Xeno benefits for marine retreats

[Jroinc1]

Summary (a quick, 2-3 sentence summary):If there are no living, uninfected marines on the planet's surface for 5 minutes, monkeys start spawning in at random positions at a rate of one per minute.

Benefits (How this will benefit the server and game as a whole): Marine retreats currently have no downside to the marines. They head to the sulaco, regroup, get their members cloned and healed, and pronto, there are AGAIN 60 marines. The xenos are stuck with whatever number they have, with no way to gain more. This is designed as a way to mess with marines who decide to just up and abandon the planet, knowing that they can hold the hangar.

Details (Description of how you think this would work, the benefits, etc):Warn marines after 5 minutes that "Monkeys are wandering in from other parts of the planet!", use random spawns and spawn one in every minute till the marines land again. Aliens still have to find and infect, then wait for them to burst... but now there's a reason to NOT do this:

Command Announcement


All marines, retreat from Lazarus. We're staying on Sulaco. Medical, treat the wounded coming up the pod.

Implementation (Optional, if you have an idea how to implement it):Put some random spawns in, alternately do it manually when you give the MOTHER updates about 60+ active marines, 5/6 xenos...

[Sarah_U.]

I was about to -1, but realised you'd be giving 1 xeno a minute + birth time... Is okay-ish, but would horribly delay the round under certain circumstances.
NEUTRAL

[Rob606]

This downtime allows for Xenos to Tier up, set up defences on planet and get ready for an assault if possible.

The only reason marines retreat is because they've taken so many casualties - those casualties are hosts to burgeon the xeno numbers up.

So I'd disagree - marines do have a major downside - they give the aliens breathing room and time for their captured fallen to burst.

[Takov]

I'm gonna say no, Xenos win in the hangar more often than not from what I've seen, and even when they don't it's usually a pretty fucking brutal fight.
And one monkey a minute? That'll just cause lag given how long rounds can go on for, not to mention xenos would just camp on the planet and let themselves get up to fifty or so ayys before zerg rushing the Sulaco, this time with a guarantee of more ayys than there are marines.
-1

[Whistle]

With the current 100+ numbers that come on as marines and can continue to increase as the round continues +1

The last week or two, marines numbers have generally been ridiculously high by retreat time.
40 to 10.

[Jroinc1]

I'm gonna say no, Xenos win in the hangar more often than not from what I've seen, and even when they don't it's usually a pretty fucking brutal fight.
And one monkey a minute? That'll just cause lag given how long rounds can go on for, not to mention xenos would just camp on the planet and let themselves get up to fifty or so ayys before zerg rushing the Sulaco, this time with a guarantee of more ayys than there are marines.
-1

The more ayys then marines? That's how it's SUPPOSED to be. As for the xenos camping on the planet... that's already what the MARINES are doing on the ship, with cloning to revive dead, medical to fix wounded, and fresh spawn-ins from the cryo area. As for causing lag... cap it at a set number? How about only spawn a monkey if there's a ghost with xeno preference?

[SovietKitty]

-1

This just encourages an already winning side to avoid taking a risk and attacking the Sulaco, to instead sit down and camp the LZ's well they stockpile more lives.

[Joe4444]

-1 as kitty said,no one wants to beat off a attack to THEN have to face the same shit like 10 or so minutes later

[Varnock]

I find the dichotomy here rather funny.

So, let's ask a few questions here real fast and see if I can't get my point across.

How often does the xeno force capture every monkey? Pretty much never in my experience. In fact, the chances of them even noticing a monkey spawned in on of the random locations they do so is actually pretty slim. Depending on how long the round has been going on they're probably way more focused on whatever the FOB or forward hive is.

As for xenos winning in the hangar, sure, there chances are higher now with building disabled, but holy shit man, when it's still fucking 6 to 1 ratio when marines retreat there isn't much chance either way. Not like it won't stop 30+ marines from latejoining throughout the round too.

As a final note: Marines are almost always winning still. The xeno rebalance helped at first, but with the massive influx of players summer brings it's just not enough again. The marines can just zerg the hive and come out fine, all due to their insane numbers advantage.

So yeah, +1. A single monkey a minute in a random spot of the map feels balanced, and the OOC knowledge that shit is spawning would promote action rather than turtling on the marine side, which is pretty much all they do anymore.

[jalen earl]

I like it seeing as almost every round the xeno assault is usually met by 30+marines and 4 sentrys

[Carprillo]

+1, honestly. Varnock basically hit it home.

[ShortTemperedLeprechaun]

Neutral. I like the idea, but we're forgetting that theres a thirty minute downtime of no marines on the ground at least at round start. I agree, we need a way to stop marine turteling, but this may not be it.

[jalen earl]

Neutral. I like the idea, but we're forgetting that theres a thirty minute downtime of no marines on the ground at least at round start. I agree, we need a way to stop marine turteling, but this may not be it.

It comes down to CO's getting them to leave the FOB. so far there is usually only 1 major push then 1 minor followed by 2 hours of turtleing. We had a round yesterday where xenos were really good at roundstart and everyone got every last furry within the first 40 minutes. Marines put in 1 push, didnt cross the river then turtled for hours in nexus while we slowly lost numbers trying to break them. They ended up winning out from attrition but still had 40 marines alive at the end.
Commanders need to grow some balls and counterattack

[NoShamNoWow]

They already pushed the marines back away from the planet, there is your benefit.

[ShortTemperedLeprechaun]

It comes down to CO's getting them to leave the FOB. so far there is usually only 1 major push then 1 minor followed by 2 hours of turtleing. We had a round yesterday where xenos were really good at roundstart and everyone got every last furry within the first 40 minutes. Marines put in 1 push, didnt cross the river then turtled for hours in nexus while we slowly lost numbers trying to break them. They ended up winning out from attrition but still had 40 marines alive at the end.
Commanders need to grow some balls and counterattack

I've noticed the go-to is often turtle, and then just whittle down the xenos that try to continue the round and not make it a turtle fest.

[Surrealistik]

+1 in the event the Marines get new toys to help them deal with massed T3s in a labyrinth meatgrinder deathtrap of sticky floors, walls and doors.

-1 Otherwise.

So, probably -1.

[Jroinc1]

They already pushed the marines back away from the planet, there is your benefit.

But this gets them nothing. No new hosts. Time to sit around, while the marines respawn (in cloning), and get all of the latejoins.

[Surrealistik]

The bottom line is that, aside from perfectly coordinated GOTTAGOFAST rushes, marines are essentially forced to play defensively and counterattack, because they have few good tools for pushing the aliens when they have massed T3s and a strong defensive set up, particularly when their hive is in an area protected from Orbitals. Further, unlike Aliens (who never receive lasting injuries and regenerate quickly in weeds spammed all over the place) marines have no endurance for protracted sieges due to accumulation of injuries that require surgery.

Gifting the aliens with more hosts when marines are playing in the only way that allows them to win without giving the marines anything in return to diversify their playstyle and go on the offensive is ridiculous.

[outordinary]

I try to base everything from Apop's vision of the game, which is that marines should be spending just about all of their time on the planet fighting the xeno force. They should not have to go back to the sulaco unless there is like 15 left. That number isn't exact, but marines should be decimated. Stay on the planet and do medevac for those fallen. I'm all for a very slight 1 monkey per minute spawn, makes you want to MEDEVAC instead of full evac. Push those robusted rines on the ship and send it up, but get your candy ass back in the fight. +1

[Wickedtemp]

For everybody saying "B-but the lack of marine presence on the planet IS a xeno benefit!"... Not really. The xenos likely lost several players in the assault to push the marines back, numbers they can't exactly get back unless they loiter on the planet for half an hour after the marine retreat. Meanwhile, the marines get to sit on the Sulaco with their thumbs up their asses because they have the OOC knowledge that the Xenos will have to eventually invade. There's definitely an IC reason for marines to try to retake the planet. But OOCly, there isn't one. The objective is for one side to wipe out the other, and everybody knows it's easier to accomplish that as a marine when you plant barricaded sentries everywhere and offer support fire.

Marines benefit from the retreat. They get healed, resupplied, and they get to fight on the Sulaco with the help of more sentries. Xenos, on the other hand, get the short end of the stick because now they'll be forced to board a ship full of 25+ fully healthy and armed marines, due to the fact that marines consistently fall back at the earliest possible moment, along with any latejoiners and marines who may have actually stayed on the Sulaco the whole time. There are NO downsides to a marine retreat, on the marine side. I believe this one is definitely warranted.

+1

[Callabaddie]

"Wah, wah, I don't want to fight where the enemy has the advantage."

"Wah, wah, I want the enemy to be forced to fight where they have a disadvantage."

: ^ )

Get good.

[forwardslashN]

Xenos now have an evolution system that makes them exponentially stronger regardless of tier. Going with denied for now.