: Malik Ibn Khassis/Gookamungus : I dispute this charge, and will not comply with an arrest.

10:43:47]SAY: Malik Ibn Khassis/Gookamungus : The Warrant Officer is putting me into permanent incarceration.

[10:44:31]SAY: Malik Ibn Khassis/Gookamungus : I did not comply but that does not mean I resisted.

[10:45:55]SAY: Malik Ibn Khassis/Gookamungus : You're bending the rules, Jack. And you know it.

[10:48:32]SAY: Malik Ibn Khassis/Gookamungus : Jack, you slapped a hooliganism charge on me for something that is within my power.

[10:49:00]SAY: Malik Ibn Khassis/Gookamungus : Where in Marine Law does it say the XO is not authorized to provide extra access to make up for lost manpower?

[10:50:19]SAY: Malik Ibn Khassis/Gookamungus : Are you admitting that it is not part of marine law?

[10:50:28]SAY: Malik Ibn Khassis/Gookamungus : If it's not part of marine law, you slapped an illegal hooliganism charge on me.
[10:50:33]SAY: Malik Ibn Khassis/Gookamungus : Therefore you have broken the law.
[10:51:07]SAY: Malik Ibn Khassis/Gookamungus : Warrant Officer, do you admit that standard protocol is not part of marine law? Yes or no?

[10:52:40]SAY: Malik Ibn Khassis/Gookamungus : The Warrant Officer won't admit he made a mistake. He has charged me illegally.

[10:53:03]SAY: Malik Ibn Khassis/Gookamungus : There is no hooliganism charge by his own logic, because his stated reason is not even in marine law.

[10:57:44]SAY: Malik Ibn Khassis/Gookamungus : I could dispute any of the charges that I'm given. Right here in marine law, it says that damage of government property is forbidden, but it also requires authorization by the department head. As the XO, it falls under my jurisdiction.

[11:01:03]SAY: Malik Ibn Khassis/Gookamungus : Contact the provost martial if you can.
[11:01:08]SAY: Malik Ibn Khassis/Gookamungus : Get this cleared up.

[11:07:36]SAY: Malik Ibn Khassis/Gookamungus : Non stop screaming? I've made a calm, collected argument that you're a jackass and a criminal.

[11:11:54]SAY: Malik Ibn Khassis/Gookamungus : They're about to execute me. What the fuck?

[11:19:32]ADMIN: HELP: Gookamungus/(Malik Ibn Khassis): was i actually "legally" imprisoned, charged, and executed? - heard by 

[Adralimas]

As the trial moderation that gave permission to Kazuko_myu to handle both the fax reply to the CMP And the decision on either execution or demotion after some discussion aswell as the one who answered the initial ahelp before passing it off to kavlo as something i wasn't able to handle i feel now that a couple of issues arose with the charges, First the hooliganism charge for giving unauthorized access to the CE To run requisitions, There was no crew manning requisitions at the time at all and wouldn't have really been disruptive to anyone. Second the damage to government property for the melting of those pistols, Damage to government property only appears to apply to damage done to the almayer itself rather than armaments, As for the resisting arrest that was correctly applied.

[Gookamungus]

After some consideration I think suggesting a job ban is a bit heavy handed, though if the admins decide to rule in my favor I think a warning should definitely still be given. I don't think Coroneljones was acting maliciously despite the extreme measures I thought he took for a pretty simple "infraction". Mostly what I want to do is establish precedent for where the line is when it comes to Marine Law and roleplaying and interpretation, so we can all get on to playing our 2d spessmen game more smoothly.

[tiredbum]

Chief Engineer here. I thought everything we were doing was perfectly allowed within the law. Hell he WAS the Executive officer on the ship. Once Jack came in and started spouting off arrest I was floored. The jail time was ridiculous, stuff like that is what makes marines hate the MPs so godamn much. Then he started to arrest people like crazy just for objecting his version of the law. I gave the CO (Darius Ico) my modified ID after some cargo staff woke up and he just gave it back to me sayong not to worry about it, yet I STILL heard Jack talking about arresting me over comms. Also I don't know if Jack ever found out about it, but I had told the CO I was planning on blowing up the brig to get the XO out, but got caught on the brig door bolting before I could get started

[coroneljones]

Chief Engineer here. I thought everything we were doing was perfectly allowed within the law. Hell he WAS the Executive officer on the ship. Once Jack came in and started spouting off arrest I was floored. The jail time was ridiculous, stuff like that is what makes marines hate the MPs so godamn much. Then he started to arrest people like crazy just for objecting his version of the law. I gave the CO (Darius Ico) my modified ID after some cargo staff woke up and he just gave it back to me sayong not to worry about it, yet I STILL heard Jack talking about arresting me over comms. Also I don't know if Jack ever found out about it, but I had told the CO I was planning on blowing up the brig to get the XO out, but got caught on the brig door bolting before I could get started

You might have gotten some mistakes in that:
-I did not start arrest people "like crazy just for objecting my version of the law", I barely arrested anyone personaly apart from the Executive Officer, since I spent most of my time in the brig waiting for faxes or watching it.

-I did not talk about arresting you due to the modified ID thing, after the commander informed me of his "authorization", perhaps you heard me talk about it after I found the brig doors bolted, with your fibers on them, after Lieutenant Bill Carson informed me that you were sitting outside of the brig for some reason, pre-execution. Sadly never got to do that since I never got an authorization fax for the arrest and the xenos boarded, along with your various threats that you were going to kill me/the MPs if you saw us and making a safe-room onboard to hide pre-boarding.

[Sneakyr]

I was present for this as an LT, and I think the problem is with Marine Law, rather than the actions of the CMP. Currently, things like saying "fuck command" can be "reasonably" changed to six (depending on number of command staff) individual counts of disrespecting a superior as opposed to one, which along with resisting arrest once had a marine end up in the brig for 90 minutes. The worst part of it all is that the CMP, an MP himself and occasionally an arresting officer, is the one who has absolute say over marine law on the ship, meaning you're almost guaranteed to get a biased analysis of your case.

Tl;dr: Punishing the CMP won't fix anything as it is a problem with Marine Law and MPs interpretation in general rather than the CMP himself.

[tiredbum]

I mean, you can make an argument saying YOU did not personally arrest more people. But as the CMP you set a precedent that had your MPs throw Carson, Patton, and Leo Blackburn in the gulag for speaking out against you.

Then again, Sneakyr has a point too. I dunno it just seems that MPs get ALOT of shit each and every round, but it doesn't help the fact like he said a singular offense can be wildly blown out of proportion, and the only person you are answering to is yourself as the CMP.

[coroneljones]

I mean, you can make an argument saying YOU did not personally arrest more people. But as the CMP you set a precedent that had your MPs throw Carson, Patton, and Leo Blackburn in the gulag for speaking out against you.

Then again, Sneakyr has a point too. I dunno it just seems that MPs get ALOT of shit each and every round, but it doesn't help the fact like he said a singular offense can be wildly blown out of proportion, and the only person you are answering to is yourself as the CMP.

Nope
-Carson, the Commander ordered his arrest for inciting panic over non-existant executions, never told the MPs to arrest them as I was still waiting on the CE fax
-Blackburn insulted Command and broke out of his cell atleast once
-Patton was never arrested as far as I know, he was in the brig and broke out Carson mid-boarding

[Feweh]

So pretty much no rule breaks, followed Marine Law and had permission things via FAXs.

Resolved.

Dont make salty reports.