Allow Queen to revert xenos to larva

[Toroic]

Summary (a quick, 2-3 sentence summary):

Allow the queen to revert other xenos to larvae.

Benefits (How this will benefit the server and game as a whole):

SSD xenos will be able to be recycled via queen intervention for those rounds that run past midnight and people are ssding like flies.

I know sometimes admin let ghosts go into ssd xenos.

Details (Description of how you think this would work, the benefits, etc):

Within one tile a queen can pay a plasma cost to turn a xeno into a larvae. That way ssd xenos, or those shitters who eat jelly and then dc for the rest of the round aren't just a waste of space.

This will allow more consistency. Xeno team can't produce more xenos than they have hosts, so each one that is lost is significant. SSD marines can have their gear stripped so specialist weapons aren't lost completely, this gives xenos more parity.

It also allows xenos to repick their caste (with queen intervention) if the team composition sucks (nothing left at the end but 3 hivelord during kill time) which is balanced by them having to start completely over as 0 progress larvae.

1) Keeps xeno numbers more consistent each round

2) Improves the ability for players to handle issues in-game (ssd queen being the exception, but that should be handled by admins instead)

3) Allows xenos more tactical options lategame.


Implementation (Optional, if you have an idea how to implement it):

Queen gets a verb a lot like the plasma transfer verb while standing next to a xeno.

"Do you wish to revert this xeno to a larva?"

"Are you sure?"

Cooldown/plasma cost as needed, but if this was implemented xenos would actually drag those xenos that randomly go ssd so the queen can recycle them. Xeno team is still at a disadvantage, as a tier 2/3 could be traded for a larva, but they don't lose 10%-40% of their team to SSD every game.

[ChickenShizNit8]

This won't be abused by idiot Queens....

-1

[apophis775]

Oh gods... um... no...

[MrGabol100]

What? No!? This is literally retarded, could be abused and completely game breaking, appart for not having even a little basis in ANY lore.

[TortoiseGaming]

It is a good idea, but terrible queens will absolutely abuse that power

[Toroic]

This won't be abused by idiot Queens....

-1

Idiot queens can do whatever they want already. They can order the hive to suicide if they want.

That's why there's only a 1 tile range (everything can outrun queens) and a plasma cost.

If someone is being a shitter, then they'll get banned. Logs will show it and a xeno who was unwillingly reverted will be highly motivated to post a complaint.

What? No!? This is literally retarded, could be abused and completely game breaking, appart for not having even a little basis in ANY lore.

We deviate from lore all the time already. Aliens lore is an incoherent mess to begin with.

It is a good idea, but terrible queens will absolutely abuse that power

Marines have a million ways to fuck over their own team far worse than this. A bad SADAR or bluespace grenade kills 10+ marines all the time. The solution is just to ban the shitters.

Oh gods... um... no...

Marines have plenty of options that are just as much of a problem, and generally they keep it under control. Bad grenades hurt way more people than this could, especially if there is a high plasma cost/decent cooldown.

[MrGabol100]

Idiot queens can do whatever they want already. They can order the hive to suicide if they want.

That's why there's only a 1 tile range (everything can outrun queens) and a plasma cost.

If someone is being a shitter, then they'll get banned. Logs will show it and a xeno who was unwillingly reverted will be highly motivated to post a complaint.
We deviate from lore all the time already. Aliens lore is an incoherent mess to begin with.
Marines have a million ways to fuck over their own team far worse than this. A bad SADAR or bluespace grenade kills 10+ marines all the time. The solution is just to ban the shitters.
Marines have plenty of options that are just as much of a problem, and generally they keep it under control. Bad grenades hurt way more people than this could, especially if there is a high plasma cost/decent cooldown.

Uh? No, we still hold bases in alien lore, we may give it a turn for gameplay, but reverting a full xenomorph to a larva is plain stupid.

[Toroic]

Uh? No, we still hold bases in alien lore, we may give it a turn for gameplay, but reverting a full xenomorph to a larva is plain stupid.

The ideal solution would be to allow ghosts to enter SSD xenos freely, as that would solve the problem completely. But this would be a fairly simple change that hooks into the current system so that SSD larva aren't just a waste of a host.

Alien lore is largely incoherent. Of the stuff that is coherent, here are a handful of violations on xeno team:

1) Hivelord is not a canon caste

2) Queens become immobile when they lay eggs

3) Red and black xenos do not work togther, they violently attack each other

4) huggers don't live for very long outside of their eggs.

5) The entire weeds/plasma mechanic

6) Xeno caste is determined by the host/type of hugger (it isn't consistent). Hugged humans/creatures/yatuja produce dramatically different xenos.

So clearly, lore is put behind gameplay.

[ChickenShizNit8]

That would... First off, it breaks ANY lore that we have on Aliens...

And it makes no goddamn sense...

"Oh well it's asleep better revert it back to a tiny worm because lol I can revert millions of years worth of genetics in a matter of seconds"

Also, a Queen could just revert ANY fucking alien they want at ANY time. This is a terrible idea.

[Wickedtemp]

Change it from "Join as Larva" to "Join as Xeno" and allow observers to become an SSD xeno.

Problem solved.

[MrGabol100]

Change it from "Join as Larva" to "Join as Xeno" and allow observers to become an SSD xeno.

Problem solved.

[ChickenShizNit8]

THIS is a good idea ^^^

Allow dead players to join as SSD Xeno in general.

[Toroic]

THIS is a good idea ^^^

Allow dead players to join as SSD Xeno in general.

I would 100% support this.

[Azmodan412]

Same. I would support a Join as Xeno button.

[apophis775]

I would 100% support this.

This is already a thing, as a Larva.

[Azmodan412]

What if someone goes runner, or god forbid, a sentinel then goes SSD? It snowballs and soon half of the alien team is SSD.

[apophis775]

That's when staff steps in and places Ckeys in.

[Wickedtemp]

This is already a thing, as a Larva.

Broaden it to be available for all xenos, and that would fix the issue that this suggestion is attempting to solve.

[Arachnidnexus]

-1 for the reversion to larva. Not lore-friendly and would open up another can of worms about "The Queen is griefing me because I pissed her off! She turned me into a larva for no reason!" ahelps and such. An option to enter SSD aliens scaling with time for tier would be nice though. Something like 10 min for T1, 15 min for T2, 20 min for T3 and possibly even something like 30 min for Queen would be nice for when admins aren't online.

[Derpislav]

Just make it work on xenos with away_timer of 50 or more. I think everyone -1'ing this for other reasons that lore is missing the point. And the point is to recycle SSD aliens into larvae, because only they can be claimed by ghosts.

[Toroic]

This is already a thing, as a Larva.

It's pretty rare that a larva goes SSD. The only time it happens is when you have more hosts than you have people willing to play xeno, and a marine or xeno dies and respawns and then decided to D/C. I see it happen maybe once every few games.

I see regular xenos SSD all the time, and on the prison map where xenos don't have as many hosts, it seems hard to get their population much above 10.

That's when staff steps in and places Ckeys in.

I'd prefer if staff were not required to do this. Currently I've seen staff put ckeys into xenos, but the rules basically state it is at staff discretion, and who knows what other sorts of fires they're trying to put out at the time.

It also means that some staff will be more likely to fill SSD xenos, and others will not. I'd prefer if things were both less work for admins and more consistent. It'd also mean if admins aren't on, it impacts play less.

Just make it work on xenos with away_timer of 50 or more. I think everyone -1'ing this for other reasons that lore is missing the point. And the point is to recycle SSD aliens into larvae, because only they can be claimed by ghosts.

This is exactly the point. You can't put the power to recycle into the hands of individual xenos, because that would be a disaster. The queen is easy to keep track of/ban if she's being a shitter about it.

When I made this suggestion I assumed that allowing people to fill SSD xenos was considered and rejected, because it seemed the obvious solution. Having them revert to larva lets us use the already established code limiting people from joining as larva.

[apophis775]

Part of the advantage of staff filling SSD xenos themselves, is that we sometimes actually GET TO PLAY.

[Lostmixup]

How about instead of just allowing the queen to choose, also give the option to the xeno being turned into a larva. It could take like a minute to do it so that it couldn't be super abused, and if someone didn't want it they could just deny the request.

[apophis775]

Eh, I'd still rather not.

[UnknownMurder]

I do remember a certain suggestion that was denied. I can't find it in the resolved suggestions... It goes by something aliens being able to degenerate. Aliens can't degenerate.