Re-add the no construction in the hangar code.

[HalfdeadKiller]

Summary (a quick, 2-3 sentence summary): Pretty much re-add the no construction in the hangar code, because hangar defenses are literal suicide for aliens when they attack now.

Benefits (How this will benefit the server and game as a whole): Aliens won't get completely decimated when marines are behind tables and grilles on every side.

Details (Description of how you think this would work, the benefits, etc): Not much else to add here.

Implementation (Optional, if you have an idea how to implement it): Code.

[Azmodan412]

Marines aren't allowed to build in the Hanger until the FIRST alert goes out: Unknown Biological Specimen has accessed the panel. The fact that the Queen hit the panel while the Rasputin was in mid-flight to the Sulaco boned the xenos.

[HalfdeadKiller]

That doesn't stop the defenses from being nearly un-breakable.

[Azmodan412]

A good sign of marine defenses is being nearly unbreakable from a disadvantaged point such as the Rasputin. If the marines lost the Hanger, it would have been Xeno Major Victory so its the last stand for them.

[HalfdeadKiller]

The rasputin is actually rather easy to hold. There are seven-ish entry ways. Two are two tiles wide, the others are only one tile. If you place grilles and tables to make pushing out of those choke points, and constantly lay down fire through them, and lob grenades, you're probably going to keep the aliens in the shuttle.

Edit: Ya know what, maybe I'm kinda salty because I was an alien, we had like 15 or so aliens on the shuttle. Every single one died. We were either blown up, set on fire, or just had so much concentrated fire on us if we peeked out that we were killed almost instantly.

[Wickedtemp]

The point is, as far as I know the Queen never accessed the console. I never heard that blaring alarm go off, nor did I ever see the giant red text. What I DID see however, table forts in the hangar.

[Arachnidnexus]

+ 1 If the marines lose the hangar then they can still fortify medbay, briefing, evac pods area. Electric grille and girder construction does not take 4 minutes and it's stupidly easy to fortify the hangar with enough of them to make attacking the Sulaco suicide for aliens. It's enough time for MTs to drag emitters down and activate them to shoot into the dropship windows. In addition, the ability to make fortifications in the hangar makes it so that marines are even less likely to hold an actual FOB since they OOC know they can very effectively camp the shuttle when it arrives.

[HalfdeadKiller]

In that particular round, the queen did activate the console, the alarm was sounded. However the defenses in the Hangar were not able to be broken down due to the concentrated fire, grenades, and the tables and grilles.

[monkeysfist101]

I'd be fine with it being restricted to barriers an tables for the first three tiles surrounding the Cheyanne. Butting up electric grilles to the dropship is pretty BS. Beyond that, Sulaco defense should be fair game.

[Arachnidnexus]

Plasteel barricades block gas, hugger throws, and spit. Allowing them to be put right up to the dropship won't really solve the fortification problem. I was fine with the no building in the hangar situation since that meant marines actually had to fight for the hangar and fight for the Sulaco.

[Moonloon]

+1 In the time it takes for the Dropship to be prepared for an alien boarding, the marines can easily block every single entrance the dropship has. Grilles, plasteel barricades and such make it extremely difficult to even get out of the dropship and do damage, let alone take the hangar.

[WyattH]

-1 unless the same rule gets applied to xenos when they take the planet LZs

Honestly part of the problem is aliens fucking around on the planet too long when they've called down the shuttle, they should be all set and ready to go with their 'gear' of huggers and full plasma, just like marines are ready with their gear and a plan when they launch.

Personally I've seen xenos break through even heavy marine defenses when they arrive with plenty of huggers, a plan, their pheromones going, and work together. Just like marines can win over alien defenses when they do the same with supplies, plan, and teamwork.

If you're team alien and you push the marine LZ hard and they run away to sulaco to tend their wounds, don't give them time to all cycle through their medbay and get better, you gotta be ready to follow through with the push, just like marines have to follow through when they push a hive or xenos will move back further into caves and heal and rebuild.

The win rate being 50/50 still currently demonstrates itself that the hangar building being allowed is not an issue, just aliens being salty they're 50/50 with win/loss now instead of winning far more often than marines.

[SkyeAuroline]

-1 unless the same rule gets applied to xenos when they take the planet LZs

Seconded. Sick of seeing nerfs to marines recommended when xenos get the exact same thing, or better.

-1

[Anewbe]

-1 unless the same rule gets applied to xenos when they take the planet LZs
...

While I agree wholeheartedly on most of WyattH's points, and in most situations, I have to disagree on this particular one. Most Resin structures are fairly easy to remove with marine weapons, which makes me think that applying a No Build to Xenos wouldn't really make much difference. Marine barricades above wood are a pain to get rid of, they stop ranged attacks and movement, and are a pain to get rid of in melee, which is a huge advantage to marines.

On the topic of Hangar forts, I have to say I really don't like them. Not to the point where I'd give the idea of being unable to build them a full +1, but I'd really rather not load up the shuttle as an alien, fly up to the Sulaco, and be met with layers of barricades, grilles, and even emitters, plus the fifteen plus Marines/crew who didn't end up in the surface brawl. While it is possible for aliens to break through pretty much any defense, it's certainly not an easy thing to do.

In my mind, the ideal situation involving aliens on the Sulaco is an absolute, desperate last stand by whatever small number of humans managed to escape the slaughter on the ground. Right now, as an alien at least, it often feels like the goal of the round is to clear the surface, then get ready to die. I think the FOB should really be the marine's best line of defense, instead of the hangar. How to make that happen, I don't know, but I don't think outright disabling building.

If building is disabled in the hangar, I'd like to see some sort of preset barricades, that can be raised or lowered with a button somewhere near the hangar, so the amount of resistance can be more easily controlled or planned for.

[Lostmixup]

I personally think that the shuttle should have a two square radius around it on which it cannot be built upon, so that aliens may move around easier and marines can't just push up.

[Toroic]

-1 unless the same rule gets applied to xenos when they take the planet LZs

Honestly part of the problem is aliens fucking around on the planet too long when they've called down the shuttle, they should be all set and ready to go with their 'gear' of huggers and full plasma, just like marines are ready with their gear and a plan when they launch.

Personally I've seen xenos break through even heavy marine defenses when they arrive with plenty of huggers, a plan, their pheromones going, and work together. Just like marines can win over alien defenses when they do the same with supplies, plan, and teamwork.

If you're team alien and you push the marine LZ hard and they run away to sulaco to tend their wounds, don't give them time to all cycle through their medbay and get better, you gotta be ready to follow through with the push, just like marines have to follow through when they push a hive or xenos will move back further into caves and heal and rebuild.

The win rate being 50/50 still currently demonstrates itself that the hangar building being allowed is not an issue, just aliens being salty they're 50/50 with win/loss now instead of winning far more often than marines.

Wyatt, you're full of shit.

Xenos don't have anywhere close to the defensive building options that marines have (especially with electric grates) and marines can easily tear through several layers of walls.

Not to mention that marines get free use of the shuttle all game until xenos push them off-planet.

Marines retreat early all the time because their best shot at winning is a strong hanger defense. Marines are never forced into such a vulnerable position, and the physics behind having the dropship land with electic grates and girders already in front of the doors is nonsense.

Marines building around the dropship is just as much bullshit as xenos breaching. Breaching (for xenos only) has been prohibited, so xenos already gave something up.

The 50/50 win ratio was reported after the marine weapon damage buff, but before breaching was disallowed.

I personally think that the shuttle should have a two square radius around it on which it cannot be built upon, so that aliens may move around easier and marines can't just push up.

This makes the most sense. Make it the same on the planet, too. The ship landing would distroy anything too close to it.

[LordLoko]

I personally think that the shuttle should have a two square radius around it on which it cannot be built upon, so that aliens may move around easier and marines can't just push up.

This.

i'm ok with having some tables away from the shuttle ready to shuttle. But window tabes are full of BS.

[Azmodan412]

This.

i'm ok with having some tables away from the shuttle ready to shuttle. But window tabes are full of BS.

I agree. Window girders too.

[Wesmas]

I think the whole yellow lined off area should be no build, because you have a huge shuttle moving through the space to land. But gameplay wise, the 2 tile no build makes a great deal of sense.

[apophis775]

Denied, there are several ways to deal with this. If the marine defenses are too tough, then retreat back to the planet and wait. Hell, if you retreat right away and don't come back for awhile, most marines will get bored and want to attack anyway.

The thing is, if there are enough marines to hold the hanger from aliens getting off the shuttle, there are enough marines to assault the planet.