Remove Friendly Fire

[Youbar]

Summary (a quick, 2-3 sentence summary): Friendly fire is a major obstacle for the marines in terms of coordination, and due to your team mate's unpredictability, it's hard to gauge whether they'll put a bullet in your back. As an example, I was standing near a friendly when a hugger came between the two of us. One shot later, I'm critically wounded and there's a dead alien next to me.

Benefits (How this will benefit the server and game as a whole): Marines aren't immmediately knocked out of the round for a long time when a stray bullet hits them. The "feature" is so abusable that you could very well end the rounds of multiple marines and you won't even be PMed about griefing.

Details (Description of how you think this would work, the benefits, etc): There's two options. Friendly fire is disabled to the chest, head, and groin due to body armour and a helmet, or removed completely.

Implementation (Optional, if you have an idea how to implement it): Apply the same code where a bullet "bounces off" to a marine wearing armour.

[Azmodan412]

1. Duplicate.
2. IT WILL BE STAYING NO MATTER WHAT.
3. That is RNGesus talking with the bullet bouncing.

[coolsurf6]

Just want to say this could work maybe with AP rounds it will go straight though but maybe a chance with normal rounds, but trust me they will NOT remove FF!

Neutral

[Youbar]

1. Duplicate.
2. IT WILL BE STAYING NO MATTER WHAT.
3. That is RNGesus talking with the bullet bouncing.

1. Important issue
2. No, it won't. Bullets were nerfed in the pre-alpha by choosing a /tg/ based medical system.
3. RNGesus can be modified to a factor of 100%.

[MauroVega]

-1

Right,remove FF all the way...

[Azmodan412]

Correction, Youbar, the medical system is a mixup of Baycode and custom code.

[Wickedtemp]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

-1

Yeah. It's annoying as hell to get hit by a bullet that was fired off-screen, but that's kinda just a part of the game. If you have a LOT of trigger-happy people and give them all guns and then tell them to all shoot at bad guys, at some point they WILL shoot each other. Plus, marine armor isn't invincible to bullets. The armor they have could stop small arms, but probably not an assault rifle. Because of this:

What's the armor for? To protect from bullets.
What're the guns for? To shoot through the other guys armor.

Now, making the Chestplate and helmet a bit more resilient to bullets in specific? Sure. But putting on armor doesn't mean someone can empty a mag into you and you can walk away just fine. You WILL get bruised, it WILL hurt, and chances are a bullet WILL get through.

Also if you die, it's not like you're completely out of the round. You could join as a xeno :l

[Monoo]

[Youbar]

Friendly fire makes up for a tiny amount of casualties in real life - the number is so small, that there's a Wikipedia article dedicated to specific incidents of it.

There's also the bigger picture in regards to griefing. Just today, I was in a round where a marine reported that another individual had headshotted five different people, and they likely went unpunished for it. Subtly ruining multiple people's rounds is far too easy to accomplish.

[Azmodan412]

Gameplay > lore and gameplay > real life.

[Monoo]

Also also also

Also if you die, it's not like you're completely out of the round. You could join as a xeno :l

Not quite related, but important. Don't starve the other side, folks, contribute to your local xeno shelter today

[Youbar]

Gameplay > lore and gameplay > real life.

Precisely.
It hinders the enjoyment of the game for the marines. Aliens can shrug off bullets once they've penetrated deep inside, but the marines have to go onto the shuttle, and get themselves treated.
You either remove it altogether as a mechanic, nerf it in some manner, or apply the same logic to aliens. It'll be interesting to see how well they operate with a bunch of broken Xeno-cartridge and shells lodged in their torso.

People are defending it because "realism", but there's no realism to be had with a bunch of kindergarten children holding guns in the first place. Removing friendly fire helps you get past that important fact, and allows you to enjoy the game without the whole issue of guessing when you'll next have to to go surgery.

[Tristan63]

To be honest as much as this would rock in many ways it would make the aliens have harder times (Sometimes) and disallow any possible RP event to happen that involves human V human combat.
Friendly fire is the marines #1 killer, even more so than the aliens sometimes. And it also adds an aspect of realism to the game, bullets wouldn't just adjust around marines right?

-1

[Finefire984]

oh dang. Oh and -1 the reason is because friendly fire has been in colonial marines for ever and it won't be removed because of people accidentally shooting others.

[Youbar]

To be honest as much as this would rock in many ways it would make the aliens have harder times (Sometimes)

The aliens already have a high win:lose ratio.

and disallow any possible RP event to happen that involves human V human combat.

With the option of restricting damage to outside armour areas like it was last year, this can still happen assuming you're aiming for their limbs, and not head, groin or chest.

Friendly fire is the marines #1 killer, even more so than the aliens sometimes.

It shouldn't be. The idea of relying on somebody's friendly fire to level the playing field for the alien time is foolish.

And it also adds an aspect of realism to the game, bullets wouldn't just adjust around marines right?

See Wikipedia article with specific references to cases of friendly fire. It happened so rarely in large scale conflicts that you can hardly justify it happening in-game.

[Youbar]

oh dang. Oh and -1 the reason is because friendly fire has been in colonial marines for ever and it won't be removed because of people accidentally shooting others.

There was a point in Colonial Marines where friendly fire was restricted to limbs, and largely only happened due to bullets landing at randomised areas. For your second point, see ancedote of person headshotting five individuals intentionally and going unpunished.

[EXOTICISME]

Rather than removing FF how about removing bad player that stand right behind you and start shooting like crazy when he saw an alien ignoring the fact that YOU ARE IN FRONT OF HIM.

[Tristan63]

See Wikipedia article with specific references to cases of friendly fire. It happened so rarely in large scale conflicts that you can hardly justify it happening in-game.


Yes, because it was real life, this is 2d spessmen

[Wickedtemp]

See Wikipedia article with specific references to cases of friendly fire. It happened so rarely in large scale conflicts that you can hardly justify it happening in-game.

Yeah, pretty much. And want to know why?

That's real life. The military in REAL LIFE is given ACTUAL TRAINING. They ACTUALLY KNOW how to handle a gun... This is a low-med RP server, and a highly populated one at that. People WILL do stupid shit, people WILL make stupid mistakes, and this includes shooting the fuck out of you and then saying "Oh, sorry, mis-fire.", and chances are it might have actually been an accident. If EVERY SINGLE PLAYER went through military training and they followed everything they learned, chances are you'd see lower FF incidents.

Let's be completely honest here. When I think of the average Marine on CM, I think of a grey-tider with armor and a gun. Let's not pretend they actually care about friendly fire.

[Egorkor]

I salute you Stalin, for you've unleashed a shitstorm. Quite brave of you, but it's a lost cause.

[Youbar]

Yes, because it was real life, this is 2d spessmen

That's real life. The military in REAL LIFE is given ACTUAL TRAINING.

You nailed it on the head. Therefore, to avoid the fact that nobody receives rigorous training before playing, we remove friendly fire to compensate.

[Edgelord]

Friendly fire being removed would horribly unbalance the game. I think it's a neat mechanic, even if it is the source of 80% of my salt. Also, not sure if it really matters but the first marine death was actually caused by friendly fire in Aliens (literally).

I'm still arguing that AP rounds should be limited or removed, but for now this would create an extreme advantage for marines and, as Derpislav put it so eloquently in that other thread, marines shouldn't have the inherent advantage.

-1

[Wickedtemp]

You nailed it on the head. Therefore, to avoid the fact that nobody receives rigorous training before playing, we remove friendly fire to compensate.

"Marines are being stupid and shooting each other because they won't bother to check their fire. Please cater to the lowest denominator!"

Seriously, it REALLY isn't that hard to not shoot the person next to you. Is there a marine right behind the xeno you're aiming at? Might be best to find another angle of attack in case you were to miss, or go ahead and risk it. Learn to make those calls.

Sure, even if everyone was cautious about it, it'd still happen. Accidents happen. Sometimes a stray bullet comes in from off-screen and takes you out, and that sucks, but it's just a part of the game.

[Youbar]

Friendly fire being removed would horribly unbalance the game.

The "feature" doesn't have to entirely be removed, but rather you wouldn't receive any damage to areas where there is armour.

Seriously, it REALLY isn't that hard to not shoot the person next to you. Is there a marine right behind the xeno you're aiming at? Might be best to find another angle of attack in case you were to miss, or go ahead and risk it. Learn to make those calls.

For most people, it is. You can easily develop tunnel vision on an alien, and ignore marines moving through your line of fire. I think the major thing you're minsinterpreting is that people actually care about shooting other players. They're there to kill Xenoes, and if somebody gets in the way, there aren't any repercussions. A quick "sorry" is enough, and you don't have to worry about being punished. There is virtually no incentive not to shoot.

This issue becomes especially troubling when marines only get one life, and two rifle shots can end them easily. In FPS games, you can come back the next round, or on the next wave, no problem, but it works very differently here, and that needs to be recognised.

The core of the gameplay is centered around Xeno vs Marine combat, and friendly fire shouldn't be a major part of that equation.

[Finefire984]

Rather than removing FF how about removing bad player that stand right behind you and start shooting like crazy when he saw an alien ignoring the fact that YOU ARE IN FRONT OF HIM.

hahaha too true