MT's and CE's. What're they here for?

[Jroinc1]

So. A short time ago, I joined as a MT, and set up the engine, added extra coolant, then safed it by removing the emitter and putting a glass pane in front of the core eject switch. I then set atmos on BOTH decks, and even set the solar SMES's. While I was doing this, the CE and other MT's were fighting with MP's, which continued for a good chunk of the round.
So, I decided to make a space station.
I take the glass from engineering, autolathe pistols for metal, 2 air pumps, one scrubber, assorted pipes and connectors, a bedsheet, 3 O2 tanks and a N2 tank, the EAT bar and Hot Drinks vendor from the cafeteria, the arcade board, a space suit and jetpack, two fluorescent bulbs, a battery, a power control board, a pac-man generator, a plasma sheet stack, 5 wood planks, and like 5 anti-breach kits which're never used because admins don't ALLOW us to deal with breaches... and build a KICKASS space station.
It's not just a box, it's got a cool double-layered wall, a pressurized interior which can be filled from the outside via connectors, a CO2 scrubbing system that's JUST FOR LOOKS (but totally works), a small kitchen, it's own power supply and fluorescent lighting, an arcade machine, a sleeping nook, and generally looks AWESOME.

So I adminhelp to show it off before heading back to the Sulaco. The responding staff member thought it was neat... but then noted me for NOT PLAYING MY ROLE... and I'm pretty sure tried to make it unlivable by dropping a 85,000 w load on the APC, independent of whether or not the APC was on.

THIS I don't understand, and I'm PISSED at. If it was me round-delaying in a spacefort, I'd understand, but I wasn't and wouldn't do that. If I was neglecting my duties, I'd understand, but I wasn't, and in fact, I was the only MT who really did his job that round. If I was stealing important materials, I'd understand, but I listed pretty much everything there, and it's ALL replaceable easily, and most's not even USED commonly. If I was affecting other peoples rounds, I'd understand, but I wasn't interacting negatively, and there WERE no MT requests after roundstart.

I thought MT's were allowed to construct and use tools they had trained with to build things, but apparently I was wrong.

SO. What IS a MT's job, ruleswise? As far as I'm aware, 3 main things. Start the engine, Fix breaches, Maintain tcomms.
Starting the engine takes 2-3 minutes BY YOURSELF. That's not hyperbole, the longest part is filling the tanks.
Fixing breaches is not allowed. Staff can and do always reach it before we can, and plop an adminium wall in the breach, leaving us to sit on our thumbs.
NO ONE ELSE APPEARS TO KNOW TCOMMS. I can go in and dismantle 2/3rd of the machines, WITHOUT losing any functionality, streamlining the net, AND without losing comms for even an instant, but I'll probably get reflexively banned for daring to touch the spooky magic of comms.

So. 3 jobs. 2-3 min. Once the ENGINEBO... MT finishes, then what? Are we just decorative icing, not allowed to do anything?

What are suggestions for things for MT's to do, ON THE SHIP, that take up time, benefit the marine team, and are SOMEHOW related to engineering?

[YungCuz]

Normally for me i just sit around in engineering messing with stuff i found until someone needs me to fix something.

[NoahKirchner]

When I play CE, I tinker the fuck out of everything. Build knife cannons, dress up like batman with an Ushanka and a stunprod.. Build more knife cannons. (I really like knife cannons) and I have a ton of ideas floating around in me brain that I'll do once Ice Map comes back so I can have more time to do stuff, like a fallback cooling for the supermatter incase of emergencies. If you get can noted for tinkering and making cool shit, and that's what I think the CE is about. If all you do every round is set up the engine then build a bar, stuff gets boring, so why not set up the engines then do something like make a disposals systems for dead bodies to the cloner like I watched another mt do? CE's are supposed to add flavour to the round, add cool new inventions and stuff, and getting noted for doing that seems really really really super mega cheesy. As long as everything else was set up, I think MT's and CE's job is to tinker with shit and make life cooler or better for everyone. Sorry if that was spread about, I'm tired and its late :P.

[slc97]

I actually thought what you built was really cool, unfortunately, from the rules side of things, MTs are supposed to be maintaining the Sulaco rather than building off ship.

Now you can go down to the planet and build at the FOB after it's been set up.

[Casany]

So, what I'm getting from this is that you wasted materials. Unless the marines are winning, and REALLY winning I would never do this. Metal may be easy to order but if you order two crates of metal to replace the metal you used, you can't order a sentry to reinforce the ground. I dont care if it's cool or nice, unless it's being used to serve a purpose (I.E a cloning pipe, research containment, ETC) I don't like it nor am I mad you get in trouble. That's my input on the situation. As for what MTs and CEs are used for, it's simple. Set the engine up and make the ship much more productive. Hell, go ground to help with the FOB if you want. Just don't do something useless like that

[Jroinc1]

I actually thought what you built was really cool, unfortunately, from the rules side of things, MTs are supposed to be maintaining the Sulaco rather than building off ship.

Now you can go down to the planet and build at the FOB after it's been set up.

Okay. What else SHOULD I have maintained? Th engine? Done. Breaches? None. Tcomms? You really don't WANT me to mess with that.

From the RULES side of things, didn't break any of the precursor rules, didn't break any of the 15 general (unless you count legit use of the airlock as breaching...), the only thing I think you're going for is the DON'T LEAVE THE SULACO angle. I'm a MT. Local space is part of my duties. That's why I'm trained in spacesuit use and construction... I think. Wiki page for MT is blank besides "Set engine, repair damage"... yeah. So if I can't do that, and combat engi's are SUPPOSED to do planetside engi (Do a decent job IMO), and I miss out on the "One MT at most" slot, what do the others do?

[Jroinc1]

So, what I'm getting from this is that you wasted materials.

WRONG
I got a handful of pistols. Each pistol fills an autolathe fully. You can get 20 metal sheets per pistol. I thought it's a little cheap when a RO showed it to me yesterday... but I guess it's legit...
EVERYTHING I used, except the pistols, was either easily replaceable (as in 10-packs), or not ever used by marines (as in the food vendor. No one ever takes it).

[Warnipple]

We're medium RP, you have to know that building off of the ship is not really RP. Its a warship designed to fly around and its probably orbiting the planet. You can't just stick a plank on the side of it and expect it to work. Its not RP, its wasting resources.

From what you've wrote it seems you've done a good job as a MT. MT's are glorified janitors that maintain the engine though. You can get permission from the Commander/Chief Engineer to set up cameras on the planet. While there you can help build the FOB as well. You may be called to various parts of the ship to fix things but don't expect that to happen often. Thats about all that MTs do.

Perhaps in the future, there may be additional duties added for MTs/CE.

[Jroinc1]

It wasn't a "Plank", but... yeah. I guess I'm not playing MT for a while if creativity is verboten. Someone else can deal with the SM delaminations and engine room that's OPEN TO SPACE, then.
EDIT- I still will deal with them as other roles if NO ONE knows how to fix it IC, but I'll be going MD for a while.

[NoahKirchner]

It wasn't a "Plank", but... yeah. I guess I'm not playing MT for a while if creativity is verboten. Someone else can deal with the SM delaminations and engine room that's OPEN TO SPACE, then.
EDIT- I still will deal with them as other roles if NO ONE knows how to fix it IC, but I'll be going MD for a while.

I might have to agree with you, but I'll see how the next few days ago. Unless CE's can make adjustments to the ship it might be time to hang up the belt.

[Feweh]

You guys realize that Sulaco is in orbit and a spaceship right....
You can't really build off of a spaceship that requires certain dynamics and integrity.

[NoahKirchner]

You guys realize that Sulaco is in orbit and a spaceship right....
You can't really build off of a spaceship that requires certain dynamics and integrity.

Yeah, realism wise I understand why it's put in place, but some of the best experiences I've had in ss13 in general were building extra rooms into the Sulaco to achieve different functions, and so far nobody's messaged me about it being wrong. Gameplay wise it's a lot of fun and I feel like it should be allowed for that reason (unless it's being abused like with death forts). One of those realism for gameplay sacrafices, like with the xenos not being massively op and marines all somehow knowing that they'll need SADARS to fight something on a planet that's just had a blackout as far as the scanners can tell etc. As long as it's not hurting anybody what's the problem with it really besides realism?

[Feweh]

Yeah, realism wise I understand why it's put in place, but some of the best experiences I've had in ss13 in general were building extra rooms into the Sulaco to achieve different functions, and so far nobody's messaged me about it being wrong. Gameplay wise it's a lot of fun and I feel like it should be allowed for that reason (unless it's being abused like with death forts). One of those realism for gameplay sacrafices, like with the xenos not being massively op and marines all somehow knowing that they'll need SADARS to fight something on a planet that's just had a blackout as far as the scanners can tell etc. As long as it's not hurting anybody what's the problem with it really besides realism?

Also a matter of balance as well, as most of these structures are xeno proof or so out of the way that they're basically pointless.
With that, comes the sacrifice of resources to complete them.

[Jdobbin49]

I generally just like making briefing into a lounge room with a snazzy dance floor

[NoahKirchner]

I generally just like making briefing into a lounge room with a snazzy dance floor :D

That got me raged at, demoted, and almost beat to death one round.

[Jroinc1]

Also a matter of balance as well, as most of these structures are xeno proof or so out of the way that they're basically pointless.
With that, comes the sacrifice of resources to complete them.

As for not really building off a spaceship... our ship's not in an actual orbit and this is a 2d spessman game. I can into orbital mechanics too, I've played KSP, and Orbiter before it, and if we're in an ACTUAL orbit, and I build a structure in the SAME orbit, but displaced along the orbit radially it'll maintain the same relative distance unless our ship moves.

As for pointless... not to me. Beats staring at a wall for 1.5-2 hrs, or cryo-ing or using scripts to NURBLE tcomms/make an autoDJ with the top songs of the 80's... hold that thought i found my next challenge

As for xeno-proof, I fully agree, and COOPERATE to avoid extending the round, by standing on a space tile, or re-boarding the Sulaco.

As for sacrifice of resources... As I said before, NO VALUABLE resources were used. I listed ALL the things I brought, and I made the metal sheets myself by autolathing left-over weapons for the metal. I was VERY careful to not take anything usable surface-side.

[NoahKirchner]

Also a matter of balance as well, as most of these structures are xeno proof or so out of the way that they're basically pointless.
With that, comes the sacrifice of resources to complete them.

I've made researchers holding pens, I've watched people make extra cloning rooms, and I've been toying around the idea of a backup supercoolant injector/SM gas draining room for emergencies, all useful things.

[Jroinc1]

viewtopic.php?f=94&t=9008
i listed what we're here for.

[moff_lockwood]

Grab a bucket and mop the ship, MT. Cleaning up trash is part of the job description. MT's are custodians with engineering degrees from an online university. The CE should grab a bucket and a proximity sensor, then start assembling Mop-E the lovable robot bucket, in between checking the supermatter temperature and yelling at the marines stealing all his metal and pissing on his lawn. The CE should also go set the time displays when incompetent bridge staff still haven't set them 45 minutes into the round. For some reason you can set the displays to everything except the time from the CE's pda, so you have to walk all the way to the bridge for it.