Hugger Nerf. (Based on what people said on discord)

[coolsurf6]

Summary (a quick, 2-3 sentence summary):

So we all know that huggers are a pain in the ass to deal with as a marine? Well i heard a pretty good way of nerfing by Chaznoodles. Here me out.

Instead of hunters, ravagers etc just running up to a marine to break their helmet and decap them, Only allow huggers to attack marines when they are on the ground. So instead you have to go up to a marine and either tackle them or put them in pain crit to apply a hugger. But with carriers if you throw it at a marine and it lands next to them or hits them it applies automatically.

Benefits (How this will benefit the server and game as a whole):
This will hopefully relieve much of the communities salt and rage that huggers have been creating. This will allow the aliens to instead have to fight carefully as they would need to get up close and attempt to tackle them so the marine either shoots them or gets out of there. It will also stop the hugger decap or nerf it.

Details (Description of how you think this would work, the benefits, etc):
Huggers can only be attached once the marine has been tackled and is on the ground. It allows the marine to get out as before the marine gets his helmet removed and a ravager just click once or twice and pop his heads gone. This will allow the marine some time since tackling is rngish so when they notice the alien is trying to take them down they might fall back or just burst fire in its face.

Implementation (Optional, if you have an idea how to implement it):
Add a variable so when the marine is knocked down the hugger can then be attached.

Credits go to Chaznoodles for mentioning this on discord

[Derpislav]

I've been suggesting this for literally half a year, of course it's +1.

[ExGame]

Out of all the complex AF ideas this simple idea never came into my mind, how?!
+1.

[TeDGamer]

+1, Huggers definitely need a few nerfs. NPCs generally react much faster than we can.

[Disco Dalek]

+1
It's definitely a step in the right direction.

[KingKire]

hmm i would like to +1, but i need to think a little more on what it would mean for aliens

[Wickedtemp]

-1 Not when xeno tackle sucks so much. And attempting to slash a marine into pain crit could easily unintentionally kill them if done by higher tiers.

There's a post made a lil while back about disabling xenos ability to carry huggers outside of carriers and maybe the Queen, suggesting that xenos be given a pain-inducing, non-lethal disarm attack that could be used to incapacitate the marine or a while as a stun, allowing them to be taken to the hive. I'd support that suggestion, which is why I'm not supporting this one. Simply put, theirs is better.

[TeDGamer]

-1 Not when xeno tackle sucks so much. And attempting to slash a marine into pain crit could easily unintentionally kill them if done by higher tiers.

There's a post made a lil while back about disabling xenos ability to carry huggers outside of carriers and maybe the Queen, suggesting that xenos be given a pain-inducing, non-lethal disarm attack that could be used to incapacitate the marine or a while as a stun, allowing them to be taken to the hive. I'd support that suggestion, which is why I'm not supporting this one. Simply put, theirs is better.

Thing is that usually at this point, aliens do decap them. Have you seen what has been happening in recent rounds where aliens surround marines?

If they can kill them, why infect them.

[Boltersam]

+1. Hugger-based combat severely detracts from gameplay, and this will at least decrease how dependent Xenos are on them.

[Logi99]

I don't know how this will work. Were in the greytide era atm. PEople can accidentaly kill their host.

[ExGame]

I don't know how this will work. Were in the greytide era atm. PEople can accidentaly kill their host.

If you "accidentally" kill a host its so your own fault.

[Nyvrem]

But would you still be able to use the age-old runner tactic of jumping right in front of a marine, dropping a hugger and then jumping off?

[forwardslashN]

This is a pretty good idea while we still have hugger carrying. Neutral though, since it would change the helmet break dynamic by a lot; tackling marines in CQC is pretty hard as it is unless they are injured or whatever.

[Surrealistik]

+1. Was always one of the biggest advocates of this change. That said the aliens would need to see buffs in other areas to compensate.

I am also of the opinion that all alien stuns except for the Queen scream, should be Halloss/pain crit based.

[Wickedtemp]

This is a pretty good idea while we still have hugger carrying. Neutral though, since it would change the helmet break dynamic by a lot; tackling marines in CQC is pretty hard as it is unless they are injured or whatever.

Tackling marines in combat is pretty much impossible. Xeno disarm is terribly ineffective, it takes several xenos to keep a single, lone marine down. Attempting this on a squad is pretty much suicide. You'll run in, attempt to disarm two or three times because that's all you'll have time for, one or two of those might not even land because the marine is backpedaling and shooting, and then you'll run away or get killed. Or, you'll be heavily reliant on the 1-3 second long stun that the pounce now gives, or the 1-5 second stun neurotoxin gives (pretty sure it's dependent on the xeno caste, no clue). For that to work, you'd need xenos hidden right by the marines, ready to strike. Normally, they wouldn't have an opening in their defenses that isn't covered either by a table, metal barricade, or a sentry. Or mines. So good luck doing that.

If a suggestion is made that would force xenos to rely on their disarm-intent tackle -which sucks because it has like a one in ten success rate from personal experience- then you'll need to make their disarm-intent suck less.

[Surrealistik]

I'd only approve of this if Disarm strikes can inflict pain crit per my take on the suggestion here: http://colonial-marines.com/viewtopic.php?f=59&t=7572

[Fourty2]

-1000. This would make carriers less than worthless.

[Steelpoint]

A nerf to hugger usage and a buff to haloloss/pain damage on disarm hits would actually be a buff to carriers.

Mainly because there would be far less helmets on the field thus it would take longer to get a new helmet

[Boltersam]

-1000. This would make carriers less than worthless.

Look, son! Somebody didn't read the suggestion fully!

[Fourty2]

Look, son! Somebody didn't read the suggestion fully!

I did actually. A main part of playing a super effective carrier is Area of Denial with huggers, to ensure capture of infected marines, and slowing marine advances. This suggestion would imply that huggers don't jump up and attack marines walking by them.

[Fourty2]

A nerf to hugger usage and a buff to haloloss/pain damage on disarm hits would actually be a buff to carriers.

Mainly because there would be far less helmets on the field thus it would take longer to get a new helmet

Very soon there will be helmet repair paste, which will make this point moot.

[Steelpoint]

If helmet repair paste is added it'll likely be in the form of something RnD has to produce, which still needs to be shipped to the front line.

Unless helmets are made very rare then its still a moot point, outside of Donator, B18 and SL helmets your still better off getting a new helmet from the locker room.

My point stands.

[northcote4]

But with carriers if you throw it at a marine and it lands next to them or hits them it applies automatically.

This suggestion would imply that huggers don't jump up and attack marines walking by them.

Not what was suggested.

Also +1, fits the lore as displayed in the AvP games (2010, specifically, where you hold someone down while a facehugger latches on).

Though I do hope it doesn't affect the way that huggers leap from eggs.

[vtipoman]

Or just remove the stun effect.
The aliens would have to tackle the marine and secure him, making him unable to remove the facehugger himself.
...
I never saw any of the movies though, did the facehuggers stun their prey?

[northcote4]

the movies though, did the facehuggers stun their prey?

Yes, they immediately incapacitate for several hours. And as an extra kick in the balls, they can't be removed without killing the host.